Multi-Language Subs

[DeathStalker77]

I have an .ASS file that has multiple sub entries (different languages) at the same timecodes (so all 3 display at the same time, one on top, one on the bottom, and the 3rd to the right side). The .ASS file plays perfectly with VLC, but I would like to author it to a proper DVD. The .ASS file also contains Kanji characters (one of the 3). Even though I have been able to successfully convert it to an .SRT I can't do anything with that .SRT (I was going to use TMPGEnc AW4 but it stops reading the .SRT file at the first Kanji character).

Does anyone have any ideas on this? I would like to keep the formatting from the .ASS file, if possible. I have the video file in MPEG2 format and I do not mind having it hardcoded into the video - in fact, that would make things easier in the end. Also, I do not want to re-encode/transcode the file.

Many thanks.

[Baldrick]

I have not seen anything that can convert ass subs and keep the style to a dvd with switchable subs. And hardcoding requires reencoding.

[DeathStalker77]

I was afraid you'd say that.

Ok, so I'm starting off from an HD (1900x1200) h264/DTS MKV (worst of all possible combinations for me) and I want to end up with a DVD compatible MPEG2 - what's my best option for the highest picture quality? I do not mind downmixing the DTS to Stereo (was initially able to downmix it to WAV and then to AC3).

Thanks for any assistance

[jman98]

Most subtitle programs only understand Latin character sets. To get them to read other character sets you usually have to take your PC and through the Regional and Language Settings option in the Control Panel tell Windows that for non-Unicode programs you want to use character set X, where X is whatever character set is appropriate for your subtitles. This may require a reboot and it may have undesirable effects on your PC. If you cannot read the character set you just chose, DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES attempt to do this unless you are willing for your PC to be unusable because everything is now in the language and character set you just chose and you don't know how to change it back.

If this is a Japanese TV show capture, many fan sub sites have lower resolution versions available already and you can find them via a web search. For best quality I'd suggestion using HCEnc to encode it down to DVD resolution. This will require some knowledge of AviSynth on your part.

[El Heggunte]

@ DeathStalker77:

MaestroSBT deals with multilanguage .SSA files,
as long as these are "encoded" in UTF-16 (or rather, UCS-2,
but this is an "irrelevant" detail for the time being).

So, probably you'd have not only to convert the .ASS file to a .SSA one,
but also tweak the font sizes and the display width & height.

[DeathStalker77]

Ok, so what would I use to convert .ASS to .SSA?

Unfortunately, I have never used AVISynth, so I have little knowledge of it. I can demux the .MKV to the .DTS & .h264 if that helps. I've only found a few encoders that will handle .h264 - virtually everything chokes on it. I haven't had a problem with Super, until I installed the newest version, which just crashes whenever it's run

[AlanHK]

Well, I just hard coded some ASS subs onto an MKV (they were originally embedded in it, extracted with MKVExtractGUI) and used HCEnc to make MPEG2 for DVD.

Simple script like this:

FFmpegSource2("Zipang_01.mkv",atrack=2)
# atrack=1: Jap  2: Eng
TextSub("Zipang_01_Track5.ass") # hardsub text info
AddBorders(8,0,8,0)
AmplifydB(8.33)

Note that you need to get ffmpegsource2 and vobsub packages for Avisynth for this, from:
http://code.google.com/p/ffmpegsource/downloads/list
http://avisynth.org.ru/docs/english/externalfilters/vsfilter.htm

Don't know how it would work with Kanji though.

[DeathStalker77]

What about effective conversion of .ASS to .SUP? Isn't there then a way to not only add the .SUP file to a VOB, but also to position the titles as desired?

Quite a frustrating position

I wanted to note that one converter I tried to use to hardcode the subs just placed them in a horrible position. I can't believe there's not a converter out there that can do what's needed - or at least handle the multi-subs with the same timecode.

[manono]

Not ASS, but SSA format subs can be converted to SST format subs (not SUP) used for creating selectable subs using Muxman or Scenarist when authoring. If you absolutely need the SUP file, it can be extracted from the authored DVD using PGCDemux.

What about effective conversion of .ASS to .SUP? Isn't there then a way to not only add the .SUP file to a VOB, but also to position the titles as desired?

ASS can't be converted to SUP directly, as far as I know. As for positioning, the selectable subs can be raised or lowered in the DVD using DVDSubEdit. You can't do much with ASS files as far as using them to make selectable subtitles for DVD. You can do quite a lot with SSA files. First you have to convert ASS to SSA. Me, I just change the extension and it works, but the ASS/SSAs I use aren't very complex at all, and they're in English.

And yes, SUP files can be added to DVDs, but first you need the SUP.

[DeathStalker77]

Hmmm, well I'll try the "easy" route first - rename the .ASS to .SSA and try Muxman. Maybe after that I can adjust positioning with DVDSubEdit (I've used that successfully before on other vids). Fingers crossed.



Well, Maestro wouldn't open the renamed file and SubStationAlpha (4.08) will not install on 64-bit

Any other ideas for .SSA to .SST converters?

Thanks!

---------------------------------------------------

Ok, was able to convert the .SSA to .SST with SubtitleWorkshop (could probably have done it from .ASS to .SST as well, will try that if this fails) - muxing it now.

[El Heggunte]

Ok, so what would I use to convert .ASS to .SSA?

.ASS is .SSA version 4.00+ ,
so, removing a "+" is all it takes.

Any semi-decent text editor can do that.
Even suckwares like Wordpad and Notepad.

However .ASS can go even more "fanciful" than .SSA,
therefore, sometimes the "downgrade" is not so trivial.

BTW, and JMNSHO, unless one is a karaoke-maniac,
there is no point in creating .ASS subtitles, to begin with.

Sub Station Alpha v4.00+ Script Format

http://cid-5acf098e0ebae8d5.office.live.com/self.aspx/.Public/ssa-specs.pdf

[DeathStalker77]

There are no "+" signs in the .ASS file. Tried converting the original .MKV with ConvertX v4x - video & audio were fine, subs were screwed up - especially where the Kanji was.

This is ridiculous that it will play fine as the .MKV, but not in any other fashion - even the .ASS file works with an MPG/AVI just fine. I can't believe there is no way to effectively convert, separately or together, these items in a satisfactory manner. It's not like this is pre-1999 or anything.

[Ai Haibara]

You might try Subtitle Workshop (not sure about the current betas), for converting ASS to SSA. Aegisub might be able to do it, but I'm not sure.

[manono]

There are no "+" signs in the .ASS file.

After opening an ASS file in Notepad, at the top:

[Script Info]
; Script generated by Aegisub 2.1.8
; http://www.aegisub.org/
Title: <untitled>
Original Script: <unknown>
ScriptType: v4.00+
Video Aspect Ratio: 0
Video Zoom: 6
Video Position: 0

[DeathStalker77]

Yes, the .ASS file has -

[Script Info]
; Script generated by Aegisub 2.1.8
; http://www.aegisub.org/
Title: Default Aegisub file
ScriptType: v4.00+
WrapStyle: 0
PlayResX: 1920
PlayResY: 1032
ScaledBorderAndShadow: yes
Video Aspect Ratio: 0
Video Zoom: 6
Video Position: 0
Last Style Storage: Default


Still have not found an effective way to get the subtitles converted or added (converting the a/v was the easy part!) Don't understand how they can play so nice & easy within the .MKV (or with any other format for that matter). MUST be a way to effectively get the .ASS formatting into DVD formatting, hard or soft coded.

[manono]

His point was that by removing the '+ it can then be renamed as a compliant SSA file. You countered with There are no "+" signs in the .ASS file which, as I pointed out, isn't quite correct. This may allow you to create an SST file for use in Muxman. Why don't you upload the ASS file for us to play with so we can test it out?

[DeathStalker77]

Tried removing the "+" and renaming it .SSA - Maestro didn't like it.

Here's the original .ASS file.

[manono]

Thanks. I got them to open OK in MaestroSBT but haven't time now to play with them . Football's on. Later on.

[DeathStalker77]

Ok cool. Any help would be appreciated

[El Heggunte]

As I had said, and as I had forgotten as well,

.ASS subtitles are #$%¨&*!!

FWIW, my MaestroSBT is version 2.6.0.0,
and it requires the input .SSAs to have the "Timer" field,
and the colours MUST use the "non-hex" coding.

[Script Info]
ScriptType: v4.00
Collisions: Normal
PlayResX: 1920
PlayResY: 1032
Timer: 100.0000

[V4 Styles]

I opened the original .ASS file (pun intended) in Notepad,
saved it as a new Unicode text, and edited it as needed.

HTH

[DeathStalker77]

Is that code all I have to change in the file?

[El Heggunte]

Of course not
You will have to translate the hexadecimal colour values to
"normal" ones, and also tweak the font sizes and text-positioning.
There is no such thing as DVD-subpictures @ 1920x1080.

[DeathStalker77]

Well, that was one of the problems with the .MKV (aside from it being an h264 mkv) - it was HiDef. I can locate a hex color translator, but what can I use to re-position (or at least determine the new positions of) the subs? (I know nothing about creating or modifying subs, as you can probably tell). I have the video itself already converted to MPEG2, if that's of any help. I was hoping to be able to locate a program that would be able to convert the .MKV itself into an MPEG2 with all the sub adjustments made and hardcoded.

[El Heggunte]

Given that you seem not to like Avisynth

you might open your re-encoded .MPG in VirtualDub,
and load the .SSA through TextSub (from VSFilter.dll).
Remember to change PlayResX to "854" and
PlayResY to "480" before starting to mess around.

[DeathStalker77]

I was under the impression that VD/VDMOD would only output to AVI? Why would the values be 854 & 480 rather than 720 & 480?

[manono]

He's just talking about learning how to edit the subs by opening them in VDub.

Me, I won't be much help because I've had no experience with Unicode and don't know how to keep programs from either rendering some of the strange stuff (Kanji?) as squares and other weird shapes, or dropping those lines altogether. However, without those lines it's fairly simple to get Maestro to output SST subs for authoring with Muxman. In fact, I've done it. Also, the ASS subs use some peculiar fonts which, if you don't have them installed on your computer, will be converted to Ariel. It's easy enough to change them to something else, though.

I replaced the stuff at the top of the ASS file with stuff from an SSA file and then changed the extension. Seemed to work OK.

[DeathStalker77]

Yes, the truetype fonts were included in the .MKV. If it's of any help, in addition to the 1080i version, I have a 720p version as well. I can install Kaji as fonts on my system, but I don't know that will resolve the issue - as I've said, the .ASS file plays fine with any format video.

[DeathStalker77]

Still trying get this worked out Nothing I've tried seems to work.

[DeathStalker77]

By the other recent posts, seems I'm not the only one having "issues" with .ASS subs (hmmmm, might be something to that extension, eh?)

[DeathStalker77]

BTW, the files open fine in Aegis, but they do not properly convert to .SRT, and I still see no way of hardcoding them in a conversion to .MPG.