VHS field order

[aagancia]

when capturing VHS, what field order should i use?

top or buttom field first?


thanks

[jlietz]

edit

[vhelp]

TGIF all

Actually, the field order will depend on your Capture Device.
Some cards will capture with certain fields order's first.
.
For example, if you use your DV devices, they will capture (set to) Bottom
field first. While most other cards will capture Top field first.
.
But, there's also a twist/screw. With Analog capture cards, you can use
various CODEC's. And, depending on these codecs you use, some may have
the feature to capture w/ 'user configurable' Field Order settings
I think that Morgan's MJPEG codec does this, for instance.

-vhelp 3111

[pijetro]

Hey VHELP, any suggestions on apps that determine the .AVI's field order??

Thanx...

[Blazey]

Cap the AVI and then bring it into TMPGEnc or whatever and it will tell you what field order the file is. Then be sure to MATCH it on the output of the encoder when you convert to MPEG.

[jlietz]

When I want to find out the field order of an existing file I just open the file in the TMPGEnc wizard. It will tell you the field order, along with aspect ratio.

[lordsmurf]

VHS doesn't have a field order.

It depends on the capture device and format.

[vhelp]

@ pijetro

As I said earlier, it depends on the capture device. If you have
a DV device of any kinds, the short answer is Bottom field first for
every !!
Otherwise, read on..

In any event ...

This can sometimes be tricky. But, there are a number of manual
methods to figure this out. And, depend on my many approaches (have have
many) each one will provide the answers. It just depends on my project.

For me, finding the correct field order is basically an eye thing by now
for me. First, you have to have the eye for certain 'attributes' of
the video source. Then, you have to have an understanding of your capture
device.

But, now this for sure. If your device is DV (advc-100 or dv cam) you
can imediately set for Bottom Field. I have never run up against
a TOP Field source, when running through a DV device.
.
So, if your capture device is DV, you have no problems, and your final
answer is always Bottom Field.
.
.. Sometimes, it's the MPEG Encoder software app that is at fault
.. or buggy (look at TMPGenc ver 12a, it's fields were labled incorrectly
.. and misslead everyone to using the wrong field order
.. So, be watchful and wise to this setup.
.
If your capture device is an regular Analog capture card, then you have
to do a little homework. In most cases, the video captured will
be Top Field first. But, sometimes the source is (if MPEG) encoded
wrong, and will be Bottom Field first (i've seen some)
.
Also, if your project aim is:
.
* use a Hardware MPEG and capture 12/mbts
* re-incode w/ filtering etc.
.
Then, you have to worry a little, because certain hardware MPEG capture
cards will encode there video to Bottom Field first, and not top.
.
Or, other times, when using a hardware MPEG card, it depends on the
source's field order, being captured. Sometimes, it's Top, when
captured, and other times, it's Bottom. Maybe it's an auto featrue of
the hardware mpeg card. I don't know.

If your using an Analog capture card, and throw in a CODEC, then you
have to know a few things.
.
* Does your Codec incorporate a feature to swithc on/off Field Orders ?
* Does your Codec do this automatically ?
* Does your Codec detaul to only one Field Order ? ..which one ??
.
The only way to know these, is to capture w/ every codec and log each
one's differenct.
.
Also, your Analog capture card (codec or not) will set the final Field
order. You just have to note each type of capture project, and log it
down for future use.

Testing Field Order ...

There is simply no reason to test each given capture source project
for correct field order when your projects are the same. No need to
do it for each captuer. In other words, if your capturing from VHS,
and you find that your field order is TOP, then there is no need to
test for future ongoing VHS capture project, that forward on.
That goes for any other capture type proejcts (ie, laserdisc; tv; cable;
satellite; etc) Now are you starting to get the eye yet ??
Well, in time. Anyways.

So far:

* DC10 plus card is Bottom field first
* DV cams / advc-100 / dac-100 are Bottom field first
* pretty much everything else (analog cap card'wise) is Top Field first

-vhelp 3113

[winifreid]

Another problem has to do with terminology. TMPEnc indicates that my captures are top field first, but I have to select bottom field first when I encode with CCE and B field when I encode with Ulead and top when I encode with TMPEnc. So even knowing doesn't really tell you what to select.

[The_Doman]

When I have installed new drivers/codecs or changed configuration I always make a few short testclips on dvd or svcd to see if everything is playing ok on my TV.

[thecoalman]

and B field when I encode with Ulead .

Not sure which product your using but that was changed in the last update for MSP, not sure about the others. It's now lower or upper.

[aagancia]

thanks for the usefull info guys. I'm using a winfast tv 200 xp. But I guess the best way to know the best results is to try each of them and seee which looks better.