Firewire or USB 2.0 TV Tuner

[richlivi]

I'm looking for a tv tuner/PVR/DV unit that has the functionality of the Hauppauge WinTV PVR, but has a firewire or USB 2.0 interface. The WinTV PVR is pretty much what I'm looking for in terms of features, but after reading reviews, it's clear that the USB 1.1 limitations make it a poor choice. I have seen some excellent DV solutions (e.g. Miglia Director's Cut, Canopus ADVC-100), but these don't have a TV tuner. After scouring the web and the groups, I'm only able to find scathing reviews of products that use USB 1.1 interface, and no firewire or USB 2.0 tv tuners. I'm hoping someone here will be aware of a solid solution.

[richlivi]

Looks like I've answered my own question. I finally came across Pinnacle's latest product release - PCTV Deluxe. This just came out a month ago (11/14/02), but I can't find any reviews. If anyone could point me to a review, or post one if you've had a chance to use it, I'd appreciate it. How's the picture quality when watching TV (any "choppiness")? How's the PVR functionality (any degradation/bugs when recording)? Etc.

[majland]

I can't find any info about the pctv deluxe - can you provide a link ?

I know of the pinnacle bungee, but that is also usb 1.1 (afaik)

/A...

[donpedro]

Me neither...

Pinnacle Systems PCTV Deluxe Personal Video...

[richlivi]

Here's the URL to the PCTV product page on Pinnacle Systems' web site: http://www.pinnaclesys.com/ProductPage.asp?Product_ID=1008&Langue_ID=7

Still can't find a single good review on it though. Looks like I'll just have to buy it and test it for myself. Probably be at least couple of weeks though.

[donpedro]

There is not too much on their web. Happy to see your results...

[majland]

It looks lige a newer version of the bungee. I've read a test that compared the PVR USB with the Bungee and the result tipped in favour of the bungee. I'not to happy with the software support for my PVR. It was much better for my pinnacle wintv usb (low res - no hw comp) and the pctv pro (pci). The bungee retails for 400 euro so $200 looks like a bargain.

[majland]

A few more (shop) links

http://shop.store.yahoo.com/digitally-unique/pctvdeluxe.html
http://shop3.outpost.com/product/3501074

and a short "news clip"
http://napps.nwfusion.com/weblogs/cool/archives/002026.html

Anyone know whether its a ntsc only product or it also supports pal
Anyone know a retailer within EU

[donpedro]

Based on wgat is on the box and what I remember from Bungee DVD, it should be NTSC only (at least version sold in US). But I might be wrong.

[donpedro]

A few more (shop) links

http://shop.store.yahoo.com/digitally-unique/pctvdeluxe.html

Picture on this link is not correct.... It shows PCTV box.

[ItsMe]

Looks like I've answered my own question. I finally came across Pinnacle's latest product release - PCTV Deluxe. This just came out a month ago (11/14/02), but I can't find any reviews. If anyone could point me to a review, or post one if you've had a chance to use it, I'd appreciate it. How's the picture quality when watching TV (any "choppiness")? How's the PVR functionality (any degradation/bugs when recording)? Etc.

I suggest that you take a look at the Pinnacle support forum before buying. Pinnacle products have a habit on not working properly when first released, although when the bugs are ironed out, they are usually good products once there products mature a bit.

Also, check to see if the Pinnacle support "high speed USB2" as some USB products out there don't. If you don't know about the various USB2 speed, then do a search on Google.

[donpedro]

Also, check to see if the Pinnacle support "high speed USB2" as some USB products out there don't. If you don't know about the various USB2 speed, then do a search on Google.

Did you mean this... ?

high-speed (480Mbps), full-speed (12Mbps) and low-speed (1.5Mbps) data transfer

Maybe you should say "B", too. I am still not sure what you ment...

BTW. I beleive that it supports USB 2.0 (I thought that this mean 480Mbps. Is there USB 2.0 device that does not support 480Mbps?)

[Gazorgan]

Be aware: There are a number of other 'USB 2.0' devices around that aren't what you think. I mean it's still the same old product that had USB 1.1 support, but now has a USB 2.0 interface.

So, the bus speed may be 480 Mbps, the capture hardware is still the same old and slow device in the original product. I've seen this in a number of PC Cams (most eventurally get upgraded to faster guts, but it's so easy to say "USB 2.0" as a marketing tool).

I wouldn't buy any USB/Firewire capture device unless the store has a good return policy. Good capping at 30-40 Mbps is well within USB 2.0 specs, but is it within the internal workings of the (originally USB 1.1?) device? Your talking a 4-6 increase in throughput.

[majland]

>Be aware: There are a number of other 'USB 2.0' devices around that >aren't what you think. I mean it's still the same old product that had >USB 1.1 support, but now has a USB 2.0 interface.

That i snot necessary bad when we're taking about mpeg2 hardware encoders. They are based on the same chips as the internal pci versions.

So while the old usb devices has been restricted by the usb1.1 interface to lower bitrates. So even through the only thing one gets with an usb 2.0 interface is better bandwith it makes is possible to better utilize the "old" compression hardware that may be fitted in "a brand new box".

Youre probably right that the bungee and the pctv deluxe shares most things...

>I wouldn't buy any USB/Firewire capture device unless the store has a >good return policy. Good capping at 30-40 Mbps is well within USB 2.0

Remenber we're talking mpeg2 in hardware.

/Anders

[ItsMe]

[quote="donpedro
Did you mean this... ?

high-speed (480Mbps), full-speed (12Mbps) and low-speed (1.5Mbps) data transfer

Maybe you should say "B", too. I am still not sure what you ment...

BTW. I beleive that it supports USB 2.0 (I thought that this mean 480Mbps. Is there USB 2.0 device that does not support 480Mbps?)[/quote]

I did indeed mean 480 Mbps, and yes, apparently there are USB2 difices that do not support highspeed. One of the problems with USB1, is that it never achieves its maximum speed, except in short burst. This can be devistating when capturing video. I suspect any USB running at 480 Mbps
would be ok though.

[richlivi]

I suggest that you take a look at the Pinnacle support forum before buying. Pinnacle products have a habit on not working properly when first released, although when the bugs are ironed out, they are usually good products once there products mature a bit.

Also, check to see if the Pinnacle support "high speed USB2" as some USB products out there don't. If you don't know about the various USB2 speed, then do a search on Google.

Actually, it is supposed to have complete USB 2.0 support. Here's a quote from the press release, "Unlike "USB2-compatible" devices that only operate in USB Full Speed mode (up to 12Mb/s), PCTV Deluxe provides full support for USB2, which allows users to benefit from the much higher USB 2.0 bandwidth (up to 480Mb/s)."

That being said, unfortunately, it looks like their reputation for releasing buggy products continues with the PCTV Deluxe. Their support forum is actually beginning to receive some input, and things aren't looking too good from what I can tell. Example: as of three days ago, a Pinnacle support person (BBrode) stated (speaking of PCTV deluxe), "At this time there isn't any support for this product (YET)." Pinnacle released a product without support for it?? That makes absolutely no sense. But, to validate, if you go to the completel product listing in the support section of the site, PCTV Deluxe isn't even listed. I suppose you might be able to forgive them if it worked well, but people are already complaining about serious problems with it.

Still gonna keep waiting/looking for a good external firewire or USB 2.0 solution I guess.

[ItsMe]

Many hardware companies don't seam to be able hand to handle support properly. I used to have a Pinnacle PC TV Pro, and never get a reply from Pinnalce. Often you get, "did you remember to plug you computer on" type replies when you put a question to them on there forum, if they reply at all... Havingg said that, I was on the whole happy with the card, and still recomend it, dispite the crappy support.
I also had a Hauppage card for a couple of day, Hauppage also, never bother answering e-mail. Vidac, on the other hand always answer e-mail about there VMagic, the answers are very informative.

I was wondering, why do you wand a USB solution?