Capture Quality

[Charlie Brown]

Capturing DV from my Sony DV camcorder gives me a pixellated looking picture on my captured video before I have made a MPEG2 file from the captured video. The capture is done at DV quality capture on Pinnacle Studio 7.15
I am very new at this and any help will be greatly appreciated.

[BJ_M]

are you using a firewire card ? or transfering analog ..

[Charlie Brown]

I am using the firewire port on the Sound Blaster Audigy card.

[el-Dia]

I think I've got a similar problem.
Making svcd's from DVD material is perfect with tmpgenc. But when I try to do it with DV source gives me a pixellated picture also.
The mpeg2 result Pinnacle's studio gives me is a bit worse than tmpgenc.

I haven't found any solutions for this yet... Hope anyone can point in the right direction...

[Charlie Brown]

el-Dia
What is tmpgenc ? Is it used for making SVCD from DV source? I have not been using any codecs , I presumed that on full DV capture I didn't need to.

[jman]

I am having this EXACT same problem. I am capturing through firewire with a sony digital 8 camcorder at highest quality possible with all kinds of software and the captured video is blocky when there is any motion. I was under the impression that digital was the way to go? someone help PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11

[vhelp]

How about trying a different DV codec altogether ??
You may be currently using MS's DV codec. I could be wrong, but in any
case, do a search for MainConcept's DV codec and then D/L it, install
it and try you hand at DV again, and report back here.

On some pc setups, MS's DV codec cause some issues, including this
pixelation as such.

Note, as long as you are not re-saving/exporting out to DV via the
MainConcept's DV codec, you'll be fine, ie if you're frameserving w/
it to tmpg. Otherwise, if you are re-saving/exporting your DV out to
DV again, you'll have MC's waterwark in each frame.

-vhelp

[Nikos]

I am having this EXACT same problem. I am capturing through firewire with a sony digital 8 camcorder at highest quality possible with all kinds of software and the captured video is blocky when there is any motion. I was under the impression that digital was the way to go? someone help PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11

Are you saying that Digital capturing on a hi8 tape is blocky whenever there is motion, like a sports game? Or blocky when viewed on the CPU?

Is it not possible to get a quality recording in SP on a hi8 tape if I record a sporting event?

[jman]

When I capture with my Digital 8 (sony trv-240) with video I have taped with my previous Hi8 camcorder, and with stuff I have just taped in Digital8 format, The captured AVI looks blocky on my computer when played in Windows Media player or WinDVD, VERY blocky when compared to playing it through the camera on my tv (32"). If I encode the video in TMPGEnc to SVCD format and play it on my standalone DVD player (apex AD-1500) it looks worse, which I would expect the Encoding process to degrade the quality some but it is the source (capture) that seems to be the problem.

Nikos wrote:


[/quote]Are you saying that Digital capturing on a hi8 tape is blocky whenever there is motion, like a sports game? Or blocky when viewed on the CPU?
Is it not possible to get a quality recording in SP on a hi8 tape if I record a sporting event?


Do you think I am recording on the wrong tapes on my camcorder?



As far as using a different DV codec, Im not sure how to choose a different codec within the software ( studio 7, Vegas video, DVIO, or any other) but I am willing to try ANYTHING..

[jman]

Ok I downloaded a different DV codec and installed it, but how do I know if I am using it? How can I choose the codec I want?

[Charlie Brown]

Who can help please? My problem is the same as jman's. Captured video
from my Sony PC10 DV camcorder at full DV quality capture is pixellated
(blocky) when viewed on media player before any rendering i.e. before I make a MPEG2 file. At full DV quality capture, I shouldn't need to use codecs, should I? As it is full DV capture, there should be no need for compression/ decompression. I am using a firewire cable connected to a firewire port on my Soundblaster Audigy card.
I wonder, do any settings need to be changed in the BIOS of my computer or Win XP which is my OS.
I am nearing the end of my tether!!!!!!! Anyone out there who has any ideas or has solved this problem.

[jman]

PREACH IT!!!!

I have lots of money invested in this (camcorder, software, Graphics card, ETC.) because I thought DV was the way to go. Everyone made it sound so easy. I thought the capture process would be virtually lossless, but so far

[Charlie Brown]

vhelp
With regards to your suggestion, I am doing full DV quality capture on Pinnacle Studio 7 and I don't know if I am using Pinnacle's codec or MS's
codec. How do I find out?
My purpose is make SVCD's from my mini DV tapes. Does that mean I will be exporting the video to CD-R? Will that leave any watermark?

[The village idiot]

I'm far from expert with DV, but I'll take a stab at it.

Things to check:

-Make sure all hard drives are running in DMA mode.
-Make sure hard drives are de-fragmented.
-Check system performance (cntl+alt+delete -->taskmanager ---> performance) If your processor is hitting 100 percent while capturing, that may be your cause.
-Decrease the size of your preview window in the capture app.
-Do not run ANY other applications while capturing (this includes virus scanners!).
-Try decreasing the hardware acceleration for your graphics card.
-Look for any conflicted hardware.
-Check for any updates or service packs for your OS.
-Check for updates for your capture app.
-Check your camera manufacturer's site for drivers.

On the Audigy connected one, is the audigy connected via USB? If so, USB1.1 is not fast enough to capture DV. Even USB2 might not work very well for this type of interface. You are best off with a firewire PCI card or on-board controller.

If all of the above is OK, then try a different capture application. I really like DVio (sorry I'm at work and don't have the link). I've posted the link in this forum a couple of times, so just do a search in this forum.

Checking the system level things is a little beyond what I can describe, esp. for XP as I don't run it. Hard drive speed is not an issue with anything newer than about 2 years ago. Even an ATA33 drive running at 5400rpm should be ok to capture DV, though faster would be better. And cpu speed shouldn't be an issue with DVio. I can capture from an analog>DV device to a firewire connected hard drive on my P266 laptop with less than 50 percent CPU utilization. I seem to recall something about XP having problems with DV devices, but I could be wrong. If you are connected to the web with high speed, you might try turning your modem off before booting the computer and capturing. Also try booting the computer with the capture device (camera) connected to the computer (and turned on). That's about all I can think of, good luck.

[vhelp]

evening all.

jman and others,
Quesiton:
* You all may have to be a litle more elaborate on your blocks, cause I still
don't understand why you all are getting them, but in any case. . .

Try:
-----------------
* assuming you are opening the DV AVI clip in vdub, then what you do
is click: File/FileInformation This will tell you what codec it
is using AT THE TIME.

Now, as far as the capture and BLOCKS go. . .
* Are you all recording to tape, but in EP mode ??
You should be recording at SP mode. If you all ARE recording at EP mode,
then perhaps you should try re-recording, but in SP mode instead (and future)

NO settings should need to be set in BIOS if everything else has ben working
properly - you could cause more trouble than you barganed for.

Again, in DV world, the language is NOT capture, but Transfer!!
...Unless you are capturing via analog w/ your capture card, as I do. I don't
transfer to hd via firewire.

Following these other speed-criticle TIPS to practic:
------------------------------------------------------------
* Don't have any other apps up and running. That means, NO MOVING YOUR MOUSE!!
* If you app allows, then turn off preview. But, you shouldn't have to do this
at all. However.. .. ..
* keep your preview window as small as posible, and DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT
transfer (via firewire) w/ full screen or 640x480 or higher resolution. Try
and keep preview win small.
* you may need to try another Firewire Transfering app, ie:
--- DVIO.EXE or RSDVCAP.EXE these two apps allow you to Save As
Type 1 or Type 2 format. However, I've ben using Type 1 in my past projects.
* from above, I prefer to use RSDVCAP.EXE, though you'll have a HARD
time finding it. I can't remembers WHERE I D/L'ed it from - Sorry! But, I
remember someone providing a link here. Just ask ( or yell out, WHO/WHERE... )
And, remember to use a SMALL screen in your previews.
* Assuming your source is from a miniDV tape, then, Just how LONG have you ben
recording to this or these tapes, w/out realizing your DV cam's heads are dirty
and that every consecutive recording to incremental tapings only make quality
worse. I found this out just recently, as I don't always record over the same
tapes. I have a large collection of tapes that I recorded to (SP mode) and
some dating as far back as when I FIRST purchased the DV cam ($200 off the
shelf) I found that some tapes, when I play them via TV, would pixelate and
blank out or NOT play at all, instead, just give me blue screens. I ended up
cleaning my heads and it THAT tape worked again, but w/ some minor problems.
Also, because my recordings were incremental, and I didn't take into account
that I should periodically check each tapings, I made things worse for other
tapes as I recorded to them. So, NOW, some tape play fine, while others
require me to run my head cleaner on prior to playing. Only problem w/ this
approach, is that the head cleaner states that I should NOT use it more than
3 times, else damage could result. However, I have no choice (give the above)
Now, when I record to a miniDV tape, I first run the head cleaner THEN put
in the miniDV tape to record to. At least till I can figure out EXACTLY what
went wrong, and HOW to FIX and AVOID it in the future.
So, this may be partly you all's problem too. In any case, it's something
to look out for. Periodically clean your tape heads!

Good luck.
-vhelp

[BJ_M]

RSDVCAP
http://www.rexpccard.co.jp/english/support/software/fw/

all versions are here

[BJ_M]

RSDVCAP plug in for adobe premier is here http://www.rexpccard.co.jp/english/support/software/plugin/

[The village idiot]

BJ_M, thanks for the links. Hereis a link to DVio:
http://www.carr-engineering.com/dvio.htm

[vhelp]

Oh, and remember guys, if you use either one of these apps listed,
TURN ON YOUR DV CAM BEFORE YOU START THESE APPS FOR TRANSFERS, else
you'll get an error or it wont transfer the video - if memory
serves me correctly from past experiences. DVIO definately needs
your CAM turn on first. That's VCR mode for most, ie, on my Canon
ZR-10, I slide the lever down, towards VCR.

Oh, while I'm at it, I've just finished uploading another Sample clip
...in CVD format for those who are curious of VHS source encodes and
what they look like - see link below.

-vhelp
-----------------------------------------------
For Standard and other VCD samples, you can jump over to this FORUM's link
here: VHELP's Samples... - last updated: 09.24.02

[mrag]

Dumb question of the day. I have a dv camera (Canon) and a 1394/firewire card and Pinnacle Studio 7. I shoot video on the camera, connect the firewire and "capture" (transfer?) what's on the camera to my PC (1 gig AMD raid) using Studio 7. The quality is not up to VHS which sounds like a lot of other posts. Before going into 9000 other areas....

Question: is there a difference in 1394 cards? My card came with "free" Intro DV software which came as a rebate when I bought the Canon dv camera. It is OCHI compliant or something like that and it does transfer. SInce it is only a transfer device to get the video from the camera to the PC, could the card be contributing to the lack of quality? I don't want to capture and I don't need to hook a TV up, I just want to get my video off the camera onto a PC. Do I need buy some other card?

[troyvcd1]

play the original on your tv. capture it to your computer. then transfer it back to your camcorder. play it back on your tv. Should be exactly the same quality as original. Dont worry about what it looks like on your computer. when encoding you gotta do a cvd with tmpgenc to get any kind of quality. Or do a svcd with cce and the quality will be 95% of what the original was. this is my experience.

[vhelp]

092602.01

Morning peoples.

Some things to note w/ DV:
* PAL users have it MUCH easier for quality, as frame rate is 25fps!!
* for NTSC, the frame rate is 29.97
you cannot to an IVTC or bring the frame rate down to film level,
or it will jiggle/hisitate/studder as it plays. This WOULD have
brought the quality level up some. BUT, since the DV frame rate IS
tied up to 29.97, it must stay that way.

* when you bring your footage (by whatever means, as it DOES NOT
matter whichever, ie firwire transer or analog capture) the best
way to encode the final clip, ie for SVCD is to either set:
-- interlace on in both VIDEO tab and Advance tab, or
-- Inverse 32 under Video tab and Interlace under Advanced tab
Don't do no IVTCing under Advanced tab in the filters box. You'll
have lots of trouble w/ jitters and studders, etc., as NO Telecine
is done during your shootage/footage from lens to miniDV tapes - your
cameras are NOT cenimas or film equipment. They're just simple a
peoples type camera, not Hollywood...
* then, there's the question of WHAT DV codec you're using at the
time of the AVI editing and/or encoding.
* note, don't bother playing (for testing purpose or viewing) in
media player. This player seems to be plauged w/ issues in the DV
area. Use plane old vdub or even powerdvd or windvd to play your
footage to see quality, etc.

I still don't understand all your issues w/ blocks in your footage.
I don't know if you mean in the AVI or when your encode to whatever
format VCD or SVCD or other. It's just not clear enough, since more
and more people are joining in w/ the same issues, but no one is
actually saying clearly enough:
* WHERE the blocks are coming in, and
* HOW they look, ie macro blocks, or colored blocks, retangle blocks
etc. As these could be due to other causes like wrong recording
modes used during recording to tape. Poor quality will result if you
use EP mode in your recordings. But, in SP mode, quality will be at
it's best no matter what route you choose to bring footage in ie
firewire transfer or analog capture via analog capture card of course.

Well, I have to get ready.
See you all MUCH later, maybe.

Good morning.
-vhelp

[Charlie Brown]

vhelp
Thanks for all the helpful suggestions, you are trying hard to help us novices. The issue with all the people writing in this thread is the same
(as I understand it).
Mini DV tapes when played in the camcorder ( Sony PC10 in my case )
and watched on the TV (32") are perfect, no complaints whatsoever.
I have a Soundblaster Audigy card with a firewire port on it. I connect my camcorder to this with a firewire cable and capture the video to my hard disc using Pinnacle Studio 7.15. From the capture format drop down window I select Full DV quality capture rather than preview quality. I can do this, can't I ? The preview picture area is already quite small in Pinnacle, I don't know how it can be made smaller. No other programs are running and the mouse is not moved. This captured video can then be edited and then made into a movie. When you go to the make a movie section of Pinnacle, it says, this project needs rendering, the options are
Tape, make AVI file, make MPEG file, Share and Stream. Since I want to make an SVCD, I select the MPEG file and in this section select SVCD compatible ( which would be MPEG2 ) and click on it, Pinnacle then makes the MPEG2 file. I don't come across the codecs every one keeps talking about. I can find them in the make AVI file section, but I don't think I need to make an AVI file if I want to burn SVCD's, do I ?
The problem is that when the captured video is watched BEFORE editing and rendering to MPEG2, it appears pixellated. This is difficult to explain but easy to understand once you have seen it. Some areas of the picture appear like little squares that you see when a digital image is magnified many times. Of course, in this case the pixels (squares, blocks) appear in the moving picture. To make matters more confusing, these pixels do not stay in the same area of the picture. There are many such areas and and they continuosly move all over different areas of the picture. Sometimes, the effect is like watching through glass smeared with vaseline.
As this happens on the captured video, I cannot ascribe it to the rendering to MPEG2 process. By the way, in what format is the video captured to hard disc ? I guess this must be standard for all PC's or does it depend on the software used to capture ( Pinnacle in my case ).
Would a seperate firewire card make a difference?
Do any settings in the computer's BIOS need altering?
Do any settings in Win XP need changing ( my OS ) ?
I hope I have provided more information to help you solve our dilemma. It is driving me nuts. I have burned so many VCD's and SVCD's and they all come out as described above.
Looking forward to your helpful reply.

[vhelp]

evening all.

Charlie,
* first, at this time, don't bother w/ a new firewire card (just yet)
* don't change any BIOS settings either (you'll make things worse)
* XP does't need any changes either (afaik. But, i'm in window 98 )

Ok, now for some things I noticed. . .
* the blocks you spoke of in Studio's small preview are or can be normal.
I remember seeing thing too, in Studio as I play the video through it.
* somewhere in Studio, there's a setting that turns off the "sensing"
or [x]scene detection and/or [x]Do nothing or whatever they call it,
Uncheck it. (may speed some things up)
And, ignore any message about rendering - false, false! he, he...

However, instead of using Studio for encoding your DV projects, instead,
use TMPG directly, and just do some test encodes of small clips. You'll
be (or may be) surprised at the results. Choose like, VCD or SVCD templates
and just encode, then view them and see how they look.

The blocks in the preview windows are nothing to be concirned with.
Instead, if you wanna see (or preview) what you footage looks like so far,
then just open them in vdub. However, depending on the TYPE you DV firewired
it to, you may or may not be able to open them completely - - that is, after
the warning beep/message, only the video will be able to open in vdub, and
not the audio (though you can get that in TMPG, he, he... )
However, TYPE 2 IMSM, should be able to open up in vdub w/out any problems.
Now, after opening up in vdub, (hope you are familiur w/ vdub) then just
press play and see if it plays w/out any blocks - vulla!!
You may experience choppyness or studders (I can't remember for sure) but
in any case, this just ignore it.

Now, (assuming above) you can frameserve this into TMPG.
But, you are probably better off just opening directly in TMPG and selecting
your template, and encoding your DV projects this way. ...what's that??
You need to edit some areas in your DV footage?? then just use vdub, edit
your areas, and then frameserve it to TMPG!!

From time to time, I post samples (see below link) from my various cards
and/or mini TIVO (aka mini TIVO as I call it) and I post. I may be posting
an sample from my DV cam. I did some CAMing this morning from Satalite.
However, I have an issue w/ it messing up on me. I think mine needs some
servicing on cause the video cuts out and/or into another video on the miniDV
tapes. Anyways. . .

-vhelp
-----------------------------------------------
For Standard and other VCD samples, you can jump over to this FORUM's link
here: VHELP's Samples... - last updated: 09.24.02

[troyvcd1]

Those encoders that come with pinacle, ulead, etc.. suck. Dont expect any kind of svcd or vcd quality from them. U gotta use tmpgenc or cce.

[eugenegill]

Could it be a problem of field order - A or B? See http://www.ulead.com/learning/video3/page1.htm for some background.

[Charlie Brown]

Hi everybody,
I hope you remember that I am new at this video capturing. Thus, pardon my ignorance when I ask what is TMPG, tmpgenc and cce and how do I get hold of them.
Does it mean that when I have these, I can capture video onto my hard disk without the need of Pinnacle and Ulead?

[snowmoon]

TMPGenc = TMPG, cce are both MPEG encoder. They do not help you capture video all they do is convert .avi files to .mpg ( .m2v, mpv, .mpa, ... )

If you want to capture video you can use

Freeware: VirtualDub or VirtualVCR
Shareware: AVI_IO
Commercial: many.

[fingernailX]

If the dv tape when played back on the camcorder looks good on a s-video out to a TV and you capture w/o drop frames using any capture program including Movie Maker and it looks like sh*t on the computer when you play back the avi then all is not lost. DV as a codec for computer display sucks. It is interlaced and in the wrong field order and some codecs are set by default to playback at half D1 resolution. But every frame is a key frame and the necessary info is there. Whether you use CCE or tmpgenc or some other mpeg2 encoder if you intend to playback the mpg on a computer or projector you must deinterlace. If you are only going to playback on NTSC TV then don't deinterlace but make sure the field order is swapped, (new tmpgenc does this automatically) and use slow-high quality for motion search precision. The resulting mpeg using a SVCD or DVD template should look very close to the original tape when output to a TV. If it doesn't and you followed one of the many guides from this site, you likely have an codec or software install problem.

[cartamy]

Charlie Brown, I think/hope I see your problem and it's going to be easy to fix. When the project needs rendering, select AVI. AVI and DV files are VERY large, something in the order of 2-3 minutes of video in this format will fit on an 800 MB CD. Most people find this option unusable, so they convert their AVI files into the mpeg (1 or 2) format. These files are compressed and therefore take up a LOT LESS space. To convert from AVI to MPEG you need an encoder. Not all encoders are created equally. What you are doing when you select MPEG as your rendering option is using the encoder that is built-in to your capturing software. Don't do that! I'm guessing that if you pick AVI as your rendering type, you won't have the blocks your talking about, you'll see how your video files are going to be big beyond belief, then you'll get to learn all about an encoder called Tmpgenc. Keep at it Charlie Brown, finding this website was the best thing that could of happened to you. I, too, feel the camcorder/computer companies make it seem like you can buy there product today and watch it on your TV tomorrow. The fact is that there are many steps in between and a lot to learn.