Wireless Mic to Camcorder Help

[bowmah]

So we are needing a wireless mic to do some video podcast shooting. Can we simply purchase this wireless setup:

http://cgi.ebay.ca/NEW-40-CHANNEL-wireless-cordless-lapel-tie-microphone_W0QQitemZ3600...QQcmdZViewItem

and use a 1/4 inch adapter (to change 1/4 inch to 3.5 mm) so the wirless base can be plugged directly into the camcorder? The camcorder is 3.5 mm and wireless module is the large 1/4 stereo (microphone) plug.

[edDV]

That is unlikely to work well. Pay attention to real user reviews.

I'd look at Azden, Nady or Sony in the $60-150 range for minimal quality.


PS: If this is a one time need, you can rent a quality Shure system ($400up to buy) for $25-50 for a weekend. Call local A/V rental stores.

[bowmah]

We wanted to see if the camcorder would record using an external PC mic. We did a test using a good PC headset and only plugged the mic into the camcorder. The sounds was surprisingly bad as compared to the on-board mic. I am beginning to wonder if the on-board external mic circuitry is causing the bad sound? Would that be possible?

Also, would the 1/4 inch adapter allow the camcorder to record using the wireless system?

[Soopafresh]

ed's advice is sound. Plunk down around $140 or so and get something decent.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYlhDGrw_eA

[edDV]

We wanted to see if the camcorder would record using an external PC mic. We did a test using a good PC headset and only plugged the mic into the camcorder. The sounds was surprisingly bad as compared to the on-board mic. I am beginning to wonder if the on-board external mic circuitry is causing the bad sound? Would that be possible?

Computer mics usually don't match camcorder mic levels or impedance. Consumer camcorders use high impedance, low levels. Pro camcorders use 600 ohm unbalanced or balanced levels similar to a recording studio.

What is your camcorder?

Also, would the 1/4 inch adapter allow the camcorder to record using the wireless system?

That depends on the camcorder and the wireless mic specs. The cheaper wirless mic systems intended for consumer camcorders will have a 1/4" plug and the right levels. If you are adapting a pro 600 ohm "XLR" mic, then you will need a matching transformer like this.


http://www.dvwarehouse.com/Shure-A96F-Camcorder-InterfaceLine-Matching-Transformer-p-34684.html

[bowmah]

Thanks for all the input. They are definitely appreciated! The Azden looks like a great product. Unfortunately, to ship outside of the US, most ebay sellers want a hefty price. Has anyone used this one, seems like a lot of happy customers:

http://cgi.ebay.ca/NEW-40-CHANNEL-wireless-cordless-lapel-tie-microphone_W0QQitemZ3600...QQcmdZViewItem

The camcorder is a Panny GS120 (SD).

[bowmah]

Just found out from a local music store that I should look into the Audio Technica Pro 88w. Anyone use this system before? Seems it's a little cheaper from an ebay supplier:

http://www.audio-technica.com/cms/wls_systems/f706c310ed826ec4/index.html

http://cgi.ebay.ca/Audio-Technica-PRO-88W-Wireless-Microphone-System-NEW_W0QQitemZ1102...QQcmdZViewItem

[edDV]

Thanks for all the input. They are definitely appreciated! The Azden looks like a great product. Unfortunately, to ship outside of the US, most ebay sellers want a hefty price. Has anyone used this one, seems like a lot of happy customers:

http://cgi.ebay.ca/NEW-40-CHANNEL-wireless-cordless-lapel-tie-microphone_W0QQitemZ3600...QQcmdZViewItem

The camcorder is a Panny GS120 (SD).

I bought an Azden WMS-Pro Kit over 10 years ago to tape a friend's wedding. It is the same mic featured in that You-Tube movie. It has served well for basic tasks countless times since then but in no way compares to the Shure T/VP series that I rent for serious work. Still it is a good investment and plugs directly into a typical consumer camcorder.

That ebay link you have there should be considered junk unless you can find some user reviews that indicate otherwise.

The problem with a camcorder like the GS120 is the inability to turn off auto audio gain control. As a result you get volume pumping with overreaction to loud and soft passages. It is what it is.

[bowmah]

Thanks for feedback! I just spoke with a local music store and they suggested I look at the Audio Technica Pro 88w. Here is the listing from ebay: http://cgi.ebay.ca/Audio-Technica-PRO-88W-Wireless-Microphone-System-NEW_W0QQitemZ1102...QQcmdZViewItem

Thsi looks like a great unit except I think it's being discontinued. Anyone else know how this set compares to the Azden WMS Pro?

[bowmah]

By the way edDV, I have this to try and decrease the gain noise from the GS120. That should help compensate when the external mic is used correct?

http://www.thesource.ca/estore/product.aspx?language=en-CA&product=4202559

[edDV]

By the way edDV, I have this to try and decrease the gain noise from the GS120. That should help compensate when the external mic is used correct?

http://www.thesource.ca/estore/product.aspx?language=en-CA&product=4202559

Here is the problem for such camcorders. When all is quiet (e.g. when the wireless mic is turned off) the AGC turns gain (and noise) all the way up*. When the mic is turned on there is a loud click followed by the AGC pumping gain down so that when someone starts to speak, he can't be heard. Then the gain adjusts slowly to the speaker until some other ambient noise causes gain to adjust down. If the speaker goes silent, the AGC pumps gain/noise back up.

What you want is constant medium gain so you can fix levels in post. Gain pumping is difficult to fix.

Setting mic gain before feeding the camcorder won't help since the AGC compensates. If you adjust too low the gain and noise go up eventually causing clipping. If you adjust the other way it's the same as having no gain control at all. By the way that headphone pot won't work for a microphone. You would need an active pre-amp. Headphones are medium level and low impedance, a camcorder mic input is low level and needs to maintain high impedance.

Pro and prosumer camcorders can switch AGC off and have manual level controls per mic often with VU or peak meters. BTW, the GS-400 had an AGC switch and manual audio level controls.


* Many report this phenomena as "motor noise" when the internal mic is used. It is caused by gain pegging near max when the surroundings go quiet.

[bowmah]

Hey edDV, I just got the chance to test the gain input device and it works like a charm. The high gain issue has been resolved. When you turn the volume knob down with the external mic, it takes and the final recorded volume sounds much better.

So it looks like time to purchase the Azden WMS Pro, thanks all for your great input. Let me know if there is anything else I should keep an eye out for.

[edDV]

The Azden WMS Pro should be OK for video podcast shooting. Think of the sound quality difference between that and a rented Shure system is similar to the difference between AM and FM radio.