After Effects CS6 to AVCHD DVD - is it possible?

[Greg_R]

So far I have tried numerous encoders in an .mov file type, various .avi settings, as well as .mp4 and .h264. Basically, I can't output anything that AVCHDEncoder, Yamb, or tsMuxer will recognize as a valid file. I can't believe I'm the only one to have ever tried to create an AVCHD DVD from an After Effects project?

[sanlyn]

Why are you encoding from one lossy format and re-encoding to another lossy format? (And I don't know what you mean by ".avi settings". AVI is a container that can support many different encoders. SO can mp4). I save AE work as lossless, unencoded AVI and input it into any of several encoders with no problems. Perhaps you need to export to a format that your encoders will accept.

[budwzr]

DVD + AVCHD = NoNo

[sanlyn]

True. They are two different animals.

[Greg_R]

Thanks for the replies, just to be clear, I am trying to create an AVCHD disc, as defined here. If I render an uncompressed .avi with 96k/32bit audio, that file cannot be opened by AVCHDCoder. It plays just fine in Windows Media Player, and Quicktime. I also tried uncompressed Quicktime, and various forms of compression with no success. Can anyone tell me a particular combination of encoder settings to try? Thanks for your help.

[smrpix]

an uncompressed .avi with 96k/32bit audio

What happens if you try LPCM audio @48khz/16bit or AC3 @48khz/384

[sanlyn]

Uncompressed LPCM @48khx/16bit as smrpix suggests should be acceptable to any ACVHD or BR encoder, and DVD as well, and uncompressed or Lagarith/huffyuv AVI shouldn't be a problem either. The standards I've always used for BD and AVCHD with no problems are from here (BluRay Disc at top of page, scroll down for AVCHD as recognized by most players: https://www.videohelp.com/hd#tech

[Greg_R]

an uncompressed .avi with 96k/32bit audio

What happens if you try LPCM audio @48khz/16bit or AC3 @48khz/384

In AE CS6, if you slect 'None' compression for the video in an .avi container, you have no other encoding options for the audio.

[Greg_R]

Uncompressed LPCM @48khx/16bit as smrpix suggests should be acceptable to any ACVHD or BR encoder, and DVD as well, and uncompressed or Lagarith/huffyuv AVI shouldn't be a problem either. The standards I've always used for BD and AVCHD with no problems are from here (BluRay Disc at top of page, scroll down for AVCHD as recognized by most players: https://www.videohelp.com/hd#tech

I'm trying multiAVCHD now, as it seems to have a few more options, and gives me additional information. If I render an uncompressed Quicktime, the default audio option is AAC, with no ability to change bit rate. When I import that file into multiAVCHD, it tells me the video is 1920 x 1080, frame rate 29.97, and says Video: Unsupported in red. The audio shows as AAC 2ch. It might be worth mentioning that I only have 5 seconds of video, because I'm trying to get my workflow established before I render the whole project.

[Cornucopia]

an uncompressed .avi with 96k/32bit audio

What happens if you try LPCM audio @48khz/16bit or AC3 @48khz/384

In AE CS6, if you slect 'None' compression for the video in an .avi container, you have no other encoding options for the audio.

I think you are mistaken. However, even if it were true, you could just as easily output separate renders for the video only and audio only.

It's no wonder you are having difficulty, hardly any encoders & players that are intended for consumer use would accept 96k audio, let alone 32bit float audio. They are ALL geared toward 48k/16bit, 48k/24bit, etc.
You need to downconvert first from "studio master" quality to "distribution master" quality.

Scott

[Greg_R]

an uncompressed .avi with 96k/32bit audio

What happens if you try LPCM audio @48khz/16bit or AC3 @48khz/384

In AE CS6, if you slect 'None' compression for the video in an .avi container, you have no other encoding options for the audio.

I think you are mistaken. However, even if it were true, you could just as easily output separate renders for the video only and audio only.

It's no wonder you are having difficulty, hardly any encoders & players that are intended for consumer use would accept 96k audio, let alone 32bit float audio. They are ALL geared toward 48k/16bit, 48k/24bit, etc.
You need to downconvert first from "studio master" quality to "distribution master" quality.

Scott

I've taken a screen grab of the video and audio options selected. Let me know if I missed something. If what you're telling me is that the audio bit rate of my mp3 file is too high, I'll try pushing that down first.

[sanlyn]

Shouldn't audio be interleaved? What does "uncompressed" in that audio dialog mean? Does it mean PCM?
Will your encoder accept RGB32 input? AVCHD encodes as YV12.
Does "Include project link" enter video header info that throws off your encoder?
My old AE CS3 allows me to be more precise with most of those options.

[Greg_R]

Shouldn't audio be interleaved?

I don't know. Would that matter at all for an AVCHD disc?

What does "uncompressed" in that audio dialog mean? Does it mean PCM?

I don't know. These are out of the box settings for AE CS6.

Will your encoder accept RGB32 input? AVCHD encodes as YV12.

I don't know, and I'm not sure which encoder you are referring to. I am trying to get a file out of AE CS6 that will work in multiAVCHD. The consensus seems to be that an uncompressed .avi will work with no problems, but I'm having them. The screenshot shows what audio and video options I have for uncompressed .avi output.

[Greg_R]

I have found one combination of settings that does get accepted. It is a Quicktime container with .h264 encoding. Unfortunately, colors look like hell, and blacks turn to gray.

[sanlyn]

If it matters for MPEG, I should think it would matter for AVCHD, which is another version of MPEG. "Uncompressed" could mean AIFF, PCM, or a few others.

I have only two encoders that accepted RGB input.

There's more here than meets the eye. You might want to post some MediaInfo text on the output file described above. No one here can see any of those files.

[budwzr]

AVCHD = Another version of Mpeg = NoNo


AVCHD = Consumer BluRay = YesYes

[sanlyn]

@ buswzr my specs say BD and AVCHD disc use VC-1, MPEG2, and MPEG4. You're saying MPEG2 and MPEG4 aren't used in either? You're also saying MPEG2 and MPEG4 aren't two versions of MPEG? I must be hallucinating. Guess I'd better just go to bed.

[budwzr]

AVCHD = Mpeg10

VC-1 = Microsoft

Mpeg2 = DVD

HDV = Mpeg2

Whose on first? Maybe you're right. I never really payed attention to the Mpeg Standards. Yeah, seems like MP4 has a "Part 10". All I know is Apple tried to steal the MP4 extension for exclusive use in the very beginning. Even today, .MP4 defaults to Quicktime on a lot of computers.

Looks like VC-1 is MS's H264/AVC.

OK, I defer to you then. Just killin' time actually. [[[[ loud phart ]]]]. Waiting for a good post to come along. Bored. We still cool?

[Cornucopia]

an uncompressed .avi with 96k/32bit audio

What happens if you try LPCM audio @48khz/16bit or AC3 @48khz/384

In AE CS6, if you slect 'None' compression for the video in an .avi container, you have no other encoding options for the audio.

I think you are mistaken. However, even if it were true, you could just as easily output separate renders for the video only and audio only.

It's no wonder you are having difficulty, hardly any encoders & players that are intended for consumer use would accept 96k audio, let alone 32bit float audio. They are ALL geared toward 48k/16bit, 48k/24bit, etc.
You need to downconvert first from "studio master" quality to "distribution master" quality.

Scott

I've taken a screen grab of the video and audio options selected. Let me know if I missed something. If what you're telling me is that the audio bit rate of my mp3 file is too high, I'll try pushing that down first.

So what you're saying is that those shots are the settings you used to get an audio output of 96/32. Not going to happen, unless AE was totally buggy. I've got 3 different earlier versions of AE and there's nothing wrong with it's output: it gives you what you set it to.

...I just did a test in AE CS3 using a 96/24 file (that doesn't work in most players, editors or encoders). Dropped it into the timeline, set up a render Q, checked output to incl. Audio set audio to 44/16. Ran it...Boom!->File with Audio 44/16. Just like it should.

You must be doing SOMETHING ELSE. Or a bunch of something elses...

Now, about that other stuff...

AVCHD, once again, is not = BD. It is BD's little brother. BD allows VC-1 and MPEG2 in addition to AVC. AVCHD does NOT (hence the "AVC" in the name).

DVD includes a strict subset of MPEG2 (and of MPEG1), but it is NOT = MPEG2. MPEG2 includes more profiles & levels (including HD & higher bitrates), as well as more varied GOP structures. MPEG2 includes TS as well as PS/PES. BD also is a stricter subset of it's base infrastructure. AVCHD is an even STRICTER subset from that same base (though with a few variations from BD).

When you see the word "Uncompressed" in reference to audio, 99% of the time this = PCM. Which 99% also = LPCM. That is the codec. The format/container could be WAV (aka BWF, W64) or AIF, or SD2 (Mac-only, rare nowadays). Since this forum primarily caters to Windows users, you can for most intents and purposes equate Uncompressed = PCM = LPCM = WAV.
Or its equivalent when residing as the audio portion within an AVI.

Interleaving has to do with how the audio stream is placed in the MM container compared to the video stream. This is done to facilitate easier seeking in sync. If you do nothing, the default setup usually puts audio interleaved between the video in 1 second chunks. I've also commonly seen 1Frame chunks.

I said NOTHING about any mp3 files. IIWY, I'd output EVERYTHING as uncompressed and then compress using separate/external encoders that are better designed for the job. With mp3, that means LAME. And of course, you can FULLY set whatever parameters you need for the output, whether you are using the CLI or most LAME GUIs. Never seen one that COULDN'T be adjusted correctly. As long as you give it a decent, standard "distribution master quality" source. Not a 96/32 file.

Scott

[sanlyn]

Waiting for a good post to come along. Bored. We still cool?

Of course.

You must be doing SOMETHING ELSE. Or a bunch of something elses...

Now, about that other stuff...

Thanks for the clarification. As for the "something else's", I'd avoid MultiAVCHD anyway; I see complaints floating about. In any case, everyone could guess forever. Some MediaInfo or 10 seconds of video would be worth more than a thousand guesses.

[Nocturnaloner]

Ok, here's what MediaInfo says:

General
Complete name : D:\DOCS\movie\movie_6.mov
Format : MPEG-4
Format profile : QuickTime
Codec ID : qt
File size : 890 MiB
Duration : 5s 5ms
Overall bit rate : 1 492 Mbps
Encoded date : UTC 2013-10-08 00:49:20
Tagged date : UTC 2013-10-07 23:49:25
Writing library : Apple QuickTime
©TIM : 00;00;00;00
©TSC : 2997
©TSZ : 100

Video
ID : 1
Format : RGB
Codec ID : raw
Duration : 5s 5ms
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 491 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 29.970 fps
Color space : RGB
Bit depth : 8 bits
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 24.000
Stream size : 890 MiB (100%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2013-10-08 00:49:20
Tagged date : UTC 2013-10-08 00:49:25

Audio
ID : 2
Format : AAC
Format/Info : Advanced Audio Codec
Format profile : LC
Codec ID : 40
Duration : 5s 5ms
Source duration : 5s 184ms
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 128 Kbps
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Channel positions : Front: L R
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Compression mode : Lossy
Stream size : 76.5 KiB (0%)
Source stream size : 77.2 KiB (0%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2013-10-08 00:49:20
Tagged date : UTC 2013-10-08 00:49:25

Other
ID : 3
Type : Time code
Format : QuickTime TC
Duration : 5s 5ms
Time code of first frame : 00:00:00;00
Time code settings : Striped
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2013-10-08 00:49:25
Tagged date : UTC 2013-10-08 00:49:25

[sanlyn]

Might this have something to do with it? From the MultiAVCHD tutorial: http://multiavchd.deanbg.com/tutorial.php

Supported input FILE formats:

For video titles:

* MKV - matroska containter
* TS, M2TS, MTS - transport stream files
* AVI (DivX/XviD/AVC) - reencoding/uncropping required for DivX/XviD
* 264 - H.264 (AVC) elementary stream (video only)
* M2V - MPEG-2 elementary stream (video only)
* VC1 - VC-1 elementary stream (video only)
* MPG (MPEG) - MPEG-2 video files
* IFO - DVD playlists
* VOB - DVD video segment files
* EVO - HD-DVD video segment files
* MOD - Camcoder MPEG-2 recordings
* MOV - AVC/HDV3 encoded + AC3/PCM/AAC audio (rename MOV to MP4 if processing fails!)
* MP4 - Apple / Quicktime (may work only for AVC encoded video - no Sorenson and
other weird codecs)
* MPLS/MPL - Blu-ray playlist files / AVCHD playlists / multiAVCHD playlists
* TRP - DVR recordings

Nor do I believe that an x264 encoder will accept a 4:2:2 colorspace. YV12 only, I'd think.

I don't use multiAVCHD. This is one of the reasons why. But I installed it just now and tried some QT files that didn't meet the specs quoted above. They didn't work, either.

[Greg_R]

Might this have something to do with it? From the MultiAVCHD tutorial: http://multiavchd.deanbg.com/tutorial.php

Supported input FILE formats:

For video titles:

* MKV - matroska containter
* TS, M2TS, MTS - transport stream files
* AVI (DivX/XviD/AVC) - reencoding/uncropping required for DivX/XviD
* 264 - H.264 (AVC) elementary stream (video only)
* M2V - MPEG-2 elementary stream (video only)
* VC1 - VC-1 elementary stream (video only)
* MPG (MPEG) - MPEG-2 video files
* IFO - DVD playlists
* VOB - DVD video segment files
* EVO - HD-DVD video segment files
* MOD - Camcoder MPEG-2 recordings
* MOV - AVC/HDV3 encoded + AC3/PCM/AAC audio (rename MOV to MP4 if processing fails!)
* MP4 - Apple / Quicktime (may work only for AVC encoded video - no Sorenson and
other weird codecs)
* MPLS/MPL - Blu-ray playlist files / AVCHD playlists / multiAVCHD playlists
* TRP - DVR recordings

Nor do I believe that an x264 encoder will accept a 4:2:2 colorspace. YV12 only, I'd think.

I don't use multiAVCHD. This is one of the reasons why. But I installed it just now and tried some QT files that didn't meet the specs quoted above. They didn't work, either.

What would you recommend instead of multiAVCHD?

[Greg_R]

Sorry about the dueling user ids. The board told me that the old login didn't exist, now I seem to have the old ID and the new? Anyway, let me know what my options are for encoding.

[sanlyn]

Someone more familiar with the freebie encoders and converters would be able to help with that. I don't generally mix videos while they're still in various stages of different lossy encodes. When I use Avisynth, VirtualDub and/or After Effects I first decode everything to lossless AVI, edit, clean, apply any transitions, color, or whatever, then join 'em while they're still lossless and encode as a last step using one of these: HCenc or TMPGenc Plus 2.5 for SD-DVD, and TMPGenc Mastering Works, x264 Encoder, or TX264 for h264 and HD. The encoders see those files coming in with correctly sized frames in YV12 lossless format. I did work with purebred QT some time back (a wedding video), but that was decoded to lossless AVI as the first step and stayed that way until it was encoded, authored, and burned -- and that so-called "pro" photog made a big mess that took forever to clean up, darn it! It took several weeks (Moral: don't get too chummy with a new brother-in-law and make promises that will be harder to keep than you'd think).

[Greg_R]

It looks like TX264 will get it done. Sanlyn, thanks for your time and effort!