Capture device that does PCM audio?

[Wender]

Hi, have been reading a bit and almost ordered an ElGato EyeTV 200. However - specs say it encodes audio at max 384 kbps which would be the same as my standalone DVD recorder (AC3 audio).

Can't find a capture device which captures PCM audio. However, it's been said the EyeTV devices feeds uncompressed to the Mac and the compression is done in the software. At least for the EyeTV Wonder USB that is.

I could buy a new standalone DVD recorder with PCM capabilities instead (Panasonic or Pioneer) and a built-in hard drive. Maybe that's the way to go. I record live music from TV and I want the best audio possible - as "lossless" as possible...

Any help would be appreciated!

[Frobozz]

The devices that capture DV video digitize the audio without compression. Good ones include models by Canopus and Miglia.

If you go with a different standalone recorder, the Pioneer only records PCM at its 1-hour per DVD setting. All other encoding rates are AC-3. I've used my Pioneer DVR-510H to digitize vinyl LPs in PCM. I get about 7 hours of audio-only on a DVD which I then can take to my Mac for resampling and editing into albums. If I included video with the recording I'd only get 1 hour to a DVD with PCM audio.

[Wender]

Thanks. From what I understand - you can record 17+´hours with superior quality and PCM audio on the built-in hard drive, but then you need to "export" it in bits and pieces on DVD-R/RW. No way to copy from HD to the Mac.

Most tempting is the DVD recorder option actually. I guess it would be a Pioneer. Haven't found a capture device yet which supports PCM audio.

[Wender]

Or this one perhaps!?!?!?

http://www.formac.co.uk/html/products/av/stud_1.htm

Any opinions? Seems to be what I need...

[Frobozz]

Yes, the Formac is a good choice. I don't know if this has changed, but there used to be difficulties with the Formac software which led someone to develop the freeware Vidi application as a substitute.

As for the Pioneer DVR-510H and 520H, you can export video in DV format to the Mac via Firewire, so it doesn't have to fit a DVD to get from the recorder to the Mac. I've done this with some HDTV concert videos. I then can create the DVD with iDVD (which only uses PCM audio).

[Wender]

Thanks again! This is getting more and more useful. I didn't know the Poineer could transfer DV through the FireWire port. This could nudge me in the direction of a standalone after all.

When you transferred HDTV videos - I assume they got slightly compressed to XP format or whatever it's called in the Pioneer world, but the audio remained uncompressed. Then to DV which retains the format you recorded on the standalone?

However, using the Formac device - which can record at "25 Mbits/s DV compression" you could achieve an insanely high quality - however I am uncertain of where the "cap" is for audio TV signals in the first place. Hope you understand the question... is there any need at all for higher bitrates than 8-9 kbps when the source is analog cable?

Thanks again! This is really great help!

[Frobozz]

The Formac will give you better picture quality than the Pioneer but the audio will be the same quality. With the Pioneer, the video gets compressed to MPEG (at approximately 8 mbps) and then gets converted to DV for export via Firewire. With the Formac you skip the MPEG conversion so that will mean better picture quality. Will you notice the difference? Maybe not because the Pioneer does a nice job and has the ability to adjust various picture quality settings when recording. The new Pioneer decks in Japan have a even higher picture quality setting for recordings to the hard drive. Maybe the new DVR-533H will have that. In that case the DVR-633H with its 160 GB hard drive will be more desirable.

Pioneer is the only brand of standalone recorder I'm aware of that exports via Firewire as well as imports. I've read rumors that the feature may be eliminated in the 533, but Pioneer has been very secretive.

The Ovation Channel here is showing a "30 Years of ABBA" program that is anamorphic 4:3 (everyone is tall and skinny). I've exported it to iMovie HD as a 16:9 video and that corrected the aspect ratio. I now can either burn it as a widescreen movie with iDVD or send it back to the Pioneer via Firewire. The Pioneer recognizes when a 16:9 video is being imported via Firewire and automatically plays the video as a anamorphic 16:9 the same as with a commercial DVD.

[Wender]

The Pioneer 530 has a 160GB hard drive and the 630 has 250GB. Wow.

Can't figure out if the FireWire port is in/out or just in:

http://www.pioneer.co.uk/uk/product_detail.jsp?product_id=10728&taxonomy_id=42-125

In the list with specs it says "in" but clicking on the link it says:

"DV Terminal

Dubbing from digital sources to the Hard Disk Drive or DVD discs is a simple matter of connecting a camcorder to the DV IN/OUT connector on the front of the DVD recorder. The user-friendly remote — combined with Pioneer's easy-to-use GUI — controls both machines for dubbing, playback, pause, fast forward, and rewind. To temporarily restore homemade DVDs to the camcorder, you just plug into the DV IN/OUT connector. One DV cable inputs/outputs A/V data and control signals. The DV IN/OUT can also be connected to a DV deck."

I guess my Mac would be able to see this device as a DV unit...

I have to check this out - and I probably want to replace my crappy Philips DVDR80 with this baby

[Frobozz]

Notice the XP+ setting for recording to the 530/630 hard drive. That's a higher bit rate than is usable for DVD but gets you better quality if you're watching from the hard drive or exporting via Firewire.

You probably can tell that I'm a huge fan of my Pioneer DVR-510H and am excited to see what the new U.S. models have in store.