Alternatives for VideoReDo TV Suite with Test Results

[codemaster]

The issue is trying to edit VFR files in an editor that was not built for editing VFR files. Even the few editors that were built for VFR cannot keep audio in sync precisely enough, because sometimes the edited audio drifts by up to 200 ms. Making the cuts between two words move on top of the previous or next word, at rendering time. A problem that can be solved only by transcoding the VFR lossy file to a large CFR lossless intermediate file.

[Marayong]

I edited the 2160p video with VRD with several interior cuts. No issues playing, cutting or saving.

[Bridgy]

I upped the resolution and it still worked fine with VRD:


[Attachment 84913 - Click to enlarge]

Sorry but that is 4k AVC H264, once again, mine are 4k/60p HEVC h265, totally different.

S21 4k/60p HEVC files = will import to VRD, but Cutting segments is very slow and laggy, BUT VRD will export the cut file, and it plays perfectly, but if i import that same file, or an uncut file from the S21 to add a title, they will not export, both fail.

S24 Ultra 4k/60p HEVC files = this will import to VRD, cutting segments can be done but again it is very laggy on the timeline, and VRD will Smart Render to a single merged file, and it plays perfect, BUT if i import that back into VRD to add a title it Fails, as per the screenshot below, which i posted earlier.


[Attachment 84914 - Click to enlarge]

Please Note: I can do all of the above including Titles with S21 and S24 files recorded in 1080 or 4k/60p AVC h264

The thing that i still don't get is that if i import my S21 and S24 4k/60p HEVC files into LosslessCut and Cut, Smart Render, and export them, i can then import those LosslessCut exports into VRD for adding Titles, VRD will Export them perfectly, and they play back flawlessly as well.

[Bridgy]

The issue is trying to edit VFR files in an editor that was not built for editing VFR files. Even the few editors that were built for VFR cannot keep audio in sync precisely enough, because sometimes the edited audio drifts by up to 200 ms. Making the cuts between two words move on top of the previous or next word, at rendering time. A problem that can be solved only by transcoding the VFR lossy file to a large CFR lossless intermediate file.

I am not going to weigh into this too much as i am not qualified to do so, all i can say is that i have been putting VFR files thru VRD for cutting and adding titles for years, and exporting to other formats too, and up until i started recording video in 4k HEVC format, i have never ever had any issues with anything that i have tried to do, this issue that i am dealing with has always been about VRD not completing it's HEVC support for Cutting, Smart Rendering, and adding Titles to 4k HEVC files, and i know this because i was Beta tester for Dan Rosen for several years before he passed away.

1080/60p and 4k/60p AVC (VFR) files from all the cameras i have recorded on do everything flawlessly.

This is why i still need to use LosslessCut to do my Cuts and Smart Rendering, and only use VRD to add Titles when or if needed.

Handbrake will be my go to Software for exporting to other formats, thanks to you, and i absolutely appreciate your patience with that.

I think that my time for looking at alternative tools for VRD has turned a full circle by now, and i can confidently say from my point of view, there is no 1 single basic editing tool that can replace VRD for my particular needs.

LosslessCut, VRD, and Handbrake is what i will be using moving forward, 3 tools rather than one, BUT if i ever lost use of my VRD Pro due to activation failure of some sort (Dans family not maintaining the server as an example) then i would need to find a replacement for Titles.

Maybe if i can get my head around CapCut (it looks good) i just might use that too, but as yet, their website is far too busy and complex for me to wade thru to find out exactly what it can and can't do.

I can't find anything relating to Smart Cutting and Smart Rendering a file back to it's original, nor can i find anything pertaining to it being able to import a file like mine, and just export to another format.

I really feel like i am inside a maze of glitz and glitter, but maybe that is intentional, designed to catch your eye, but i prefer simple and basic.

[Marayong]

Found the x265/HEVC setting, recorded a 20s video, imported it into VRD (non pro) and it played without glitches or stuttering. Did a few internal cuts and one terminal and saved. It still used intelligent encoding but there were a noticeable pauses when it reached the cuts before it moved on. The cut video played smoothly with no glitches in potplayer, apart from the jumps around the cuts since I'd cut out random chunks of video.

[Attachment 84943 - Click to enlarge]
[Attachment 84944 - Click to enlarge]

First is the unedited video, 2nd the edited one.

Oh, and the A54 doesn't support 60 fps in 4K - one of the cut backs so they can sell the A54 at 1/3rd the price of the equivalent S series.

[Marayong]

I have previously tried unsuccessfully to edit your videos, so we know both the pro & non-pro versions have limitations with x265/4K. The obvious difference is either the length of the video (I did just a 20s video, yours were minutes long) or that yours was 60fps whilst mine is 30fps. Either way, the input video was x265 and it was saved as the same, so VRD non-pro clearly has some x265 support, even to the point that intelligent encoding works with x265 given it zipped along in the save, only slowing down at the edits when it had to do some encoding.

And yeah, following your research, I'd also come to the conclusion there ain't no alternative to VRD ... unless one wants to shell out $1,000s and purchase high end commercial software (the stuff hollywood etc use).

A quick look online and the industry standard is Adobe Premier Pro, which costs about A$50/month for a since pc licence, according to one website.

This site: https://www.filmsupply.com/articles/professional-film-editing-programs/

Also lists some other industry editors.

Interestingly, there is one listed that comes in two versions: DaVinci Resolve and DaVinci Resolve Studio. The former is free - both to download and use. DaVinci Resolve was used to do the editing on Avatar, among other movies.

I don't know just what DaVinci Resolve does, but might be worth a look. It's link:
https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/products/davinciresolve

Ahh, blackmagic .. I've come across them before, when I was looking for a high end slide scanner & image editor. I ended up going with a competitor, Plusteck, which uses Silverfast editing software. Same price and specs, the difference was product availability. The blackmagic unit would have to be imported from the US, whilst Plusteck had stock in Melbourne.

[codemaster]

The root cause of the issues are editors with partial (not full) HEVC support, and partial (not full) VFR support, like VideoReDo. The only way to solve it is to switch to an editor that has full (not partial) support for both HEVC and VFR. TMPGEnc MPEG Smart Renderer 6 is one such editor.

[Bridgy]

Yeah, that might be about right, VRD does have HEVC support for some stuff, but it was just not completed, there were still bugs in the development side of it, and Dan knew this, and one bug was that it caused seeking and playback lag with certain HEVC files (this is my issue) but in my case, if i persist with the lag, my 4k/60p HEVC files will Smart Render, and i can export to HEVC from other formats too, the biggest issue with VRD and HEVC is the crashing when trying to add a title to my S21 and S24 HEVC files.

This is why i keep scratching my head as to why VRD will not do titles on my cut or uncut 4k/60p HEVC files, yet it works perfectly with my 4k/60p HEVC files that are cut (on keyframes) and Smart Rendered using LosslessCut.

Obviously LosslessCut does something to the file that makes my VRD happy to play with, i just wish i knew why.

As for TMPGEnc Smart Render 6, i tried it in trial mode for a few weeks and i could only find it able to do Overlay Titles onto the video frames, which i really don't like doing because they can be very difficult to read depending on what text color you select against your background frames, VRD offers a choice of overlaying the Title on the video itself, or creating text based frames that are created separately before the video starts, but if i had to do overlay titles i would really have no choice.

I am not going down the path of having to pay for some big fancy editing suite that i don't need, my Son uses some of those with his Cinematography work but he films and edits tv commercials and documentaries among other things, because he needs to.

He often used to laugh at me and called my VRD a toy, which it might be to some, but it has features that no other edit tool has, or can do as well.

LosslessCut, VRD, and now Handbrake are my go to tools from now on.

[Marayong]

I'm a bystander in this since I don't need x265 support - investing time and money into the hardware & software to have full x265 support is only justifiable if your eyesight is good enough to distinguish the difference. Mine isn't. *shrug* VRD works fine for my needs. The activatiion site is back up so I could transfer my licence to another pc easily enough and if that site vanishes, I can preserve my existing licenced install by imaging my current boot drive into a new computer (having already done just that and I'll be doing it again in a few months so I can move from a MBR to GPT boot drive and install win11).

And Bridgy has already studied TMPGEnc MPEG Smart Renderer and concluded it does not meet his requirements.

As for full vs partial support .. the question is just how partial 'partial' is with any one video editor. VRD works fine with the x265 videos I recorded on my phone, so for me the partial x265 support that VRD has is as good as full support. But for Bridgy, his x265 videos are not VRD friendly, so the partial support that VRD offers is not enough for his needs, so for him VRD does not have x265 support. Different users, different needs, different results.

[codemaster]

And Bridgy has already studied TMPGEnc MPEG Smart Renderer and concluded it does not meet his requirements.

I know, but it has everything that VideoReDo doesn't have, except titles and credits. But title and credits clips can be created in many free editors, and TMPGEnc MPEG Smart Renderer can join the title and credits clips with the camera clips.

[Marayong]

I don't remember what it is now, but in the course of his review, he found something that meant it was unsuitable for my needs or that I would need multiple pieces of software to do what I currently do with VRD. It's somewhere back on the first two pages of this forum .. or the other VRD forum at videohelp. As for Bridgy, he was confident in his dismissal .. can't remember why .. maybe something to do with frame accurate cuts or intelligent encoding? Dunno. It was one of the first alternatives he looked at. As I said, everyone has different needs.

[Bridgy]

I'm a bystander in this since I don't need x265 support - investing time and money into the hardware & software to have full x265 support is only justifiable if your eyesight is good enough to distinguish the difference. Mine isn't. *shrug*

I don't understand the relationship between not needing x265 support because your "eyesight" is not good enough, as i have seen you mention your eyesight in some of your other posts in the past.

I record in HEVC video because i can, and i want to, i record 4k video because i can, and i want to, and i choose to record at 60fps because i want to, but more so because ineed to, because what i record is not very well suited suited to recording in anything lower than 50 or 60fps as i mostly do what i call "run and gun" recording where there is a lot of movement, both in the scenes that i record, and because i am usually walking and panning with the camera in my hand, and i can't carry a tripod around like others might do, so if i record any lower, my videos look a bit jerky, and it can be almost intolerable to watch.

I need reading and distance glasses, i have reading glasses for my laptop work, and i wear Multifocals away from home, and for watching my 75" 4k tv that is mounted on my living room wall 5m from my sofa, but me working with x265 HEVC has nothing to do with eyesight, i use it because i want to keep up with the latest technology, and that goes for my TV's at home, and my camera recordings too.

And Bridgy has already studied TMPGEnc MPEG Smart Renderer and concluded it does not meet his requirements.

I kind of like TMPGEnc Smart Renderer on the whole, years ago i used TMPGEnc Xpress until i found VRD, and for a while i was using both along side each other.

As for the Smart Renderer 6, I just don't like overlay Titles, and i don't like the way that their export profile system works, but is it something that i would buy now after finding and liking LosslessCut (free) for Cutting and Smart Rendering, and Handbrake (free) for exporting to other formats, probably not, but if i lost my VRD then i will need to find a new tool for doing my Titles when i need to, as codemaster has already mentioned there are other ways to do that.

But for Bridgy, his x265 videos are not VRD friendly, so the partial support that VRD offers is not enough for his needs, so for him VRD does not have x265 support. Different users, different needs, different results.

Why are you saying all this, VRD does have HEVC, or as you call it x265 support, i already went thru all this before.

My recorded HEVC files are mostly friendly with VRD, it just won't add titles to them if i Cut them in VRD, so for these files this would just be a bug in the system, but they will Cut and Smart Render, with some lagging during the process (could be my laptop specs causing that) but if i process my HEVC files in LosslessCut first, then VRD will import them and it will add titles and export flawlessly, which just seems crazy to me.

BTW, i also had Lag in several other free cutting tools that i tested to as well, LosslessCut was the one that just seemed to work the best for me.

My needs with VRD are far more than others might need, but overall VRD is friendly with 4k HEVC files, my biggest bug is not being able to add Titles to my recorded HEVC Files that are Cut with VRD, and this was a known issue before Dan passed away.

I will simply use LosslessCut to do my Cuts and Smart Render, and use VRD for Titles because they both work well together.

[Bridgy]

I don't remember what it is now, but in the course of his review, he found something that meant it was unsuitable for my needs or that I would need multiple pieces of software to do what I currently do with VRD. It's somewhere back on the first two pages of this forum .. or the other VRD forum at videohelp. As for Bridgy, he was confident in his dismissal .. can't remember why .. maybe something to do with frame accurate cuts or intelligent encoding? Dunno. It was one of the first alternatives he looked at. As I said, everyone has different needs.

As i mentioned in my previous post, TMPGEnc is basically ok for most needs, but i am not convinced that it does Smart Rendering in the same way that VRD or LosslessCut does it because i tested it many times, and i got some rather differing exports, and i had to choose my export profile in a manner that i was not happy with, which may have produced the strange export results that i got.

I also don't really know if it does do Frame Accurate Cuts at any frame like VRD does (LosslessCut is only accurate on keyframes to be safe) and i also don't like overlaid Titles, but will use them if i need to.

Those were my main issues with TMPGEnc, but i would not bother buying it now because i have my chosen alternative tools for what i need, and they are free, finding a Title creation tool like VRD is not an issue as of now.

[Marayong]

Getting off track .. but without glasses I am legally blind and glasses can only correct so much. Even with ultra high index lenses, my prescription is a balancing act between correcting multiple sight issues and the optical aberrations that said corrections introduce. Even with a new prescription, I can't visually distinguish the difference between x264 & x265. There are even times when I can't visually distinguish between SD and HD. So for me there's no incentive for me to invest a large sum of money in upgrading hardware & software so I could record, edit and play back x265 video - it would simply be a total waste of money for zero gain. For me.

Further, my recordings are mostly broadcast (FTA and subscription), and that's all 30fps, so I have no need of 60fps technology. My hdmi pcie card does handle 60fps, but it is intelligent enough to scale down when the source is less.

As I said, everyone has different needs.

> Why are you saying all this, VRD does have HEVC, or as you call it x265 support, i already went thru all this before.

Because some of your HEVC files don't work in VRD, at least the non-pro version. Last year I tried some of your video files and they crashed VRD every time. That indicates limited support. Also, early on you commented that even in the pro version the videos did not play smoothly. That was last year .. unless you've fixed this?

As codemaster noted up near the top of this page, VRD only provides partial x265 (or HEVC if you prefer) support.

On a different note, I checked the logfile for the x265/HEVC vbideo I edited this morning and there is no reference to mainconcept encoder in the log, but plenty of references in different places to x265 and HEVC encoding. Eg:

...
2025-01-18 09:17:10 HEVC, Starting stream open for: Q:\20250118_091439.mp4
2025-01-18 09:17:10 Creating MP4 reader.
2025-01-18 09:17:10 HEVC, Opening file: Q:\20250118_091439.mp4, filetype is: HEVC PIDs: x201 / x202
2025-01-18 09:17:10 Adding module to graph: HEVC smart editor
2025-01-18 09:17:10 Adding module to graph: libav HEVC decoder
2025-01-18 09:17:10 Adding module to graph: hevcEncoder
2025-01-18 09:17:10 Adding module to graph: Output muxer
2025-01-18 09:17:10 Setting graph input port: 0 to module: HEVC smart editor port: 0 Accepts EOF
2025-01-18 09:17:10 Setting graph input port: 3 to module: HEVC smart editor port: 2
...
2025-01-18 09:17:10 HEVC smart editor: Starting HEVC smart editing thread.
2025-01-18 09:17:10 libav HEVC decoder: Starting video decoder thread.
2025-01-18 09:17:10 hevcEncoder: Starting video, x265 encoder thread.

So the latest versions of the non-pro version use the x264 and x265 encoders and not mainconcept as in the past.

[Bridgy]

As codemaster noted up near the top of this page, VRD only provides partial x265 (or HEVC if you prefer) support.

Was it partial support for x265 OR was it partial support for VFR files, as i recall him suggesting that VRD probably doesn't like VFR files.

Because some of your HEVC files don't work in VRD, at least the non-pro version. Last year I tried some of your video files and they crashed VRD every time. That indicates limited support.

Ok, all of my HEVC files work with VRD, meaning that i can import them all, i can do everything with those files that VRD can offer to me, but when i import 4k/60p HEVC files, i just get some Lagging when i preview the file inside the preview screen, and Lag when seeking to my cut points in the timeline, this could just be due to my laptop specs, or due to them being 60fps, so i will record some 4k/30p HEVC files and test them for Lag, but the issue could just be a small bug in the software that causes this to happen, at least with 4k/60p HEVC files that i run thru VRD.

The Titles issue is obviously just another bug with my recorded 4k/60p HEVC files, VRD just screws up when i try to export the file after i add the Title, but why does VRD export a LosslessCut file after i add a Title, this proves to me that the Title feature does actually work with these HEVC files, it just seems to not like doing it with my Source files that are imported directly from my camera.

I don't call any of this Partial Support for HEVC files, they are just bugs in the software when dealing with the Source files imported directly from my camera.

Also, early on you commented that even in the pro version the videos did not play smoothly. That was last year .. unless you've fixed this?

This was in reference to my 4k/60p HEVC files being Laggy when i play them in the VRD preview screen, and there is Lag when seeking to my Cut points in the timeline, it still happens, but that might be due to my laptop specs, or just a bug in the software, but i don't call that a lack of support for HEVC files, i call it a bug or glitch, just as it is when i try to export my HEVC source files with a Title, that too is a bug or glitch, because they do work after being Cut and exported using LosslessCut first, so go figure that.

Actually, now that i have had 100% success with adding titles to HEVC files processed using LosslessCut, i would say that VRD does have full HEVC support, because it does export other formats to HEVC, it does Smart Cut and Smart Render HEVC files, and it does add Titles to HEVC files.

I really need to test VRD on a different computer to see if that will still show this Lag when previewing or seeking in the timeline, but if someone else in here can test my files on their computer, this will tell us if it is my laptop causing it, or if it really is a Bug in VRD, this is the only way to tell for sure.

At least i know that VRD does do Titles perfectly on 4k/60p HEVC files, at least those exported from LosslessCut first.

Now i will record a 4k/30p HEVC test file and see if that Lags in VRD, and i will cut one of my files using another cutting tool and see if that will add titles in VRD like it does with LosslessCut files.

[Marayong]

Partial support for x265/HEVC for VRD in this context means that they were in the process of adding support to VRD when Dan died and development ceased. The key there is "in the process", which means they hadn't achieved the finished product, so it is still buggy.

When I tried your files in my version of VRD they opened fine, edited fine, however playback was stuttery & when I tried to save the edited video, it crashed every time. On the other hand, the 30fps/HEVC file I recorded played, edited & saved fine on VRD. Hence "partial support". Or buggy support, if you prefer.

[Bridgy]

Partial support for x265/HEVC for VRD in this context means that they were in the process of adding support to VRD when Dan died and development ceased. The key there is "in the process", which means they hadn't achieved the finished product, so it is still buggy.

When I tried your files in my version of VRD they opened fine, edited fine, however playback was stuttery & when I tried to save the edited video, it crashed every time. On the other hand, the 30fps/HEVC file I recorded played, edited & saved fine on VRD. Hence "partial support". Or buggy support, if you prefer.

Your take on all this is completely different than mine, a bug does not mean that there is no support, or even partial support, it is just a case that VRD handles some files differently, and the computer being used can also have an effect on all this too.

I proved already that VRD imports HEVC, it can Cut and Smart Render them (albeit some Lag during the Cut process with my own files) and it can add Titles to them, as in the Files processed in LosslessCut, so that proves that the Title feature does indeed work on HEVC files, it just doesn't like my recorded files as they come from the camera, or after being cut in VRD first.

These are Bugs in the software, and nothing more.

[Bridgy]

OK i just recorded a 4k/30p HEVC file with the S24

1: Imported to VRD, Cut to 3 segments and Merge, Smart Render and Export perfectly, and playback on my laptop in MPC is perfect.

BUT there is still Lag in the preview screen and during seeking in the timeline, same as the 60p files, this could just be an issue with my laptop specs, or a bug, if this does not Lag in someone elses computer then it is my laptop at fault, not VRD.

2: Imported the Cut File to the Joiner list, add my Title, Export crashed, just as it does with the 60p Files.

3: Imported the Source File to the VRD Joiner, this time it was the actual uncut File as it came from the Camera, i added the Title, and it Exported perfectly, so go figure, but it wont export the file if i cut and merge it with VRD first.

4: Imported the Source file into LosslessCut, i Cut 3 segments and it exported perfectly, plays perfectly.

5: I imported the Cut file from LoslessCut into the VRD Joiner list, i add the Title, and it exported perfectly.

Same results that i got from the 4k/60p source files.

[Marayong]

I wouldn't say completely different takes .. I'd put it down to semantics. IMO, a product that is in the process of adding a new feature but still has bugs to iron out only offers partial support. Full support is when it offers that feature with no bugs.

For me, the non-pro VRD could open and edit 30fps and 60fps hEVC files, stuttered on playing 60fps ones and crashed on saving edited 60fps HEVCs, but played & saved 30fms HEVCs fine. As for the computer, mine has 64G ram and 24 cores .. both the GPU card and the mobo/CPU are current models designed for gaming and/or video editing.

[Bridgy]

For me, the non-pro VRD could open and edit 30fps and 60fps hEVC files, stuttered on playing 60fps ones and crashed on saving edited 60fps HEVCs, but played & saved 30fms HEVCs fine. As for the computer, mine has 64G ram and 24 cores .. both the GPU card and the mobo/CPU are current models designed for gaming and/or video editing.

Ok so with 4k/60p you get Lag when playing in the preview screen and seeking to cut points, and it crashes when you export, but your 4k/30p files were fine when previewing and seeking in the timeline, and they exported as well.

My VRD can cut both 60p and 30p HEVC and export them without any issues, and both play perfect in MPC on my laptop, i just suffer with the Lag on both.

Everything else for me does work in VRD with HEVC file, but why will VRD add a title to a camera file with no cuts, but not add a title when i make some cuts first, this is obviously another bug, but i can work around this by importing the camera file first, add the title and export, bring that into VRD again and then cut the unwanted bits out, then smart render it, at least this works for me.

OR i just cut the file with LosslessCut first, then import to VRD to add the Title because this method has always worked.

[Marayong]

The difference in 4k/60p behaviour can be probably chalked up to the difference between the vanilla and pro versions.

Can't help with titles .. no experience with those.

[Bridgy]

The difference in 4k/60p behaviour can be probably chalked up to the difference between the vanilla and pro versions.

Can't help with titles .. no experience with those.

Yes, because i know for a fact as a former Beta Tester that Pro had a lot more additional features included, which is why i bought the Pro version, i could never have been able to use the Non Pro version, or at least been able to do stuff that i really needed to do with my files.

I think we just need to put VRD to bed and let it do what it does for those who are using it, and i will plug away and use it whenever i need to, but the biggest winner in all of this for me was finding LosslessCut, and at the beginning i criticized it for looking a bit tacky and childish as far as the User Interface goes, but i heard a lot of people also criticize the look of VRD as well, and that's fine because VRD to me is far and away the best looking GUI, it is laid out perfectly, and so easy to use, even a child can use it.

Handbrake has also been a big winner for me as well for exporting to other formats, and i thank codemaster for teaching me the ropes properly.

EDIT: one other thing that i may not have mentioned before with VRD, so after importing a file and adding a Title, the exported file will not show the bitrate of the actual source file, it will give a lower bitrate depending on the duration of the actual file.

With my 30 second 4k/60p HEVC test file it was recorded at 61.0Mbps, but after i export that with a 7 second Title, the bitrate shows up as 49.5Mbps.

I asked Dan Rosen about this very same thing several years ago and he attempted to explain it to me, but he did assure me that the video part is still the same bitrate as the source file because it is not recoded when Smart Match is used for the export.

EDIT 2: OK well just as i suspected, Dan Rosen was indeed correct with what he told me regarding the Exported file with a Title still being the same as the source file, but shows it as being lower.

I just opened VRD and i imported that 4k/60p HEVC test file with a Title that shows up as 49.5Mbps, i cut the title off, and smart rendered back, and the export file came in at 59.8Mbps.

[Marayong]

That's SOP. New features are added to pro/plus/etc versions and after a while slowly get added to the vanilla version whilst still newer features go into the pro/etc version.

Did you ever look into DaVinci Resolve?

[Bridgy]

Sorry i just made another EDIT 2 in my previous post, i had to do it just to prove my point.

That's SOP. New features are added to pro/plus/etc versions and after a while slowly get added to the vanilla version whilst still newer features go into the pro/etc version.

Did you ever look into DaVinci Resolve?

Yes i have, and my Son uses it all the time with his RAW and ProRes files from his BlackMagic video cameras.

I don't need that kind of software, but of the more professional edit suites out there, it isn't too shabby.

My Son does a lot of Color Grading too, which Resolve is very good for.

[Marayong]

Could it be an alternative or does it lack the necessary features such as frame cutting?

Checking their forum there are a lot of people complaining that the current version (19) has serious stability issues.

[Bridgy]

Could it be an alternative or does it lack the necessary features such as frame cutting?

Checking their forum there are a lot of people complaining that the current version (19) has serious stability issues.

No i wouldn't use it just for the 3 features that i need, by the time open it up and start doing what i need to do, i could have it Cut and exported from LosslessCut, and imported to VRD for Titles, then export again.

75% of my work just involves trimming my files out and smart render them, so only need LosslessCut, or take 4 times the duration and do it in VRD (additional time needed because of the Lag issue)

The other 25% needs Cutting (1 minute in LosslessCut) and adding Titles (3 minutes to do in VRD) then smart render again.

I sometimes, but rarely need to drop my files to lower resolution or to AVC for others to be able to watch them, so Handbrake can do this for me.

For non critical stuff i drop my 4k/60p HEVC files to 1080/60p HEVC to upload into youtube because of the upload time, not because of the lower quality, Youtube converts the files to several other resolutions again anyway, lord knows how.

With more important stuff i will upload the edited source files, regardless of the duration or upload time.

These 2 videos were uploaded in their original 4k/60p HEVC mode, cut with LosslessCut and titles added in VRD.
I recorded the S24 Ultra version a week later on an overcast day, i just wanted to show the comparison in detail between the S21 and S24 Ultra files, which is visible if you look closely.

S24 Ultra = https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cD59GOGJQxI

S21-5G = https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbmL2xQ7ycc

The S24 Ultra is better than the 4 year old S21 in lower light, but i still love the look of the S21 when recorded an a clear sky day.

This following video is the same S21 file with a different Title nd downscaled to 1080/60p HEVC before uploading.
This video was put up for people to see the progress of the new bridge being built about 1km from my home.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKPTsRsKblo&t=104s

[Marayong]

Apart from the cloud in one and hence different light, they all look the same to me .. but that reflects my eyesight more than anything else.

[Bridgy]

Apart from the cloud in one and hence different light, they all look the same to me .. but that reflects my eyesight more than anything else.

I need my reading glasses to tell the real difference, you can't compare the same side by side video when you have different lighting.

If i was on the bus right now going over the old causeway bridge recording the S24 video, it would match the lighting im my S21 video as the sky today is clear and blue, then i would get a real comparison, and compare the finer detail.

I can see the finer details in the houses in the distance beyond the new bridge, starting about 45 seconds from the end.

I was amazed at the S21 video in that clear blue sky lighting to be honest, and my S23 was even better than that, wish i sold the S21 now and not the S23, as my backup.

[Bridgy]

Hey guys, this morning i decided to Test the Cutting and Smart Rendering of my S24 Ultra 4k/60p HEVC and AVC files, just to see if these might behave differently that my S21 and S23 files did some time ago, because VRD is now smart rendering my exports from LosslessCut as CFR but the Source files are all VFR, so i know that there is some small difference in these S24 files, i just can't pin point it.

My S24 4k/60p AVC (72.0Mbps) files will play properly without glitches when Cut on any frame.

My S24 4k/60p HEVC (61.0Mbps) files still only play properly without glitches when the start cut of each retained segment is cut on a Keyframe, the end cuts can be made anywhere.

EDIT: well stone the crows, i was able to add Titles to these 4k/60p HEVC LosslessCut exports the other day, now i tried to do one and VRD gave me the Large Buffer Malloc:no more memory error, which is odd.

I think i was getting some of these several years ago and Dan Rosen explained it to me, but the so called bug that he found in VRD that was causing my laptop to do this was fixed.

I have tried it several times just now and it seems to happen as soon as the Ram Usage gets to about 50% and the SWAP Usage hits 61% and it crashes.


[Attachment 84995 - Click to enlarge]

I rebooted the laptop and the Swap Usage went back down to 15% and i was then able to add a Title and it worked.

I only have 16gb of ram in my laptop, Is there some way to stop my SWAP Usage from getting too high like this.

EDIT: Ok well it looks like my VRD is failing to add Titles to any of my 4k AVC and HEVC Files, been trying for 24 hours and it will not even add titles to the Files that were Cut with LosslessCut, which it was working with before, so clearly something has gone wrong that is continually giving the Large Buffer Malloc:no more memory error.

[Marayong]

The swap file error you got can be due to one of two things .. issues with the OS (either drivers or incorrect settings) or the software in question has a bug that is causing memory leaks. Memory leaks are where the software and/or os is not releasing memory once it is finished with it - the affected memory is not physically in use but is tagged as "in use" by the os and so unavailable for anything else.

One check you can do is to reboot the laptop and leave it running *without VRD running*, periodically checking the physically memory usage and the swap file usage. If the usage of both increases with time without VRD running, then it is an os issue, if it is stable over time then it's VRD. Unless you've already checked this?

Next, check how much space windoze is allocating to the swap file (aka paging file). For a 16G system, MS recommends a swap file that's between 4G and 1.5 times the physical RAM, that is 24G. 4G is the absolute minimum and 24G is if you have hibernation set up. For less than 16G of ram they recommend a swap file equal in size to the amount of physical RAM, so you have recommendations between 4-24G. I have Win10 on my desktop with 64G RAM and the paging size set to be managed by the system. Greyed out it says 'recommended' paging size 9G if I wanted to manually configure it but the system managed paging size is 64G .. the same as the physical RAM. Of course it's all academic on my pc - with 64G of RAM the paging file just sits there and does diddly squat. So I'd say best practice would be to have it between 16-24G on your laptop. You can set the paging file to operate off another drive, but the system drive is always the quickest.

Check to see if the paging file on the laptop "managed by the system" or manually. If the later, maybe switch to the former? If it's the former and the current paging size is less than 16G, set it to manual and set the paging size at 16G. Or even 24G.

If the virtual memory settings are all ok, the next thing to check is to make sure all the drivers are up to date, especially those for the mobo & CPU. Check for optional updates in win update but also check the manufacturer websites - not all manufacturer drivers are available via WinUpdate. Driver issues can cause memory leaks, especially mobo ones since it is those that manage the RAM. The thing with out of date drivers is that os or software updates may not be 100% compatible with the older drivers, so a pc may work fine one day, you update windows and then it has driver issues.

Of course, this is all presuming that the issue isn't a bug in VRD Pro. If that is the case, your only hope is to post a help request on the reddit forum in case someone else has encountered the same issue and found a fix, tho' Dan hasn't posted anything there in months. Otherwise do a web search with VRD/videoredo" and the error message you got. You might be lucky. After 7 months of fruitless searching I finally found a very obscure forum entry that helped me fix an issue on my now 8mo pc - someone had the same issue I did and posted a help request. They got no answers and a week or so later they made a follow-up post saying they'd fixed the issue and gave instructions.

The lack of a response indicates no-one else here has had that particular issue, hence the need to look elsewhere.