restoring previously capped mpeg2 files

[anitract]

Does anyone have any software/filter recommendations for improving the picture quality of PREVIOUSLY captured mpeg2 files?

I am mainly interested in improving color vibrancy and black levels. I cannot afford dedicated hardware, nor do I wish to recap from the original source.

Finally, IYHO, what kind of results can I expect with your suggestions?


__
In case it matters, my caps are of home videos taken as follows:
JVC SR-V101US (auto mode w/ TBC on) -> TBC-1000 -> ATI AIW 9600 (high bit rate, full resolution)

[Soopafresh]

Depends how deep you want to get into it.

What format do you wish to convert the files into ?

[anitract]

I do not want to convert the files, if at all possible, because they are all ready in mpeg2 format (which will then be made into DVDs).

As for depth, like I said, I'd most likely want to do color correction/enhancement and black levels.

[Nelson37]

Any filtering will require re-encoding. This will degrade the video even further, making additional filter application almost certainly not worth the hassle.

[anitract]

Is this always the case (that re-encoding will degrade the video)?

I hear this said a lot, but it seems kind of ridiculous that, given the kinds of technology we have today, there aren't some filters out there that don't degrade a video file. Maybe my expectations are just too high.

[thecoalman]

Is this always the case (that re-encoding will degrade the video)?

Yes, how much depends on what you do to it, what it looks like now...etc. I have some comparisons here.... in the extreme :P .
https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=257651

Check out the difference between going directly from the source AVI or reencoded from MPEG. You won't see degradation like that but you will have some, that clip was handpicked specifically for that experiment.

If you check the bottom clips out you'll see that the degradation is not that great using when higher bitrates are used so it's not entirely unrealistic to try reencoding but it's preferable to start with the highest quality possible. I used Media Studio Pro for those clips.

[anitract]

Well shoot.

[lordsmurf]

Improving color is not too hard, and with a good encoder, quality loss is minimal. I'd play around with PROCODER on this type of issue.

[junkmalle]

Well shoot.

The improvement you get from fixing the black level and colors will probably outweight the degredation of the decode/reencode cycle. You're best off recapturing the source of course.

[Soopafresh]

And/or if you learn about DGindex and AviSynth, you can really minimize your macroblocking (via a built in deblocker based on h264) and modify the black levels as well. I'll post a script if you're interested.

[SatStorm]

From virtualdub's point of view:

Virtualdub's filter MSU_Deblocking may help with macroblocking
So MSU_smartsharpen for blured images

Beyond that you can restore only elements of video, not fixed on the first analogue / digital convertion.
So, you can use "video de-noise" for noisy analogue source that never filtered. Stuff made from Hauppauge PVRs for example.
Also, a good filter is rmPAL when the source is a realtime mpeg 2 capture of a PAL VHS tape

Colour correction is easy and possible.
Colour bleed is more complicated. IMO, there is no way to do this with PAL using software.

Of course, to apply those stuff, you need to re-encode the whole thing.

[anitract]

Well, I'm not sure what to do now. I've put a hold on my VHS captures before I decide.

I'd love to be able to purchase the recommended SignVideo products...but they'd kill the bank.

Used (good) Proc Amps seem relitively hard to come by on eBay too...

[lordsmurf]

The used Vidicraft ones are only $25-75 off eBay.

And there are other brands. For example, I have an extra set of Archers, paper weights (to me) that I should probably sell, but the proc amp is only good as color changer (but not black levels), and the detailer is so-so (best on minimum setting).

Personally, I'd only use the SignVideo or Elite Video gear. But the lower costs ones exist, and most of the work, to a degree. And cheaply.

[Nelson37]

I see you are using an ATI card. Included software has the ability to boost color saturation, also adjust black levels and tint. Ignore the Gamma adjustment, this is for PC only.

HOWEVER, you can NOT use the PC monitor as an accurate preview of what these adjustments will achieve for final output on the TV.

Suggest making short captures, while adjusting levels. Process to a DVD (RW would be a good idea) and playback on the TV, while comparing DVD output to original source. Many TV channels repeat shows every few hours, making for an easily repeatable source.

You may find that different adjustments are needed for VCR and Cable input. Unfortunately, there is no ability to save different presets, AND no markings on slider. This sucks. Suggest reset to default, TAB to each control (do not use mouse as pointer location at click will move the slider) and use arrow key taps to move slider to desired location. IE, 5 right on brightness, 8 right on color, 2 left on tint, etc. This is the only way to create reproducable settings. These must be checked periodically as certain unknown events will cause MMC to reset to defaults. So write them down!

[junkmalle]

I see you are using an ATI card. Included software has the ability to boost color saturation, also adjust black levels and tint. Ignore the Gamma adjustment, this is for PC only.

HOWEVER, you can NOT use the PC monitor as an accurate preview of what these adjustments will achieve for final output on the TV.

Suggest making short captures, while adjusting levels. Process to a DVD (RW would be a good idea) and playback on the TV, while comparing DVD output to original source. Many TV channels repeat shows every few hours, making for an easily repeatable source.

You may find that different adjustments are needed for VCR and Cable input. Unfortunately, there is no ability to save different presets, AND no markings on slider. This sucks. Suggest reset to default, TAB to each control (do not use mouse as pointer location at click will move the slider) and use arrow key taps to move slider to desired location. IE, 5 right on brightness, 8 right on color, 2 left on tint, etc. This is the only way to create reproducable settings. These must be checked periodically as certain unknown events will cause MMC to reset to defaults. So write them down!

I don't have an ATI card but I bet all those settings are saved in the Registry. After setting them you could export the registry keys that correspond to those settings. Then you'd have .REG files you could use to easily restore the settings in the future. You can also edit them with a text editor for more precise settings. If they're not in the Registry they're probably in an INI file.

[lordsmurf]

I use arrow key taps to move slider to desired location. IE, 5 right on brightness, 8 right on color, 2 left on tint, etc. This is the only way to create reproducable settings. These must be checked periodically as certain unknown events will cause MMC to reset to defaults. So write them down!

I used to take screen shots and save the setting files as JPEGs in a folder I had reserved specifically for various video info.

[edDV]

You guys (and myself) need a proc amp-waveform monitor solution built into capture card software.

This has been standard operating procedure for the pros since the 1950's.

I guess the best way to describe the current PC capture level setting process is "blind ambition".

Even with Premiere Pro and Vegas, you have to capture before you can analyze what you did with the waveform monitor.

[anitract]

I just may mess around with those ATI settings.

Nelson37, or anyone else who's used the ATI cards, do you have any recommended settings (or were those yours you mentioned above, Nelson37) for VHS? Though I'd guess it all depends on the source...

[lordsmurf]

For the ATI MMC proc amp controls? Maybe put the gamma setting at about 40-50% from the left (very center is, or should be, default normal, totally to the left darkens video). Leave everything else alone, maybe reduce color saturation a bit if you have too much chroma noise.