AVIdemux 2.8 LINES with motion in video

[Ceyarrecks]

Excuse me Please:

While I have attempted to do searches via DDG and here, since I do not know what I do not know, i can only describe what i see as "lines."
Nothing comes up for "lines in avidemux video."

please see the pic of my Making of The Pink Panther vid showing an elderly Blake Edwards:

[Attachment 63775 - Click to enlarge]
{see lines on hands?}

the original .mkv as well as DVD do not show said lines with movement.
i am using the DEFAULT settings in Avidemux 2.8.0 of
lavcodec: DXVA2
Vid Output: Mpeg4 AVC (x264)
Audio Out: Copy
Out Format: MKV muxer

i think *I* screwed something up while using v2.7.6 [beyond the Pixel Aspect Ratio manually set to NTSC 16:9, which is NOT set in v2.8.0 i am still clueless]
which is where this "lines" problem started that 2.8.0 somehow retains(even though they are in separate install dir)

also, i seem to have a vague memory of seeing in Lavcodec: RGB(or something similar)
but as i am VERY ignorant of the technical terms,
these might as well be Klingon for as much as i understand

Thank You for the time taken to reply,...

[davexnet]

Probably during normal playback in a media player, it's being deinterlaced in one manner or another,
In Avidemux it's not, so you're seeing an interlaced frame, two moments in time, in one image.
Post a short video sample, showing some steady movement, to this thread for confirmation

[Ceyarrecks]

@davexnet
Thank You for the response.

note: the file attached displays the "lines" effect clearly when processed using x264. [1.7mb]
However, were I to just Copy/Copy the, albeit much larger, same slice [9.6mb] it does NOT have said lines when being played. [using MPC-HC]

01 The Pink Panther-making_(x264).mkv

so i guess something changed within the x264 area?
or is it in the "lavcodec"?

Thank you again for the assistance

edit:
i DO see those lines within Avidemux while scrolling/playing vids.

[Ceyarrecks]

edit edit:
sorry, misread your request,... uploading 9mb unprocessed file:
01 The Pink Panther-making_copy.mkv

[jagabo]

You have interlaced video. Each frame contains two half-pictures:


[Attachment 63778 - Click to enlarge]

The two picture are meant to be seen individually and sequentially.

Encode interlaced or deinterlace before encoding progressive.

[Ceyarrecks]

...

Encode interlaced or deinterlace before encoding progressive.

So,... if i understand the abbreviated and presumptive suggestion:
I am to check the box on the Frame tab under x264 Configuration,
next to Interlaced:; and guessing the dropdown menu options of Top Field First or Bottom Field First have no bearing?

And remind me again, how does one "deinterlace before encoding progressive"?

[Ceyarrecks]

"Interlaced" for the above sampled video seems to work.

so,... if this setting is so needful, why is it not checked by default?

why would one not want a video to be "interlaced"?

[davexnet]

"Interlaced" for the above sampled video seems to work.

so,... if this setting is so needful, why is it not checked by default?

why would one not want a video to be "interlaced"?

Certain applications require progressive format such as uploading to Youtube.
In this case the video should be deinterlaced first otherwise Youtube would make a right mess of it.

Computer media players (usually) detect it, assuming the file is properly flagged and deinterlace on the fly,
since the computer monitor is a progressive device.
Similarly, as well as playing through a TV, it's usually handled fine

In otherwords if your original file is interlaced leave it as-is if it is if possible

WHat are you actually trying to do?

[jagabo]

I am to check the box on the Frame tab under x264 Configuration,
next to Interlaced:; and guessing the dropdown menu options of Top Field First or Bottom Field First have no bearing?

TFF/BFF has to be set properly. It's the order in which the two pictures are displayed. If you set it backwards you will get very jerky/shaky motion. MediaInfo can usually tell you if the field order.

And remind me again, how does one "deinterlace before encoding progressive"?

That Pink Panther clip was very horribly produced. No deinterlacing filter does well with it. But in AviDemux try Video -> Filters -> Interlacing -> Yadif. Select Field : Temporal & Spatial Check, and Top Field First. In the x264 config don't select Interlaced.

[Ceyarrecks]

...

What are you actually trying to do?

I simply wish convert my DVD library to locally-stored files of the best possible quality while reducing overall file size*.
nothing external or ever uploaded.

( i think with the recent replacement of better quality monitors has allowed me to see the previous imperfections i was blissfully unaware of )

*guess i am still stuck in the previous mind-set of being concerned for file size in respect of dwindling local storage, which currently is no longer relevant.

[Ceyarrecks]

...
That Pink Panther clip was very horribly produced. No deinterlacing filter does well with it. But in AviDemux try Video -> Filters -> Interlacing -> Yadif. Select Field : Temporal & Spatial Check, and Top Field First. In the x264 config don't select Interlaced.

oh,.. uh, well, the horrid-ness of the previous file was due to my complete ignorance of what i was doing, especially as it concerns Filters.
I did not use any. I just ran the original MakeMKV file through AVIdemux's default settings; it was only recently that i started noticing the interlacing problem, which previously was not seen in similar converts.

speaking of my lack of knowledge, is there a place one can go to read through a step-by-step tutorial for using AVIdemux that also provides the reasons for using x, y, or z settings?[yeah, trial and error is, sometimes, a viable teacher, that however requires one to remember every step previously taken]
with again my ignorance, regardless of my previous technical aptitude, the multitude of settings were quite literally a foreign language akin to Japanese for the layered complexities.
i am making it a point to retain the advise thus provided for future use.

[jagabo]

...
That Pink Panther clip was very horribly produced. No deinterlacing filter does well with it. But in AviDemux try Video -> Filters -> Interlacing -> Yadif. Select Field : Temporal & Spatial Check, and Top Field First. In the x264 config don't select Interlaced.

oh,.. uh, well, the horrid-ness of the previous file was due to my complete ignorance of what i was doing, especially as it concerns Filters.
I did not use any. I just ran the original MakeMKV file through AVIdemux's default settings; it was only recently that i started noticing the interlacing problem, which previously was not seen in similar converts.

I meant the video in post #4 -- interlaced MPEG 2 in MKV. Isn't that the original MPEG 2 video from the DVD?

speaking of my lack of knowledge, is there a place one can go to read through a step-by-step tutorial for using AVIdemux that also provides the reasons for using x, y, or z settings?

I don't use AviDemux. And I don't know of any such site. But the AviDemux web site has some details.

https://www.avidemux.org/admWiki/doku.php?id=using:video_filters

[Ceyarrecks]

...
I meant the video in post #4 -- interlaced MPEG 2 in MKV. Isn't that the original MPEG 2 video from the DVD?

i am embarrassed to say i do not recall the exact process i went through last night for that file so many attempts of different techniques and all,...
I AM noticing however, that direct MakeMKV from DVD is preserving better color then what I previously used, with an slight increase in file size.

also of a weirdness,
now I am NOT noticing the interlacing problem; I unchecked Interlace within x264 config, and resulting mkv files are as smooth as if viewed directly off DVD,...

thank you for the link, will see if there is anything of use on that site,...

may i ask what program combination(s) you use to preserve locally your DVD collection? and why those specific choices?

[davexnet]

The few I've done have been theatrical movie DVD's, shot at 24 fps. So I usually inverse telecine to recover the 24 (23.976)
from the 30 (29.97) fps.
If yours is a documentary, with clips from different sources, some live action, some animation,
some film, some true interlaced footage, probably best to either maintain the frames as they are and
encode interlaced (if you really want to reduce the file size)
OR double rate deinterlace and encode progressive

[Ceyarrecks]

well, based on what I have become aware of here
(THANK YOU VERY MUCH!!)

and in recalling the "interlaced" set I recently finished with of The IT Crowd, I now know where some of my confusion was coming from.

it seems, out of the box, the IT Crowd DVDs were interlaced to begin with!!!
(not sure why i did not notice this in the past)
and while, MPC-HC does allow one to "deinterlace" via its ffdshow config, I would rather not have said interlacing to begin with.

Thank you also for the insight into the more subtle details of MediaInfo,
which I have used in the past, just never knew what "SCAN TYPE" meant.

now I know what to look for!

so I re-pulled the mkv right off the DVD, then ran Avidemux using the filter (first time filter use!! WOOHOO!) of FFmpeg deint with [x] Autolevel and the end result is exactly as preferred, no lines, clear and distinct picture regardless of movement!!

[davexnet]

That sounds alright, not a bad choice, you end up with a progressive clip.

The main downside is, if you have true interlaced (shot on video, 60 fields per second/ 50 PAL) you reduce the temporal resolution
(motion smoothness). This may appear acceptable or terrible depending on the nature of the footage)

If something else turns up post a fresh clip

[jagabo]

Thank you also for the insight into the more subtle details of MediaInfo,
which I have used in the past, just never knew what "SCAN TYPE" meant.

now I know what to look for!

Beware that MediaInfo tells you how the video was encoded, not whether the frames themselves contain interlaced video. A lot of PAL material is encoded interalced even though the frames are progressive.

IT Crowd DVDs... so I re-pulled the mkv right off the DVD, then ran Avidemux using the filter (first time filter use!! WOOHOO!) of FFmpeg deint with [x] Autolevel and the end result is exactly as preferred, no lines, clear and distinct picture regardless of movement!!

The IT Crowd may have been shot as interlaced video. If so, using Yadif with "Field : Temporal & Spacial Check" will give smoother results (unless you have an old media player that can't handle 50p video). Or it may simply be progressive frames stored interlaced and out-of-phase, where using Decomb Telecide may give higher quality results than FFmpeg deint.

[davexnet]

I did a test encode with Qtgmc, Srestore and MosquitoNR. This doesn't look too bad, perhaps 25 is the correct
frame rate?

[jagabo]

If you step through frame by frame after QTGMC(), in the 60p sequence where the Inspector moves down from the door at the top right, you'll see that there is motion every frame (previously fields). So for smoothest playback you want 60p. I suspect much of the body of the videos will be 24p. Virtually little is 30p (sometimes special effects in Sci-fi TV series).

60p video slowed to 2 fps GIF:

[Attachment 63793 - Click to enlarge]

[davexnet]

Good spot, I didn't see it. That extra smoothness makes it look like he's floating down.
Here's the 60 fps version

[Ceyarrecks]

whoa!
mind. blown.

from the casual conversation between you two,
i think i glean an iceberg i have yet to learn of,
only having become aware of that which is seen above the water, heh,..