Convert HuffYUV to smaller size

[klavz]

I'm currently capturing VHS tapes in HuffYUV format.
I want to convert those files to a smaller file size for archival purposes (maybe high-bitrate MPG or H.264, idk?). Also, I want to keep the footage INTERLACED.
Do you have some suggestions?

Thanks.

[ProWo]

I'm currently capturing VHS tapes in HuffYUV format.
I want to convert those files to a smaller file size for archival purposes (maybe high-bitrate MPG or H.264, idk?).

I would recommend h264 or h265

Also, I want to keep the footage INTERLACED.

Why?

[klavz]

Deinterlacing with QTGMC would take enormous amount of time... I have about 150hrs of VHS material to transfer and just imagine how long would that take.
That's why I want to keep it interlaced and then deinterlace it when needed.

[ProWo]

Deinterlace with bwdif or yadif.
Try it with clever Ffmpeg-GUI.

[Alwyn]

I don't know if you're intending to update your computer in the near future, but to put your mind at rest about how QTGMC (=Fast, MT mode) goes if you do, I'm getting 220 frames a second into CRF 10 H264 using VDub2's x264, 720x576. That's 400% over play speed. My computer specs are in my profile.

[pandy]

I'm currently capturing VHS tapes in HuffYUV format.
I want to convert those files to a smaller file size for archival purposes (maybe high-bitrate MPG or H.264, idk?). Also, I want to keep the footage INTERLACED.
Do you have some suggestions?

Thanks.

Question is what kind of bitrate is your goal? And if you willing to keep interlace then probably H.264 is best one (for H.265 you probably need to split fields so in future you will be forced to combine them before getting normal video).

[Alwyn]

I'd just buy another HDD, either for your computer (internal) or in an enclosure. Keep your analogue captures in pristine, original condition until you're ready to edit them. A 6TB drive should cover 150hrs easily. And don't forget to keep a backup of them.

[Alwyn]

If your only concern is storage space, Lagarith (LAGS) is half the size of HUFF. You can "Fast Recompress" HUFF to LAGS in VDub. A HUFF file I have here is 6.3GB, whereas the same LAGS file is 3.2GB (for a 10 minute video).

[pandy]

If your only concern is storage space, Lagarith (LAGS) is half the size of HUFF. You can "Fast Recompress" HUFF to LAGS in VDub. A HUFF file I have here is 6.3GB, whereas the same LAGS file is 3.2GB (for a 10 minute video).

Lagarith can be unstable so for archive purposes is rather risky choice - better alternative is FFV1 - in archiving role FFV1 is used by many institutions.

[Alwyn]

Lagarith can be unstable

First I've heard of that.

FFV1 is even better on space though: my test file comes in at 3.0GB for FFV1. But can it be opened by the major NLEs?

[pandy]

Lagarith can be unstable

First I've heard of that.

I've personally experienced issues with Lagarith, from time to time some people reporting issues on this forum - not saying Lagarith is bad but if you experienced issue then you avoiding it - this was my point.

FFV1 is even better on space though: my test file comes in at 3.0GB for FFV1. But can it be opened by the major NLEs?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FFV1?useskin=vector#Applications_supporting_FFV1

Btw for archiving you can perform transcode - not so big issue - editing in FFV1 especially if GOP higher than 1 is used may be suboptimal.

[Sharc]

Lagarith can be unstable

First I've heard of that.

FFV1 is even better on space though: my test file comes in at 3.0GB for FFV1. But can it be opened by the major NLEs?

Years ago there has been concerns over at doom9. As lagarith has not been updated since AFAIK it may still be the same (?).
FFV1 with GOP=1 opens on all NLEs I am aware of. Try it.

[Alwyn]

Try it.

I don't have any "major" NLEs.

[pandy]

Try it.

I don't have any "major" NLEs.

So no problem IMHO - archival codec may require conversion to other codec - there is compromise between size (coding gain) and coding/decoding speed - this is valid for lossless and lossy codecs..

[Leanoric]

I find this thread slightly alarming as I've worked my through quite a lot of tapes now, all of them captured and archived with lagarith.

Can I just check that these setting are correct before I begin converting them to FFV?


[Attachment 72805 - Click to enlarge]


[Attachment 72806 - Click to enlarge]


[Attachment 72807 - Click to enlarge]

FFV1 with GOP=1 opens on all NLEs I am aware of. Try it.

May I ask what GOP=1 is and how do I implement it?

[Sharc]

I find this thread slightly alarming as I've worked my through quite a lot of tapes now, all of them captured and archived with lagarith.

Can I just check that these setting are correct before I begin converting them to FFV?


[Attachment 72805 - Click to enlarge]


[Attachment 72806 - Click to enlarge]


[Attachment 72807 - Click to enlarge]

FFV1 with GOP=1 opens on all NLEs I am aware of. Try it.

May I ask what GOP=1 is and how do I implement it?

It is the default AFAIK. I am currently away from home, so I cannot confirm.
I don't think you have to worry much if your lagarith captures and subsequent encodes run without issues.

[Leanoric]

It is the default AFAIK. I am currently away from home, so I cannot confirm.
I don't think you have to worry much if your lagarith captures and subsequent encodes run without issues.

They seem to run fine, that said, I havent watched through all of them so maybe they dont.

Ill have a play around with FFV. The smaller file sizes is quite appealing.

[poisondeathray]

FFV1 has higher compression mainly because of larger GOP size (temporal compression) . Lagarith is I-frame only, or GOP=1 . If you disable FFV1 temporal compression you lose much of the advantage in terms of compression . Temopral compression makes it more difficult to seek and edit (slower, higher latency) . Vdub2's bundled FFV1 looks like it does not have control over the GOP size

FFV1 is generally not compatible in NLE's , except open source ones (shotcut, kdenlive, etc...)

Lagarith is more compatible in NLE's but YV12, YUY2 variants are not handled as lossless, except open source ones

[pandy]

They seem to run fine, that said, I havent watched through all of them so maybe they dont.

Ill have a play around with FFV. The smaller file sizes is quite appealing.

In my case Lagarith issue was some strange posterization, false color - video was there, easily recognize shapes and contours but wrong color (it looks like some default VGA palette applied - 256 colors) - had this issue few times with Lagarith proper setup (not only in Windows but also using ffmpeg Lagarith) - to be honest never investigated this and simply switched back to HuffYUV that always work OK for me, for archive i use FFV1 and even with GOP=1 (seem using GOP higher than 1 is anyway not recommended and may be in future not even possible).

[lollo]

I'm currently capturing VHS tapes in HuffYUV format.
I want to convert those files to a smaller file size for archival purposes (maybe high-bitrate MPG or H.264, idk?). Also, I want to keep the footage INTERLACED.
Do you have some suggestions?

Thanks.

For archival purposes just save the original raw captures. Nothing else.

[Sharc]

FFV1 is generally not compatible in NLE's , except open source ones (shotcut, kdenlive, etc...)

Yes. I had open source NLEs in mind.
Thanks for clarification.

[Leanoric]

I converted an 83gb lagarith file to FFV1 using vdub. It ended up only 2gb smaller at 81gb. Its not recognised by windows legacy media player, not that that matters, it plays fine in mpc. Ill probably stick with lagarith for now as I havent had any issues so far.

[jagabo]

Yes, I find that huffyuv to lagarith conversions of yuy2 (YUV 4:2:2) video from VHS typically saves only 5 to 15 percent.

[pandy]

I converted an 83gb lagarith file to FFV1 using vdub. It ended up only 2gb smaller at 81gb. Its not recognised by windows legacy media player, not that that matters, it plays fine in mpc. Ill probably stick with lagarith for now as I havent had any issues so far.

FFV1

Supported pixel formats: yuv420p yuva420p yuva422p yuv444p yuva444p yuv440p yuv422p yuv411p yuv410p bgr0 bgra yuv420p16le yuv422p16le yuv444p16le yuv444p9le yuv422p9le yuv420p9le yuv420p10le yuv422p10le yuv444p10le yuv420p12le yuv422p12le yuv444p12le yuva444p16le yuva422p16le yuva420p16le yuva444p10le yuva422p10le yuva420p10le yuva444p9le yuva422p9le yuva420p9le gray16le gray gbrp9le gbrp10le gbrp12le gbrp14le gbrap10le gbrap12le ya8 gray10le gray12le gbrp16le rgb48le gbrap16le rgba64le gray9le yuv420p14le yuv422p14le yuv444p14le yuv440p10le yuv440p12le

FFV1 is can be recognized if filter installed - same case as for Lagarith.