DVD-compliant CVD with CCE & other CCE questions

[huykin]

I am archiving my analog NTSC camcorder tapes to XCVD/XSVCD (352x480x29.97 interlaced). I use CCE 2.50 SP to encode the video (MPEG2 3-pass VBR 3400/2000/7000) & use TMPGEnc Plus 2.58 with Toolame plugin to encode the audio (MP2 48kHz mono 96k) and multiplex (Simple Multiplex). My APEX standalone plays it fine burned on a CD. But I also want it to be DVD-compliant, so when in the future I burn it to DVD, I don't have to reencode (at least video) and will be able to play those DVD on any DVD player. Here are a few questions:

1. What settings should I use in CCE to insure NTSC DVD compliance? "DVD compliant" under Video doesn't do any good - it increases resolution to 720x480 by adding huge black borders on the sides. In the thread discussing SatStorm's CVD guide, several people reported problems with the GOP structure. There were 2 suggested solutions: select "Close all GOPs" and select M=3, N/M=4 (instead of M=3, N/M=5) under GOP. (People mentioned that default is 3/5, but in my 2.50 SP default is 3/4.) Probably both of these solutions reduce quality. So do I have to do either or both of these to get DVD compliance? And which one reduces quality more? (CCE "DVD compliant" option doesn't alter either of these, nor CCE help says anything about doing either of these for DVD compliance. So it looks like CCE creators don't think it's necessary. Also the GOP length in CCE seems to be always limited to 15, so the GOP length should be ok for DVD, at least in theory. Am I wrong here?)

2. What is best to use for DC precision? Is the default 9 a good choice in my situation? Or is it better to set it to Auto? (CCE help says it's hard to predict the optimal value, so it looks like there may be a benefit in setting it to Auto. So that's what I am using now.)

3. If I encode without "Upper field first" checked, I get jerky output. If I check "Upper field first", I get smooth output. It's strange that I have to choose "Upper field first" in CCE, but the default "Bottom field first" in TMPGEnc works fine. (I believe my video is bottom-first.) I've read somewhere that there is a bug in CCE which always sets the field order flag to top-first, with the suggestion for bottom-first video to keep "Upper field first" unchecked (so it stays bottom-first), & later change the field order flag from top-first (incorrectly set by CCE) to the correct bottom-first, using another application (Pulldown GUI?). Do I really have to do this? (Just checking "Upper field first" seems to work ok.)

4. For video settings I use defaults except the following. I check "Add sequence end code" (CCE help suggests to have it checked, but somehow the default is uncheked), and "Upper field first" (as discussed above). These 2 are the only things checked on the left side under Video tab. I keep Luminance level at default 16-235, set DC precision to Auto, keep Timecode at default 01:00:00:00, and set GOP to M=3, N/M=5. I keep quality priority at default 25, and don't use the noise filter (if needed, I use noise filters in VirtualDub). I don't touch Advanced VBR settings. In the Misc settings I have everything checked (Try decoding in YUY2, Try decoding in 32-bit RGB, Use overlapped output). Also I don't think extracting video-only from the source AVI before encoding (as mentioned in one of the guides) is necessary, so I don't do it.

Given all this, is there anything I can do to improve the quality, or increase the encoding speed without reducing the quality?

5. When doing multipass VBR, is there any benefit in doing first a CBR or 1-pass VBR to generate the info file, as suggested in CCE help and some guides? (If I ignore this step, CCE automatically runs the first pass to generate the info file and then continues to other passes. So it's much easier to ignore it.) Also if I do 3-pass without generating the info file first, is it really 1+3 or 1+2 passes?

6. If I want to have chapters, is it better to use CCE chapter setting under file settings, or leave it all to the authoring program?

7. I have an old 500MHz PIII, 512MB PC100 RAM, Win2k. Does it make sense for me to try newer versions of CCE SP for the sake of speed, quality or anything else?

8. It looks like one can't have only MPEG sound in an NTSC compliant DVD, so I'll have to demultiplex, decompress to PCM or reencode to AC-3, and multiplex again. (Not big deal.) But is a single mono 48kHz PCM track compatible with NTSC DVD? (My source is mono.)

9. Are there any benefits in multiplexing (or encoding audio) with bbMPEG instead of TMPGEnc? (TMPGEnc Simple Multiplex is much easier, plus I don't have to use yet another application.)

Well, we don't want to go into double-digit question #s, do we? So I stop here. If you know the answer only to a couple of these, please feel free to reply.

Thanks!

[King Dick]

Just read your post, and whilst I use CCE in 720x576 PAL mode, some of the things I have found are relevant to NTSC as well - so here goes:-

1. The full DVD specification frame sizes are 720x480 NTSC or 720x576 PAL, so DVD compliant should not be checked if you want to retain your XCVD/XSVCD format which are not fully DVD compliant (although many DVD players will recognize these formats). If you really want full DVD compliance you would have to convert all your source material to 720x480 using Premiere or similar.
GOP lengths of 12 to 18 can be used in most circumstances, however 15 is almost always used.

2. I use a value of 10 for DC precision as I have very high qualiy source material to encode. I would suggest that if a setting of 9 is giving you acceptable results leave it as it is.

3. CCE 2.50 requires the "Upper field first" to be checked for NTSC sources - not checked for PAL. CCE versions 2.64 and 2.66 are exactly the opposite ! The 3:2 pulldown in most versions of CCE had many problems which is why most of the users on this forum prefer to do this operation with a frame serving programme. In CCE version 2.66 this function now works properly.

4. Your settings seem O.K., and "Add sequence end code" should be checked.

5. As I am familiar with the guides you mention, and work only with fully compliant DVD material, I can´t offer any comment on this question.

6. I personally prefer to use the authoring programme to insert the chapters, but this depends on the programme you intend to use and whether or not it will generate a new I frame for you at the chosen chapter point.

7. The short answer is no - later CCE versions are marginally faster, and the improvements in quality are only noticeable using near studio quality source material in full DVD mode.

8. If memory serves me correctly I believe you are right in saying NTSC DVD requires a 48 kHz PCM track - if I am not, then no doubt another forum member will correct me !

9. I cannot answer this question as I have no hands on experience with bbMEG. However, CCE 2.66 offers you a choice of 3 different audio outputs, and will produce a multiplexed output stream. There are those who will read this and say the audio encoding in CCE is terrible - that is only true for versions prior to 2.64.

Just one more comment. If you really want to speed up your encoding times, you need a much faster computer - however exactly what you would need should be the subject of another post.

Hope this is of some help to you.

[huykin]

King Dick,

Thanks a lot for a detailed reply. According to the info on this site, DVD standard is fully compliant with several resolutions, including the half-D1 352x480/576. So (X)CVD should be fully compliant, provided other settings (GOP, audio, etc.) are correct. I know that encoding time is roughly proportional to CPU MHz, just don't have time & money for a major upgrade (MB, CPU, etc.) right now.

Some of my questions haven't been addressed in detail. So I wonder if other experienced CCE users can drop a few lines.

Thanks!

[jtor]

I can add something on your question #8.

NTSC DVD requires audio to be either AC3 or PCM. However, there are authoring softwares out there that would allow you to use MPEG audio (it'll tell you about the requirement, but will ask if you want to proceed anyway). Advantage of this is smaller audio size, compared to PCM.

[King Dick]

Hello Huykin,

Just a point on DVD compliancy. A fully compliant DVD is 720x576, but other standards are compliant in the sense that most DVD players will accept them. However, with CCE if you check the DVD compliant box it will assume you want "full" compliance and will encode at 720x576 regardless of your source.

As the full DVD specification costs $13,000 or so, I doubt that many forum members have had a chance to read it !

Regards.