Question about PAL on current U.S. Philips machines

[amckinney]

I recently replaced my old Philips DVD-726 with the new DVP-5982, as my old deck was having difficulty playing home-burnt PAL DVDs (an overseas friend records British off-air telly for me).

My question isn't what you might expect, though. Currently, I'm using the player like most others: to play the PAL discs on my NTSC television, using the player's built-in converter.

HOWEVER, I noticed that the menu system of the current players (including the 3960 and I guess all other current models) has left out the PAL and MULTI choices in the TV TYPE (COLOUR SYSTEM/TV SYSTEM) menu. The only choice that is displayed is NTSC.

In my current setup, that's not a problem, but I hope to upgrade to a HD set one day, one that can display a native PAL signal (I saw some such sets in the USA recently made by Sharp). My old player (and other older models like the DVP-642) would allow you to switch the TV type from NTSC to either PAL or MULTI so that the player could output the native signal to devices that could handle it (like multi-system TVs or external standards converters).

Does anybody know if there is ANY way (whether by remote hack or some other method) of restoring the MULTI and PAL options to the current range of players? This change seems a totally unnecessary handicap on Philips part. Wouldn't surprise me if they did this to eliminate tech support calls from clueless people who didn't know they needed to switch from the "old" factory default of MULTI to NTSC to be able to view their PAL discs...

This is really puzzling (and a wee bit aggravating)...

[Krispy Kritter]

I don't have an answer for your question, just a comment. Just assuming your assumption is correct, the number of calls received most likely greatly outweighs the number of actual users needing PAL in the US market. There are very few TV's in the US market that will display PAL. This option was likely available in the past because they were sharing the firmware between player models in different regions. You can't fault a company for trying to save a buck, especially when their market is mostly for "bargain" players.

If anything, this is just another option to look for on a player for those that want/need this function.

[amckinney]

As I said, if they removed the functionality for that reason, I can certainly understand why they did it, but it makes me think that there is probably a secret remote code tucked away in there somewhere to change the colour system. I was just wondering if anyone else ever found a way to fix this, as I'm sure I'm not the first person to discover that PAL and MULTI have gone missing.

I know with old Sampo players, in addition to a menu feature, you could toggle colour system by a remote control code. It wouldn't surprise me if there wasn't some such code to switch colour system for other world markets (so that the folks in Region 2-UK without multisystem TVs don't make the same kinds of calls).

As for looking for other players that retain this feature: when I was replacing my 726, I did look at/research several players from different manufacturers. I thought I had a new player (a Samsung) when I discovered it has a nasty habit of "pausing/freezing" on just about any disc, no matter what the region or colour system. I just decided to stick with Philips because although they're a "bargain" brand, their PAL/NTSC playback and reliability has been (in my experience) the most stable of any brand I've owned (or tried).

Oh, well. At the very least, this player should get me by until such day comes that I go shopping for a HD set (I'm certainly in no hurry, unless my 32" CRT lays down and dies).

[lordsmurf]

If the machines are made for an NTSC market, don't count on a secret menu or anything else.

[victoriabears]

It is strange as the 5960 still has the output choice.

[amckinney]

It is strange as the 5960 still has the output choice.

That is precisely what makes me think that PAL and MULTI are still somewhere on the player, just hidden. I would bet that this player is exactly the same machine (hardware-wise) as the version being sold in PAL countries, just that the colour-system switching is now "hidden". I'm sure Philips, knowing their "budget" status, couldn't be bothered to make two different sets of hardware for PAL and NTSC countries. I'm certain these machines are still capable of multi-system output, just that the firmware is hiding it.

If there weren't capable of this, then why would Philips bother to continue putting the standards-converter inside? Looks like they'd do like Panasonic and make them NTSC-only.

[amckinney]

Well, I found a solution on my own and I am posting it here for the benefit of other U.S. DVP-5982 owners.

The solution is to go to the Philips support/dowload website, and choose "United Kingdom/English" as the default. This will take you to the U.K. download site. Then, go to the support page for the DVP-5982 (which is the UK version of the US 5982, just a different model number).

When I downloaded the manual, I discovered the NTSC/PAL/MULTI choices are still in the UK firmware, so borrowing a trick I saw here about flashing US Samsung players with foreign firmware, I figured the same should work on a Philips.

You would need to download the UK firmware upgrade for the 5980/05. Download, unzip as the instructions say, but don't burn that CD just yet!

Like I saw on the tip for Samsung players, you will have to rename the two binary files. Change them from DVP5980_05.bin and DVP5980S_05.bin to DVP5982_37.bin and DVP5982S_37.bin (you're just substituting the US model number for the UK one). Burn these two files to a CD-ROM and follow the instructions provided in the accompanying documentation. This will trick the US player into accepting the UK firmware.

You might want to do as I did and download the US version firmware (from the US download area) as a backup plan in case something goes wrong.

If you're like me, your Philips splash screen will be black-and-white when the upgrade is completed. Just go to the video setup menu and toggle off of, then back onto NTSC to "fix" the display back to normal. You will now note that you may now also choose PAL or MULTI.

If you compare the documentation for the US and UK firmware (players 5980 and 5982), you will see that both fix the exact same issues. Makes me think they're the same firmware apart from the things "hidden" in the US version.

[victoriabears]

you are to be given the gold star for achivement, I wonder if the same fix works for panasonic combo players, I have a us one identical to the uk one, well might give it a try !

[amckinney]

Well, I spoke too soon, at least in my case. For some reason, if I use the UK firmware on my US player, I end up with NO AUDIO! I noticed the analogue audio setup menus are a little bit different on the two players, so since I'm using analogue audio (Red/White), that' s probably why I have no sound.

I don't have any way to test whether digital audio is still okay or not, so U.S. USERS: TRY ABOVE HACK AT OWN RISK!

Sor for now at least (until I go hi-def someday), I'm forced to revert to the US firmware (which is why I downloaded the US firmware upgrade: as a safety measure). When I stuck in the upgrade disc, though I got "unrecognised disc" message. Why? Because flashing the 5982 with 5980 firmware essentially turns the player into a 5980. So, how to revert to the US firmware? Burn a disc with the US firmware files re-named to reflect the UK player's model number (same trick to get it to use the UK firmware in the first place).

Can confirm that this works, so as long as you have both versions saved with both sets of names (real and fake) and have them clearly labelled, you might want to experiment and see if you get better mileage than I did (if you have other audio possibilities than I have).

Bottom line: if you're in the US and the only audio connection you can make is analog (red/white), don't even bother with this hack.

[chits007]

Hi,

I just puchased this unit (5982 US Model)...but I have a PAL TV. When I connect DVD player with TV it doesnt shows any colours.?
Did any body got any success ?

I tried putting TV in AUTO (colour system ) mode ; but still it doesnt work why ?

[victoriabears]

strange your tv has an auto option, is it a toshiba by chance?
tried another output from the dvd player, given previous posts I did not think this dvd player could be changed from NTSC output?

[amckinney]

strange your tv has an auto option, is it a toshiba by chance?
tried another output from the dvd player, given previous posts I did not think this dvd player could be changed from NTSC output?

Because this DVD player's firmware will only output an NTSC signal! To get it to work with your PAL television, you could always try the above-mentioned "Hack" that I tried earlier, but you might be advised to try it using Australian firmware rather than the British firmware, since I already know the British FW doesn't work, presumably because the UK unit has SCART and the US doesn't. The Australian player, however, has the same AV outputs as the US unit.

Unless you're really confident in what you're doing, though, you might not want to try. Your only option, then, would be to hope that someone finds another way to unlock this player, or take it back to the store and get an "older" Philips model that does still contain the TV type switching (or, import a foreign player, like the UK one).

[chits007]

The TV I have is some local INDIAN brand...even my camcorder was showing B/W picture..

then I tried with Sony Trintron (Analog Model)..camcorder works fine; and I have seen AUTO color system mode (NTSC/PAL etc) there also..
I guess most of TV atleast i have seen Sony Samsung LG has AUTO option...

I guess I will first try my DVD Player with SONY/SAMSUNG before trying the hacks..

What you all say ? with AUTO whether the unit sends NTSC or PAL the TV automatically adjust to it i guess so..

And why your TV doesnt have AUTO option ?

[Krispy Kritter]

NTSC forces the player to output NTSC. PAL forces the player to output PAL. Auto allows the player to alter the output based on the source material. So in an unlocked unit, if you play a PAL disc, it will output PAL. If you play a NTSC disc, it will output NTSC. Auto should only be used if you have a TV that can accept NTSC AND PAL, otherwise, set the player to the format of your TV.

A picture,but lack of color, is a sign of sending the wrong format to your TV (ie: PAL to a NTSC TV or vice versa).

[chits007]

Hi Krispy,

I am taking of putting the TV in AUTO and not the player; if the TV is in AUTO ; it can display all kind of Video whether NTSC or PAL . I know Sony TV has AUTO option .

Will check and post here.

[Krispy Kritter]

Hi Krispy,

I am taking of putting the TV in AUTO and not the player; if the TV is in AUTO ; it can display all kind of Video whether NTSC or PAL . I know Sony TV has AUTO option .

Will check and post here.

The TV setting won't affect how the player operates. But if you have a TV that can accept both formats, then there is no reason not to have it set to AUTO. In which case you will also want the player set to AUTO to prevent the player performing format conversions.

[chits007]

Ok I went to my friend who has SONY TV and the player work fine with all colours ( note that i haven't applied any updates or firmware chages (UK and Australia).

Sony support all Scan FORMAT ( NTSC 3.58/NTSC 4.43/PAL ).
The DVD player output in NTSC ( 3.58 variant). So I guess no issue for now. Now I am planning ti buy a 32" LCD TV, I will just make sure it has NSTC also.


Few things

1) This player doesnt support H.264 decoding ? Any Firmware update will solve the problem ?
2) I used 4 GB Kingston it worked fine ; then I used WD 120 GB (2.5" usb powered) , the player didn't detect the drive. I googled and found many has this problem. Is their any fix solution. ? I partitioned the drive < 30 GB each and FAT32 file system

I also have a 500 GB Seagate External powered ;will check that ( I need to format in FAT32) ; Any Limitaion on Partition Size ?

[amckinney]

I have finally discovered a solution to make this player into a multi-system unit for those who have multi-system TVs and don't want everything converted to NTSC. Here's what you do:

1. open the tray
2. press "3" on the remote. The word "MULTI" should appear in the upper corner of the screen. Now, all NTSC discs will be output as NTSC, and all PAL discs will be output as PAL.

I don't have a multi-system TV (yet), but I know this works because when I tested it on my NTSC television, the screen went "black and white" once I got the MULTI message. I stuck in a regular NTSC disc to test, and full colour was restored to the picture (and restored to the splash screen when I popped it out). Next, I inserted a PAL disc, and it rendered a black-and-white picture, proving true multi-system output.

It wouldn't surprise me if this hack works on most (if not all) of the current Philips decks that no longer include PAL and MULTI as menu selections.

Note: The above process does NOT restore the TV type choices to the menu system (that would take a firmware change, presumably). However, if you wish to revert to "NTSC-only" output (say, you're moving the unit to the kids room to use on their NTSC-only set), simply go back through the setup menu system, go to TV Type and reselect "NTSC". Voila!

I didn't find a remote hack to put the player in PAL-only mode, but I suspect there probably is one. Besides, most people with PAL TVs probably wouldn't be buying the US player, and most PAL sets are multi-system anyway.

At least, this is a solution that doesn't involve risky flashing of the deck with foreign firmware![/b]

[amckinney]

I think I should point out that this MULTI unlock (by using the "3" button on the remote) does not work for any Philips players that were released after the wave of players the 5982 belongs to.

This means that players such as the 3980, 3982, 5990, 5992, etc. can not have the the TV Type changed from NTSC in this manner. Pressing the "3" button now just chooses NTSC again. Seems Philips must know that the secret was out and disabled it in the firmware for the newer players.

Just thought I should post it as a warning to people who (like me) bought one of these players (the 5990) to get the added benefit of USB 2.0 and (wrongly) assumed the MULTI unlocking code might still be in place.

I don't suppose anybody knows of another unlocking code (via remote) that will work on those "next generation" machines? I understand Philips wanting to avoid unnecessary customer service calls by hiding PAL and MULTI in the TVTYPE menu, but for the life of me, it doesn't seem fair to withhold a MULTI code, since it is possible for some of us in the USA to have a desire to display PAL material as PAL, since some flat panel TVs sold here now include PAL as an option, and it's perfectly legal to import/play non-region-coded PAL discs (and not to mention swapping "home videos" from friends in PAL-land).

[amckinney]

I must post an update to my previous posting. I bought a second 5982 in anticipation of needing another multi-system switchable player that is fully upscaleable, and it turns out that the "3" code does not work on that particular 5982! I updated the firmware to the same version my "old" 5982 is running, and it must be something other than firmware that is disallowing this hack. Maybe Philips discovered it and had it removed sometime during production? Really disappointing! So, if you need this feature, don't buy one without seeing if the seller will let you test this hack (or test it for you).

[jman98]

Thanks for the update, amckinney. We've seen before that some models will have subtle hardware changes during production so that what you get today as that model is different from what was sold, say, 6 months ago. This could be going on with your player. This kind of thing can break hacks that used to work.

Even good old reliable Philips, who a few years almost did not have any DVD players that could not be hacked, now seems to have caved in to Hollywood's demands. Almost everybody has stopped producing DVD players that can be hacked. I am puzzled at both why the manufacturers were willing to give in so easily (did they get paid off?) and why Hollywood actually believes this is "helpful" to stop piracy when it will actually increase piracy. People outside of region 1 now have no reason to buy region 1 DVDs and will simply turn to bootlegs and other forms of distribution to get copies that have had the region coding removed.

[jagabo]

Note the hack the OP refers to is not a region free hack, but the ability to force the player to output PAL or NTSC. I suspect this is simply a matter of Philips attempting to reduce support calls from north American customers who accidentally switch to PAL and can no longer see the menus to switch back to NTSC. When playing a PAL disc the player automatically converts to NTSC.

Region free hacks still work on the DVP-5990 as per this thread: https://forum.videohelp.com/topic367359.html

[amckinney]

Note the hack the OP refers to is not a region free hack, but the ability to force the player to output PAL or NTSC. I suspect this is simply a matter of Philips attempting to reduce support calls from north American customers who accidentally switch to PAL and can no longer see the menus to switch back to NTSC. When playing a PAL disc the player automatically converts to NTSC.l

Oh, the region-free hack still works, it's just that you can't force the player to multi-system output mode (by using the "3" key with the tray open). The "new" 5982s now behave like all of the current US models: NTSC is the only output choice that is enabled (and with the "old" 5982, you couldn't see PAL or MULTI in the menu system, either, but at least there was that remote code).

I should compare the manufacture dates of my two 5982s and post an update (should anyone have an interest).

[MysticE]

The 5982 and the 5990 (2) may be different manufacturers as I've read that Philips is just lending it's name to Funai products now. As a side note I was also rather surprised that Consumer Reports gave the Philips DVP5992/37 a nice review:

CR's Take
Very good overall performance and a good choice for use with an HDTV; but there are better choices for use with a standard-definition TV.

Highs
Excellent 480p picture quality when playing film-based DVDs. Very good 480p picture quality when playing video-based DVDs. Very good overall ease of use. Has USB port; reads MP3, WMA, WMV, DivX, JPEG files from portable flash drives.

Lows
Only good 480i picture quality when playing film- and video-based DVDs. Lacks S-video output; can't provide best quality video to standard-definition TVs.