Strange 'jerkiness' in video, but still in sync...

[bananadude]

I am getting an odd error with a converted AVI file to MPEG. I ran it through CCE with an Avisynth script;

AVISource("N:\24\24 DVD5_temp\office02\office102.avi")
BicubicResize(688,352,0,0.6,10,0,624,350)
AddBorders(16,64,16,64)
#Trim(0,62504).FadeOut(150)

And then converted to MPEG with TMPGEnc MPEG tools.

The produced MPEG is jerky though, and I can't figure out why. It's still in sync, just not running smooth. I've converted many other AVIs to MPEG using this process, so I'm stumped. I used WinAvi Video Converter, and that produced an MPEG without any jerkiness, but i need it to be 720x480, but that just gives me 720x576.

Below is the GSpot info on the AVI file.

Help.

[Abond]

You must apply pulldown (23.976->29.97) before multiplexing with mpeg tools. You can try dgpulldown.

[bananadude]

That did not work. Hardly any settings in dgpulldown, so I don't think i could have set it up wrong. I don't get this. I have many other avi files i've done exactly the same thing with and had no jerkiness. Is the avi file itself dodgy or something? It is happening with a few of them though, all eps from the same show, yet another one (also the same show) is fine. I'm stumped...

[guns1inger]

If it is giving you PAL framesize, it is also giving you PAL framerate ?

[bananadude]

By using my Avisynth script in CCE (and then multiplexing) it's giving me an NTSC framesize and an NTSC framerate. The avi comes from an NTSC source. The mpeg is accepted by Adobe Encore into an NTSC project, so it seems ok in that sense, it just has this jerkiness. As i say, I did another avi which is virtually the same and it was ok.

WinAvi video converter seems to give me a PAL framesize with an NTSC framerate. I am not sure quite how it does this, but it does. But this is useless to me as Encore won't accept it. Besides, I am putting this clip into a project with other NTSC clips, so it needs to be the same. No reason why it shouldn't be though, which I just don't understand!

[bananadude]

So this is a complete mystery to everyone then? Surely there must be a solution somehow??

[crazy14muzic]

It sounds like an interlacing problem or your field order is wrong. Did you encode using the right field order?

[bananadude]

How would I know if I did that or not? I used CCE to encode (with an Avisynth script). What option (if any) in CCE determines field order and what should it be?

[lordsmurf]

It sounds like a framerate problem, more than interlace.

[bananadude]

That's what I thought originally, but if that's the case how come it is still in sync? Or would it not affect that? And if it is a framerate problem, how do I determine this? The clip appears IDENTICAL to another clip that has no jerkiness problems.

[Gurm]

I don't have anything helpful to offer, so anyone that will be offended by that just skip this post.

...

...

Am I the only one amused when someone says "I used the following script for CCE... (insert incomprehensible script here)... and it didn't come out right"?

But then of course when I say that CCE uses incomprehensible scripts, Adam and the rest of the CCE-heads jump down my throat. *shrug*

Just use the GUI. According to the CCE-heads, you don't have to script CCE at all!

[lordsmurf]

Audio sync can remain just fine. The fps does not affect that.

[bananadude]

I'd have to disagree with your claim that you don't need to script CCE. My recent experience with another TV episode I was attempting to transfer to DVD should be clear evidence of that.

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=264877

The only way to get my MPEG at the right screen dimensions in this previous case was by using an Avisynth script.

Besides, what scripting it has to do with the jerkiness I am now encountering I have no idea. I don't see how it could affect it at all.

[Abond]

Then post the script.

[Gurm]

I'd have to disagree with your claim that you don't need to script CCE. My recent experience with another TV episode I was attempting to transfer to DVD should be clear evidence of that.

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=264877

The only way to get my MPEG at the right screen dimensions in this previous case was by using an Avisynth script.

Besides, what scripting it has to do with the jerkiness I am now encountering I have no idea. I don't see how it could affect it at all.

No no, I'm agreeing with you in a sarcastic manner. CCE requires scripting. But every time I mention that as a reason I haven't wholeheartedly jumped onto the CCE bandwagon, Adam and others jump up and down and say "no no the GUI rocks in CCE! You have no idea!"

[bananadude]

Script is at the top of the page, but again below;

AVISource("N:\24\24 DVD5_temp\office02\office102.avi")
BicubicResize(688,352,0,0.6,10,0,624,350)
AddBorders(16,64,16,64)
#Trim(0,62504).FadeOut(150)

[Nelson37]

Describe the jerkiness. Does it appear to stutter, pause, or even move backwards, like a field order problem? Or does it appear to speed up, like a framerate issue? Once you have seen both, it is fairly obvious.

Listed fps is NTSC film, 23.97. Do the files which play correctly have the same framerate?

When using such a file on a DVD, you need to demux the file, run pulldown.exe on the m2v file, then remux the renamed m2v file with the audio. This is not necessary if the framerate is 29.97. Your description of dgpulldown use does not appear to indicate proper completion.

Downloaded files, of any type, will be highly variable as regards file integrity, picture quality, framerate, etc. Just because one works, only tells you your basic conversion process worked for THAT file. Another file may fail in the same process, because of differences mentioned above.

[bananadude]

The jerkiness is constant throughout and does not vary. It appears to be as though frames are missing, but not much. It just doesn't run smooth. That is best way i can think to describe it.

The files which play correctly seem to be identical - they have the same framerate and Gspot doesn't see any difference between them, short of the bitrate being slightly different.

Your description of dgpulldown is what I thought I did. There are very few options in that programme, so not sure what more I could have done.

[Abond]

Ha, seems you simply copy paste the script I gave you then. But there is mistake in it - I have also using copy-paste ( ). So I start FitCD set the resolution from your picture (coz I haven't this clip) and played a bit with the values. What I get is following:
BicubicResize(688,352,0,0.6,0,0,624,352)
AddBorders(16,64,16,64)
BTW, your first line should be:
AVISource("N:\24\24 DVD5_temp\office02\office102.avi", false)
but I don't know if it matters for CCE.
BTW, how you do the audio? You didn't multiplex in TMPG with MP3 VBR, did you?

[bananadude]

I will try that script and see if it makes a difference. Does this affect the framerate in anyway though? I thought it was just the framesize.

The audio is generated by CCE into an mpa file. I then multiplex with TMPGEnc Mpeg Tools, multiplexing together the m2v and mpa file to create the mpeg. This has worked no problem before. Is it wrong?

[Abond]

Audio with CCE is completely wrong IMO. Use it only for video - that is its main purpose. Better is to demux the audio with VDub (Full processing mode) and to encode it to mpa or mp2 with audio encoder (BeSweet for example or even TMPG)
The question was which setting you are using in mpeg tools - System or program?

[bananadude]

It defaults to MPEG-2 Program (VBR) in the drop down box in mpeg tools when I select the m2v file, so that's what I use. Wrong?

How I do the audio should not be a factor in the jerkiness problem should it??

[bananadude]

It defaults to MPEG-2 Program (VBR) in the drop down box in mpeg tools when I select the m2v file, so that's what I use. Wrong?

How I do the audio should not be a factor in the jerkiness problem should it??

[troyvcd1]

There is no reason to make an mpeg before loading it into encore. Create a separate wav file and use the m2v file from CCE and load these separately into encore.

[ghuru_x86]

don't know if you've solved this yet, but i think i have. i had the same problem with a NTSC 23.976 fps video. after a week of encoding twice a day i encoded it w/o any jerkiness. i tried everything from interlaced and non-interlaced to changing the field order, i encoded with 3:2 pulldown when playback and without 3:2. i tried changing the m2v file with dgpulldown to 29.97 and everything i could think of. finally as a last resort i encoded the file as i normally would for high quality but instead of encoding with 23.976 fps i encoded with 29.97 fps. suprisingly it worked. the movie plays fine on my dvd player now. i am currently having the same problem with another 23.976 fps file so i am encoding it the same way, i let you know if it works on that too. by the way i use TMPGEnc Plus and i set all of my settings the same as i normally do but changed the fps. hopefully this helps you out. the main thing to understand is that i changed the FPS during the encoding, NOT afterwards with a seperate software such as dgpulldown. dgpulldown WILL work to convert PAL to NTSC but that's another story........ good luck!!

[ghuru_x86]

yep it worked for the other one too!