Semi-Pro Mic Recommendations

[daamon]

Hi all,

I've filmed a number of friends weddings to gain practice in terms of planning, preparation, types of shots, editing etc. and to also learn lessons. So far, I've used a Canon XM2 with nothing but the standard in-built mic - I've experimented with both manual and automatic settings.

Unsurprisingly, one of the main lessons I've learnt is the audio aspect of the footage (some of you may have seen this thread).

In general it's been "OK", but at the top end of amateurish at best.

So, I've done some searching in this ("Audio") forum but couldn't find anything. I did read an interesting review in an article posted by guns1inger, which has prompted me to seek advice from those more in the know than me...

So, here's a rough set of criteria:

1) Will mostly be required for weddings or similar settings. May go on to do outdoor work - holiday videos whilst exploring the great Aussie outdoors.

2) Most probably I'll be a "one man band".

3) Looking for decent audio reproduction, picking up source - either only or predominantly. "Decent" defined as better than the mic on the cam, but not approaching (expensive) pro levels.

4) Price: Not cheap, not stupid. Vague, I know - but I've no idea what a budget should be. Let's say above average at the pro-sumer / high street level.


I'm thinking:

A) Radio (lapel) mic - Cons: Restrict me to bride / groom / priest (or whatever their title). Pros: Good sound.

B) Some kind of shotgun mic - Cons: Not such good sound(?). Pros: More versatile in it's usage. Then there's the question of uses for "Cardiod", "Super Cardiod" and "Lobar / Gun" and any other variations...


So, for those of you who are experienced, what audio set up would you use for a keen amateur who's prepared to dish a few pennies, but not go stupid? If possible, can you include brands and even models? I really am clueless when it comes to this...

If you have any alternative, please share them listing their pros and cons. For example, I was toying with a radio mic to a mini-disc recorder and just using a decent mic on the cam for good quality ambient audio / singing etc. Cost might be a bit scary - but there's always eBay...

Oh, and any hints / tips on mounts and connections to the cam (XLR?) etc. are welcome too.

Many thanks... Daamon.

[Redd]

Absolutely love my Rode VideoMic . For an on cam mic it's the best.

[thefiddler]

Wow! I'm glad you pointed out the Rode VideoMic Redd. I've been looking for a good shotgun mic in the lower-end price range. At $150, this one's a little more expensive than I had hoped, but it seems like it's well worth the price. I should be getting one in the next month or so....

[edDV]

We all wish that a camera mounted mic would work but it's only good for 5-20 feet depending on ambient sound. Expect lots of coughs and chair squeaks.

Remember this thread?

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=268824&highlight=shure

Shotgun needs a people pointer with headphones to track subject movement and you can't shoot from too far back. An omni or semi directional close in is a better solution.


Directional mic audio guy accessory.

[daamon]

Remember this thread?

Indeed I do - But I forgot that you'd put all those links in there. Oops...

In fact, I've recently bought batteries for my original DV cam coz I remembered your tip of a second cam on a tripod. And I've checked out that Beachtek equipment too.

Shotgun needs a people pointer with headphones to track subject movement and you can't shoot from too far back. An omni or semi directional close in is a better solution.

How close would I need to be for an omni or semi-directional mic fitted to the cam?

[edDV]

Shotgun needs a people pointer with headphones to track subject movement and you can't shoot from too far back. An omni or semi directional close in is a better solution.

How close would I need to be for an omni or semi-directional mic fitted to the cam?

It depends but news audio guys want to be inside 10 feet for directional, out of shot ofcourse .

Further back and ambient sound dominates.

Very few pros rely on a cam mic for voices unless the room is very quiet. They normally use that track for ambient sound.

[edDV]

Absolutely love my Rode VideoMic . For an on cam mic it's the best.

Redd please tell us about your experiences with the Rode VideoMic. It looks cool.

[daamon]

@ edDV - So it's looking like a lapel mic then... This will give me the freedom to roam with the cam.

@ Redd - Yes. I'd be interested to hear too... Thanks.

[edDV]

@ edDV - So it's looking like a lapel mic then... This will give me the freedom to roam with the cam.

@ Redd - Yes. I'd be interested to hear too... Thanks.

Lapel or hand hold for the minister is best. If it also feeds the PA, the minister will know how to handle it. It's their business.

If you are renting, a hand hold works great later as an interview mic and for passing around for reception speeches. Everything works best if you coordinate with the wedding planner to have one mic feed both the PA and your camcorder.

[J. Baker]

I have the ATR20 and ATR25 shotgun mic but the ATR55 is a good choice for $50USD.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Audio-Technica-ATR55-Short-Shotgun-Microphone-NIB_W0QQitemZ7339604...QQcmdZViewItem

[daamon]

OK. Cheers. Unless I can enlist any help, I'll be a one-man-band...

I think I'll look into renting / hiring a lapel mic.

[edDV]

OK. Cheers. Unless I can enlist any help, I'll be a one-man-band...

I think I'll look into renting / hiring a lapel mic.

I found a gregarious young lady who knows everybody works best as an assistant-interviewer. "Do you have something to say to the bride and groom?" Ask the bride or one of the mothers to assign someone.

You as cameraman will need headphones plugged into the wireless receiver to know what is being said.

[daamon]

I found a gregarious young lady who knows everybody works best as an assistant-interviewer. "Do you have something to say to the bride and groom?" Ask the bride or one of the mothers to assign someone.

Ah.. You mean actually commandeer someone form the guest list? Nice...

Especially if "gregarious young lady" = "attractive bridesmaid"...

[edDV]

I found a gregarious young lady who knows everybody works best as an assistant-interviewer. "Do you have something to say to the bride and groom?" Ask the bride or one of the mothers to assign someone.

Ah.. You mean actually commandeer someone form the guest list? Nice...

Especially if "gregarious young lady" = "attractive bridesmaid"...

Exactly, you want a gregarious self starter. Bridesmaids usually have other plans, you want a free floater. Teach her the hand mic and follow her around. Work out hand signals because she won't hear you. 3 - 2 - 1 go

In the last wedding I taped, I got a "life of the party" type and she enjoyed it as much as anyone. She loved playing TV reporter and looked great on cam.

Ah.. You mean actually commandeer someone form the guest list? Nice...

I was doing it for free so I felt entitled to ask for help.

[daamon]

Knowing my luck, I'd get lumbered with some doddering old grandma...

Cheers for the tip though - I'd never thought of that.

So...

1) Lapel mic (probably hired) for bride / groom / priest (whatever) during the ceremony.
2) Hand-held mic (again, probably hired) with gregarious volunteer for the reception.

Presumably both would be radio mics feeding to a unit (Beachtek?) on the cam that'll then record it all.

I've been following the thread on field recoring equipment with interest. Would that have any use for my needs?

How's that sound (pardon the pun) for a set up?

[edDV]

Knowing my luck, I'd get lumbered with some doddering old grandma...

The bride or bride's mom will know who to ask if you describe the goal . A young gregarious lady who knows everybody.

You can always invite her over later for voice overs

So...

1) Lapel mic (probably hired) for bride / groom / priest (whatever) during the ceremony.
2) Hand-held mic (again, probably hired) with gregarious volunteer for the reception.

If the minister is OK with the hand mic, that will be enough. Keep it simple. They are very experienced with mic technique I have found.

Presumably both would be radio mics feeding to a unit (Beachtek?) on the cam that'll then record it all.

I've been following the thread on field recoring equipment with interest. Would that have any use for my needs?

How's that sound (pardon the pun) for a set up?

Depends on the camcorder and the wireless mic. Work it out with the mic rental company. I was using a Sony PD-150 with 4 low level mic inputs. Cam mic was getting ambient sound, the wireless mic fed channel 2.

The Shure VP receiver will probably match your external mic input directly. If not the rental company can provide a matching transformer. The Beachtek will give you a second channel for ambient sound and level controls that you can monitor with your headphones.

A standalone audio recorder would be great to grab ceremony music and the reception band later. If there is a PA system you could just record that.

[daamon]

@ edDV - Thanks for all the info (again). I reckon there's enough there for me to stroll into a mic hire shop and have half a chance of knowing what I'm talking about.

P.S. I'll let you know how the "voice overs" go...

Thanks all...

[edDV]

@ edDV - Thanks for all the info (again). I reckon there's enough there for me to stroll into a mic hire shop and have half a chance of knowing what I'm talking about.

P.S. I'll let you know how the "voice overs" go...

Thanks all...

Take your camcorder when you rent the mic. Get everything working there for a test. Ask for fresh batteries.

[thefiddler]

Hey Redd, and edDV, I just got my Rode VideoMic from B&H today. It's sweet looking... now I've just got to get out and use it some. I'll let you know how it goes ed... I would like to get the "DeadRabbit" (I think that's what Rode calls it) screen for it though, for windy days and that kinda stuff.

[edDV]

cool

[daamon]

Hi all,

I went for the easy option and bought a mic that slides on to the hot shoe. I was originally looking at the Canon DM-50, but the guy in the shop said that the Rode VideoMic was virtually as good, and was half the price. It also came with a sponge cover for the mic included in the price, whereas the Canon mic didn't.

I took his word for it and went for the Rode. It was AUS$200 and I had a(nother) friend's wedding to do the following weekend, so put it to good use there.

Without having the benefit of other (semi-pro) mics to compare against, all I can say is that the pick up is better than the in-built mic on my Canon XM2. The sound is clearer, and "more full".

It was effective from a good range - about 30 feet.

Suffice to say, for the price, I was pleased with it. Read more here.

Thanks to all for your suggestions, and when I get impatient with this mic I know where to turn to!