TMPG MPEG 2 CONVERSION, PLAYBACK JERKY.

[tony2k]

Hi

I followed the guide here https://www.videohelp.com/tmpgencdvd to convert an avi file to DVD. When i checked the playback before burning it, it seems really jerky especially during fast movement. I burnt it anyway with Ulead dmf2, and it looked even worse on a stand alone player. Is there anyway round this???

Also when converting with tmpg the avi file freezes but the sound carrys on (this also happens in win med player when i watch the file). This stops the conversion. How do i get round this??

Thanx in advance for any advise

[Rambo78]

Have you encoded a NTSC 23.976fps source to PAL 25fps
with TMPGEnc? That causes jerkiness.
Regarding that the video freezes but not the audio sounds like you have bad frames.

[tony2k]

thanx for the reply man.

if i converted a nstc source to pal in TMPG would this course the jerks in fast movements and general jerky playback???also if i convert too nstc instead of pal in TMPG can i change the format when i burn?? (i.e with ulead dmf2?).

also how do i overcome the bad frames problem so i can encode properly the whole movie in one go with TMPG.

thanx man.

P.S how do i tell if my source file is PAL or NSTC (i thought it didnt matter with avi files)

[Rambo78]

There are several guides on how to fix bad frames on this site.
Regarding "changing the format" after encoding I take it like you mean change the framerate, I don´t know how to do that. If you want to change the framerate you should do it before encoding.
8)

[bugster]

To check the framerate and other info on an avi, open the file in virtualdub and select file->file properties.

As far as framerate goes

23.97fps, encode to NTSC with 3:2 pulldown.
25fps, encode to Pal
29.97fps, encode to NTSC

As for being in a PAL country, NTSC is unlikley to be a problem. Most if not all DVD players will handle NTSC format video's. In this case they will output either NTSC signals, in which case you need a NTSC capable TV. Many are even if they don't advertise the fact. Otherwise they will output PAL-60 (60 fields per second PAL) Again, practically all TV's sold in eurupe in the last 10-15 years will handle this and/or NTSC. Try one. Because if you can get away without doing framerate conversion life is a lot easier.

If you are in NTSC land however, the reverse is not so often true and PAL capable TV's are rare.

If you do need to do framerate conversion, there are guides on various methods for this in the convert section. If you still have problems come back and ask again.

Hope this helps.

[jbenj01]

bugster,

i'm converting PAL-xvid/avi files (25fps) to NTSC-DVD (23.976), using virtualdub and tempenc 2.5plus. i'm re-encoding video only in tmpgenc and using besweet to create an ac3 audio file. here are my questions:

i understand that i need to convert fps from 25 to 23.976.. in tmpgenc, since my source files are PAL,

1. i load the PAL-DVD template, yes?? (or should it be PAL-SVCD template)??

2. in the advanced tab, do i check "Do not framerate conversion"?? or leave unchecked? if checked, why? is it b/c the template tells tmpgenc to do the framerate conversion?

also, the framerate conversion guide on this site does not indicate which template to be used but i now understand it should correspond with my source file (thanks qeef!).

thanks bugster.

[bugster]

bugster,

i'm converting PAL-xvid/avi files (25fps) to NTSC-DVD (23.976), using virtualdub and tempenc 2.5plus. i'm re-encoding video only in tmpgenc and using besweet to create an ac3 audio file. here are my questions:

i understand that i need to convert fps from 25 to 23.976.. in tmpgenc, since my source files are PAL,

1. i load the PAL-DVD template, yes?? (or should it be PAL-SVCD template)??

2. in the advanced tab, do i check "Do not framerate conversion"?? or leave unchecked? if checked, why? is it b/c the template tells tmpgenc to do the framerate conversion?

also, the framerate conversion guide on this site does not indicate which template to be used but i now understand it should correspond with my source file (thanks qeef!).

thanks bugster.

First, frameserv from virtualdub to TmpGenc, video only. Change framerate in virtualdub to 23.97fps

1) No, load the NTSC DVD template. Afetr that load unlock.mcf from the extras folder and make the following changes.
Encode Mode 3:2 pulldown when playback
Framerate 23.976fps (internally 29.97fps)

and any other changes you want (such as Rate control mode etc)

2) yes, if frameserving from virtualdub as described above.

The thing about using the template that matches your source file framerate is general advice if you DO NOT want to change the framerate and hence the TV standard you are encoding for. If you see my previous response, us europeans are lucky in that we can normally play NTSC material whereas most american TV's can not play PAL.

Hope this helps

[tony2k]

Hi,

what settings do i need to change in TMPG to get the picture to stop being really jerky. My source file has a 23976 fps rate.to get a perfect copy what must i change in settings???i was encoding to pal at 25 fps originally, this is where i got really jerky playback, can anyone help me with this as i have been unable to solve this playback problem.

thanx

[antoniosgubba]

If I try to encode an NTSCfilm (23.976fps) movie I end up with jerky video too.....I solved this by using virtualdub to change the framerate to 25fps and stciking the audio through Goldwave to timestretch it to match...then encode with TMPGenc using the PAL template. Result=nice smooth video

[chopster]

antoniosgubba

How exactly did you get the converted files to match up in tmpgenc ?
I am keen to go down this route to get smoothness too but after converting the framerate to 25fps and then converting its audio in Goldwave to match as you have done , when i choose both these files as video source and audio source accordingly in the project wizard i still get lipsync problems which lead me to think that somehow maybe the time stretched audio did not get selected as audio input as i thought

Any ideas ?

Have since found out that you can save avi in virtualdub with no audio ,
but when i load in time stretched audio into tmpgenc the audio is still out of sync. Is Goldwave doing its job ?

[antoniosgubba]

Goldwave always works perfectly when I use this method...remember though that even an error of half a second in the end time will produce horrible sync problems, so its important to make sure you work out the exact length to convert to to the nearest 1000th second if possible.

What I do is this....

Extract WAV from original movie with virtualdub (full processing mode, no compression, convert to 44100)
Convert original movie to 25fps with virtualdub (NO audio, video=direct stream copy, change frame rate=25...save as avi, name movie as "movie"25.avi)
Open WAV with goldwave...you will see goldwave gives you the exact length of the WAV to the nearest 1000th second....maybe this is where you are going wrong...you MUST calculate this time in seconds only, for example 1 hour 35 mins 25.456 seconds is 5725.456 seconds. Then you multiply this number by 0.95904 in this example it becomes 5490.941 seconds...then you must convert this back to hours/mins/seconds, which is 1 hour 31 mins 30.941 seconds.
Click on effects then time warp, click the "time" circle and enter the new time then click OK...goldwave will now convert the WAV to the new time (takes a few minutes). When its done save the new WAV as "movie"25.wav

Then use "movie"25.avi and "movie"25.wav as the sources in TMPGenc using the PAL setting....DO NOT use any other settings such as 3:2 pulldown etc.

Just one thing to remember...and this is important...when calculating seconds back into hours/mins/seconds, remember that, for example, 0.25 minutes is NOT 25 seconds!!!...it is 15 seconds.

[antoniosgubba]

***EDIT***

I just noticed you are making DVDs.....I use this method to make SVCDs, although I'm sure it will work just as well for DVDs. The only thing I'm not sure about is whether you have to leave the audio at 48000 for DVD instead of converting to 44100..if this is the case then ignore the bit about converting to 44100.

[chopster]

cheers thanx mate

Will try this tonight , will come back if any probs ........watch this space

[Smokey And The Bandit]

Ok basically for the jerky playback to stop, go into Tmgpenc and when you are converting to mpeg2 (dvd) MAKE SURE use choose video movie in the content of video box in the project wizard...it works for me and should work for you!

Hope this helps

[chopster]

smokey

for an ntsc movie should the setting in tmpgenc not be 'film movie' as opposed to 'video movie' especially if the original is in 23.976 fps ? as this encodes the source with '3:2 pulldown when playback' which should result in a smoother playback ?

Correct me if i'm wrong someone

[antoniosgubba]

I always thought film movie should be used with NTSCfilm (23.976) and video movie should be used with NTSC (29.something)

Anyway, when I encode a 23.976 movie the option to change it from film movie is greyed out.

I find all this 3:2 pulldown far too confusing anyway I've always found converting to PAL gives the smooooooooothest possible result.

[chopster]

antonio

i agree converting it into 25fps in vdub first does give smoooooth results , pity i still can't get the stoopid audio in sync

Did what you said to a tee after much head scratching ( where did you pull the figure 0.95904 from ? ).
Basically my 1 hr 37 min 37.960s file became 1 hr 33min 38.019s.

Now when i come to choose the 25fps movie with this saved out audio file i still get the dreaded sync problem.

Hmmm ...what next ?

[antoniosgubba]

Hmmm...

First off...0.95904 is the ratio of 23.976 to 25 (23.976 divided by 25)...so if you convert the video to 25fps then multiplying the audio by 0.95904 converts by the same ratio.

Ok...is the sync problem a constant one?..ie, is the audio to video sync the same throughout the movie?...or does it get worse as the movie progresses?...I would suspect that it stays constant throughout the movie, but you can check by encoding a small section at the beginning and near the end to see if its the same.

Another thing to check is whether the original 23.976 movie and the original WAV have the same length...I just encoded a movie that had 8 seconds less audio than video ...and the audio didn't start until 8 seconds into the movie! I had to add 8 seconds of silence to the audio to match it up...(you can do this also with goldwave)

So, if the audio is out of sync by a constant rate throughout the movie, estimate how far it is out (watch someone's lips or a door slamming etc) and add or remove a bit of the WAV at the beginning to compensate..this will probably take a few tries to get it spot on, but I just did exactly that and got it perfect with about 30 minutes of trying.

You might just have a problem movie....The method I described works for the vast majority of movies I encode...but there is the odd exception, and it looks like you've unluckily come accross one on the first attempt!

[Simms]

To Chopster
NB: this method below will give you a audio synced, smooth Pal VCD. Would like to give you Pal SVCD option but I get jerky playback on my computer and of course the DVD player. But the audio is in SYNC.
1. VirtualDub...extract audio,full processing, ...audio,convert to 41000Hz. Save.
2. select no audio and select video, direct stream copy and convert frame rate to 25 fps. Save avi.
3. PLace both back in virtualdub if you need to cut the movie to make it smaller for converting to SVCD. Save both as seperate video and audio both direct stream copy.
4. Key point for you is to use Beesweet. Have very limited knowledge on all this converting stuff. So have read alot of posts and guides. Then have experimented and have selected bits from very guide that I can understand so making it as simple as possible for me. God some people blow my mind with the stuff they know. Incredible shit but as I have mentioned it is beyond me.
Anyway download Beesweet and the accompanying GUI file. See Tools section. (GUI file gives you a user friendly Beesweet interface).
Load the audio file. Select NTSC to Pal. Select wav-Stereo. Priority class to high. Select WAV to WAv..........now will have a Pal, 41000Hz wav file.
5. Stuff this audio file and the video file into TMPGenc wizard. 1st though select VCD PAL.Load files then select 4:3. Select anything else you like in settings. Then start the mpeg-1 encoding.
This will give you a audio sync pal VCD.
Let me know if it works for you.
If anyone can helpme to make a non-jerky PAL SVCD please help. I think it must be something to do with the conversion of the sourse 480X320 to PAL 480X576. So therefore a setting in TMPGenc.

[Smokey And The Bandit]

ok ok...i had all the same problems as you lot! I did a conversion from NTSC to PAL and anything else that might work.....what you have to do is extract the sound from the xvid video in Virtual Dub as a .wav file, but make sure that its on full processing, then when you come to convert it in TMPG chose the original xvid file for the video and the .wav file for the audio. Then make sure that you chose Video Movie.....dont worry about the film Video thingy just try it with this and its guaranteed to work.
If its greyed out then you will have to see what codec its been encoded with..... but all Xvid films will work non jerk in all dvd players and pcs as long as you choose VIDEO MOVIE hope this helped ohh and one more thing make sure you have sorted out all the environmental settings (direct draw and stuff )

And dont bother converting to Pal either try this then if it dont work then try something else and once you have encoded it make sure that you burn it to a dvd RW to test it...because some times it doesnt refesh fast enough on the computer and looks like its out of sync, but it actually isnt out of sync once burned onto a dvd rom

Have fun Kids

[chopster]

Thanks guys

Simms : I am converting to DVD but although some settings maybe different ,namely audio the rest is probably just the same.

Smokey : Your version of things seems to be a lot easier so will give this a try now and post back in a sec . If this does not work then will give simms version a shot, though don't know if this sorts out lypsnc probs.

Latest Update :

Smokey your guide seems to work on the couple of minutes i tested albeit a split second out of sync though not too bad , will keep in mind what you said about the computer refreshing so will reserve my judgement till it is fully encoded and burnt to DVD-RW to check to see just how jerky the resultant disk may or may not be .

Will keep all informed , thanks

[antoniosgubba]

Simms....Using Besweet would be sooooooooo much easier to convert audio from 23.976 to 25. I've never been able to get it to work though

I've tried everything you suggested many times in the past...but besweet crashes on me the moment I hit GO...thats why I use goldwave now... Chopster it might be worth you trying it though...maybe besweet just doesn't like me very much

[chopster]

Right guys,

Using Smokey's method reduced my lipsync problems to a split second but using same method on another xvid i was having massive problems cured it !!!

On the topic jerkiness , i'm a bit embaressed to admit this , but i was thinking about it for a while and have discovered that while i was using an ntsc template in Tmpgenc i was then authoring the resultant mpg in DVD Workshop in a Pal template..... doh !
I was wondering why this was taking so long to author as obviously it was re-encoding from ntsc to pal and that would explain the jerky video playback.

Anyway thanks again to all for posting

[majkol]

hi everybody!

its like this:

i have the .avi divx MPEG-4 Low-Motion...704x480, 23.976 fps (by the way: Night Of The Living Dead-1990)

i would like to make a svcd with tmpgenc but i always get a jerky video. i tried pal, ntsc, a lot of combinations.... i tried the wav audio source too, but it was the same thing. never sync problems but jerky playback

could someone tell me all the settings that i have to make? when i open the video source it "loads" a Judging field order thing (why?) and settings below go to: Interlace; Bottom field first(field B); 4:3 525 line(NTSC, 704x480); Video movie
do i have to change that or not? (i tried both leaving it like that and changing to non-interlance; 1:1 (VGA))
i dont change nothing else, should i??
something else...3:2 pulldown? environmental settings???

ps: i dont bother about pal or ntsc(yet, since my dvd player will probably be ok with both...


thank you for replies!!

[chopster]

...erm look within this site....

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/userguides/119019.php

[majkol]

chopster: i tried that, but its for xvid, it was even more jerky

i tried reset settings in tmpgenc (VFAPI plug-in) then do NTSC to PAL svcd conversion, the result was MID jerkyness
if i did NTSC to NTSC it was LOW jerkyness, but it still was
as it played in windows it played in the dvd player, no change
neither was there a change if i burned in nero as pal or ntsc

i tried to frameserve but when i hit start converting in tmpgenc i got the message: The error occurred when ACM was initialized

[Simms]

To Chopster
I to am confused.
My source is 23fps Xvid. Can creat NSTC VCD and SVCD. Only problem is that the color is not correct.
So went with PAL VCD. Excellent but wanted a sharper image. So went with PAL SVCD. Now have jerkiness!!!!!
Tried progressively lowering the CBR until a finally I reached the VCD CBR. Still my SVCD PAL attempt resulted in jerkiness.
So what is the difference between PAL VCD and PAL SVCD if the CBR is the same??????? 352X288 for VCD and 480X576 for SVCD. IS this where the problem lies????????????
Have read the guide you pointed to. Thanks.
God I hope it works.
Will try now.

[savage]

ok lads, i have done every thing that antoniosgubba has done but im still getting jerky play back.
i have extrcted the audio done the maths and used goldwav to change the audio but, the audio is still out and the film is still jumpy what am i doing wrong. i so much want to burn films, but im wwrecking more than its worth.
i hate those xvid movies i NEED help soon.

[antoniosgubba]

Savage...several things you might like to check:

Have you altered any of the enviromental settings in TMPGenc?...my method uses purely the default settings...I found that altering the enviromental settings, especially the Direct show priority, caused horrible jerkiness....if you've changed anything and you are not sure what the default settings were then reinstall TMPGenc and you will have all the settings at their default.

Did you use the FourCC changer on your movie to make TMPGenc think it was a DivX rather than an Xvid?...I do this with every Xvid movie and it works!

You changed the video framerate to 25fps and you are using the PAL template (or PAL settings in the wizard) yes?

Post back the original time of the audio (find it out with goldwave to the nearest 1000th second)...and also what you time warped the audio to....I'm not saying you got your maths wrong but a second opinion is always helpful!

[savage]

cheers for the reply mate, but i have returned the settings on tmpgnc to default and put the setting direct show to one, now the video is fine but the audio is off.....
and hey my maths is not bad matey. lol
1 hour 25 mins and 00.912
and i got 1 hour 21 mins 31.9780000000000000008secs