23 frames/sec to 25 frames/sec

[livador]

First off I want to say that I am absolutely horrible with all this tech stuff, all I know is how to edit, so bear with me, please.

A while back I bought Pinnacle Studio 9 and an additional Activation Key to import DivX / avi files. This, however, led to out of sync video and audio for said DivX files when played on the timeline. So I sent a message to the Pinnacle Tech Support and with their help I figured out that the frame speed of my video files isn’t compatible with Pinnacle. Apparently Pinnacle can only work with 25 to 29 frames/sec and my files are 23 frames/sec. They couldn’t help me with this problem, but referred me to this site.

So my question is; is there a way for me to maybe convert those 23 frames/sec into 25 frames/sec?

[mats.hogberg]

My take on this is not an odd framerate, but VBR audio. All video editors/encoders have problem with VBR audio in AVI. It's the worst kind of source mtrl you can get.

/Mats

[livador]

Thanks for responding. But does this mean there is nothing I can do to fix this? Because these videofiles work fine with Windows Moviemaker and Ulead. I just figured that since I bought the Pinnacle programme I should be able to use it. No such luck then, I guess?

[FulciLives]

What exactly are you trying to do with the MPEG-4 files?

My guess is you want to convert them to standard MPEG-2 DVD spec files so you can make a standard DVD Video.

If that is true then this can be successfully done without the use of the Pinnacle program. In fact you can do it with nothing but freeware programs.

I'd be happy to go more in-depth if you are interested.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[livador]

Well, I'm an amateur video editor. I like to make those music videos of television series for fun and then put them on YouTube. Silly, I know, but I like it and I'm fairly good at it, too. The point is that I do need an editor program to make those videos. Normally I would just use Windows Moviemaker, but it has died on me and I have yet to resurrect it, and Ulead Videostudio 10 doesn't have the specific effect I want. So my only other hope was Pinnacle...

Do you think you can still help me? Or is that VBR audio thing a deal breaker?

[mats.hogberg]

If you really want 23(.976?) fps to 25 fps, this is how I used to do it:
Load AVI in Goldwave. Make audio shorter (23.976/25=0,95904 of original) using the Timewarp function. Save as wav.
Patch AVI to 25 fps with AVIFrate
Load AVI in VirtaulDub, select WAV audio under Audio and your shortened wav.
Save new AVI with Direct Stream for video, full processing for audio, Lame MP3 CBR at 128 kbps or better
Voila! A 25 fps version with a+v hopefully in sync.

/Mats

[machf]

Well, I have an acquaintance who does more or less the same, only that his target rate is 29.97fps. If your methodology is the same as his, the audio length isn't a problem, as you won't be using the audio in sync with the video, but will instead select video scenes to go along with the audio. First, I would suggest you save your source videos as uncompressed (raw) AVI files, or if you don't have enough HDD space, you use a DV or MJPEG codec at maximum quality (Pinnacle Studio 9 won't work with the HuffYuv codec, we tried that). Similarly, save your audio as raw (uncompressed) PCM, 48kHz, 16-bit, stereo .WAV files (I'm assuming that the source videos don't have 5.1 audio, of course, or that you're using an OST CD for the audio source). I don't think the problem is a 23.976fps video framerate... I concur with mats.hogberg, it's more likely that your AVI files have VBR MP3 audio.

[livador]

Ok, I'm going to try this this afternoon (haven't had time until now) and I'll let you know if it works.

(machf, I know, but the audio not being in sync with the video isn't the problem - if that were the case I could totally deal with it and wouldn't even be here, but it's the video that's out of sync with the audio - if that makes sense. See, if I select a clip and put it on the timeline I hear the audio of that clip, but see an entirely different scene. So there's no way to know what clip goes with what scene, that's the insane part. Thank for helping, though.)

[mats.hogberg]

the audio not being in sync with the video isn't the problem

but it's the video that's out of sync with the audio

! It doesn't make sense to me - I'd say it amounts to the very same thing.
"The problem isn't that my left leg isn't the same length as my right, but that my right leg isn't the same length as my left"

/Mats

[machf]

Uh... I think you didn't get it. Since Pinnacle Studio 9 allows you to use separate tracks for video and audio, you don't need to have the audio and video of a video segment to be in sync, as you'll be using only the video portion of it. I mean, if you're trying to make videoclips, usually you'll paste different video segments together to match a separate, single audio track of whatver song you're using. The video segments themselves could be silent, even. It's you who's deciding which scene goes with which part of the song.

[livador]

Ok, machf, seriously? I know you’re trying to help me and thanks, but I am not stupid. I have made a lot of these videos before and while I may be a little technically impaired, I know how to edit - as I stated previously. I know how to make these videos, I know that I put music over the audio of the clip. Like I have tried to explain before it would normally not be an issue were the audio not in sync with the video. I wouldn’t care less if I saw, let’s say, scene 3 and heard the audio from scene 5 (or no audio at all, for that matter). The problem, however, is that I select scene 3, hear the audio from scene 3, but *see* video from scene 16. Hence my comment on the video being out of sync with the audio; it was a play on words or phrasing, if you will. Now there is no logical way to find out which scene I will get when I select a clip, since the picture on the clip does not match the actual video I see and therein lies the problem.

That being said though, yay! I do believe it worked! Mats, thank you so much! At this point I think I might owe you my sanity

[machf]

So, you've been visually selecting a scene, but when you play it, you get a different one (regardless of audio) instead? There must be something very odd about those 23.976fps files and/or the way Studio 9 interprets them... you're getting the wrong frame(s), as if they weren't 24 but 30fps, I guess (so, for the 1 minute mark, instead of getting frame 1440, it's getting frame 1800, which is really at 1:15 minutes instead? - yes, I've rounded).

I was telling you to ignore the audio and seek the video instead, but now I see what you meant... sorry if I sounded condescending, I was just trying to recapitulate how I've seen it done.

Anyway, my original point is still valid: you don't need to touch the audio, as you won't be using it, just patch the framerate of the video.

And still, I'd convert DivX to something else before editing...