mpeg-2 tuner/capture program?

[reboot]

I've tried so many lately, I'm totally confused.
I have found what I really like for capping avi, now I need something nice for mpeg-2.
Please give me some recommendations.
Anything but Showshifter and ones that even remotely look like they're trying to copy XPMCE.

[hudsonf]

Have you tried BeyondTV or SageTV?

[FulciLives]

If you want quality MPEG-2 DVD spec captures then I suggest you try one of the ATI AIW cards (which at least do a partial hardware MPEG encode) or a full hardware MPEG encode capture card such as the Hauppauge WinTV PVR-250

Software only MPEG-2 DVD spec captures (such as what happens with your standard PCI capture card) is a bad idea IF you really want a quality result.

Having said that I have a BT based PCI capture card that I am using on a new super fast computer and my new super fast computer came pre-loaded with PowerProducer Gold (made by Cyberlink ... the same company that makes PowerDVD) and this MPEG software only capture program "seems" to work OK and does capture NTSC at 29.970fps interlaced video (it does not deinterlace) but you cannot (at least as far as I can see from "playing around with it") adjust the video bitrate otherthan selecting 1 HOUR MODE, 2 HOUR MODE, etc. and that totally blows if you ask me. Also, come to think of it, I do not think you have the option to use 720x480 vs. 352x480 so that's another blow against this software. It does do AC-3 audio and does capture interlaced and seems to keep A/V sync though I only did a test of 1 hour long once ... all my other tests with it were very short running clips. In short I don't use it!

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[fmctm1sw]

Also, come to think of it, I do not think you have the option to use 720x480 vs. 352x480 so that's another blow against this software.
- John "FulciLives" Coleman

Have you looked into that registry hack? It works on the trial.

[FulciLives]

Also, come to think of it, I do not think you have the option to use 720x480 vs. 352x480 so that's another blow against this software.
- John "FulciLives" Coleman

Have you looked into that registry hack? It works on the trial.

No I havn't looked into that but for the most part I have no real desire to use this program LOL

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[reboot]

For now, I can't afford a different cap card, although if I'd known then, what i know now, I'd have looked into the AIW stuff, one of the VE card's maybe?
Got a recommendation for which one? I don't need bleeding edge video, I don't game, and i'm running a Radeon 7000 (in this particular system).
I'll check out beyondtv and sagetv, thanks.

Now I remember why I didn't try Sagetv...need sun's java, and I'd rather not...really...but I might...

[FulciLives]

For now, I can't afford a different cap card, although if I'd known then, what i know now, I'd have looked into the AIW stuff, one of the VE card's maybe?
Got a recommendation for which one? I don't need bleeding edge video, I don't game, and i'm running a Radeon 7000 (in this particular system).
I'll check out beyondtv and sagetv, thanks.

Any ATI AIW 9000 series card should be A-OK.

Using pricegraber.com I found a place selling a retail box ATI AIW 9600 AGP for $129.00 plus shipping (that was the cheapest price for that model).

Again, using pricegraber.com, I found a retail box ATI AIW 7500 AGP for $77.00 plus tax (again that was the cheapest for that model).

My guess is you would be happy with the 7500 model but I do believe (not 100% sure on this) that the 9000 series ATI AIW cards have a slightly better performing video capture chipset.

ATI is always coming out with new products and as a result it can hard to "keep up" with them all but historically the capture only cards (like the VE card you mentioned) have used totally different, and far less suitable, video capture chipsets compared to the ATI AIW cards. For instance they once used the simple BT based chipset! ... so you are better off sticking to one of the ATI AIW cards or one of the Hauppauge WinTV PVR Hardware MPEG cards.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[hudsonf]

When you get ready for a new capture card check out the Hauppauge cards. I use the PVR 250 and the PVR USB2. Using BeyondTV 3 I can capture two channels at the same time. The hardware does all the work so you don't have to worry about your computer using all of it's resources.

[reboot]

I have a PVR-250, but it's PAL only, and until I get a cable made up...
I also have a BT878 based card, which works really well for 320x240, and full D1 avi caps (TV adn VHS), but I would prefer to work with mpegs, thus my search continues.
I was wanting the "partial hardware" bit, of the AIW cards. I'll look for the 7500 here in Canada, thanks!
Tried Beyondtv, and it seems to be a HUGE resource hog, as well as an internet connection hog. I can't multitask while using it at all. Maybe I'll try it again though.
I tried NVE3, but got a ton of dropped frames, and audio sync issues. I also tried WinDVR, Mainconcept PVR, Vegas movie stuido 4, Vegas 5, Pinnacle 9.3 and a few others, all with one issue or another...

[reboot]

Tried BeyondTV again. Total resource hog. The demo is ok, but why do all these apps have to look like MCE and make changing a few settings so difficult? How are you supposed to just hit the record button? You can't. It has to be scheduled.
AFAIC, it's a POS.
I may have to bite the bullet and install sunjava to try SageTV.

On another note, I found the ATI AIW 9000 pro, for $19.99 CDN, but they're out of stock

[lordsmurf]

Rather than buy new software, buy an ATI AIW card off eBay for about $40 USD. Maybe even less. Remember to get the "purple wires" with it.

[reboot]

I just checked ebay. The cheapest 9000 is $75 US.
I'll look for a 7500 maybe.

[FulciLives]

I have a PVR-250, but it's PAL only, and until I get a cable made up...

My guess is that the TUNER is PAL only but it should be able to do PAL and NTSC using the composite/S-Video input.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[mgh]

If you can get BTwincap drivers to work for you-try Trial version of ULead MF-capture to DVD format at highest kbps VBR allowed-highest qquality setting and deepest search(forget the term)-max possible 15-set at least to 11. If you are able to capture without dropping frames.. You can consider that or one of the higher end ULead products.

[reboot]

Thanks, I'll try the Ulead stuff. Never been a fan though...

@Lordsmurf, you're the guru with the AIW cards. If I manage to get one (and return this silly BT878), what software do you recommend for TV/VHS caps?

@Fulcilives, nope, it's PAL, period. It won't even recognize my NTSC cable input properly, it's expecting a PAL cable signal, and only outputs to PAL mpeg-2. I tried composite/s-video from my VHS, won't work. It could just be me though...

[lordsmurf]

I saw a 7500 for $40 + shipping just yesterday. Buy it now, no bids.
Theatre 200 PCI card. Those work well.

And then, use ATI MMC 8.7 to start with.
If you're feeling adventuresome, try ATI MMC 9.02.
You can also use VirtualDub 1.5 (confirm this works here).

[hudsonf]

Sorry to hear you didn't like BeyondTV. I use it with a Hauppauge PVR 250 and a Hauppauge PVR USB2 with no problems. I can record with both cards at the same time and still use my computer. You can record in live tv by putting your mouse cursor on the tv screen and clicking the mouse button. The record button is in the top right hand corner. If I remember right it's a round button. I wonder if your capture card could be the problem?

[reboot]

I broke down, returned the happy little BT878 chip card, and got an "open box" deal at FutureShock.
Hauppauge PVR250, regular $199, on sale for $149, and missing it's remote controller for $99.
Now if I can only get GB-PVR to work...it doesn't want to do much of anything (but I haven't restarted yet, since installing).
Any other recommended software for THIS card?

[FulciLives]

BT based capture cards can actually look really good.

Try the BTwincap driver.

Using that driver capture NTSC at 712x480 and use an AVI format codec such as HuffyUV or PICVideo MJPEG (on a high quality setting like 20 or 19) and you should be happy.

For conversion to DVD I crop from 712x480 to 704x480 which is a valid resolution but I then like to crop to 704x480 then add 8 pixels of black on either side to make it the more standard 720x480 size.

If you really want to do direct to MPEG captures with the BT chipset capture card then this will work assuming you find decent software for this (a trick as you have found) and don't mind a very slight aspect ratio error (the capture window of the BTwincap driver is 712x480 so that gets stretched out to 720x480 but at only 8 pixels off you will never notice it).

If you use the BTwincap driver then all settings for image adjustments should work at default BUT set the sharpness setting to 51 instead of the default of 50 (the 51 setting seems to work best).

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
Here is a thread showing some BT capture screen shots:
https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=244055

*** EDIT ***
Guess I am a bit late posting this since you took the card back LOL

[reboot]

LOL, thanks for posting all that though. Gives me food for thought.
I did manage some superb caps, with the btwincap drivers and virtualdvcr, as well as stoik, using the picvideo on 20, however, I could never get audio sync. 2 hours of video, with a progressive sync error I could fix, but it's a dreadful amount of work.
I played with the sync fix in Stoik for at least 2 days. I got 3.5 hours of cap in virtualvcr, which never did sync up. I tried just about every other app there is, and some wouldn't even work on my system.
I have a feeling my audio card's clock chip may not be exactly right, which could be the cause of the sync issue, not the app, nor the cap card.
I also have a feeling my aging Radeon 7000 pci card just isn't suitable for some of the MCE type interfaces.
I finally got SageTV working, after the SunJava download...so maybe I'll try beyondtv again.
I cannot get GB-PVR to work at all. Nice blue background, nothing to click on, and it can't find any channels.

[hudsonf]

Now that you have a PVR250 check out this link http://www.shspvr.com/

[reboot]

THAT's the link I've been hunting for! Lordsmurf mentioned it a week ago, and this old memory isn't as good as the DDR in my comp
Thanks!

[FulciLives]

THAT's the link I've been hunting for! Lordsmurf mentioned it a week ago, and this old memory isn't as good as the DDR in my comp
Thanks!

Let us know how you like your Hauppauge WinTV PVR-250 and maybe even post some high quality JPG screen caps

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[SatStorm]

Just for the info:
Bt8xx cards with the btwincap drivers can do excelent reatime mpeg 2 captures with mainconcept 1.4.2 (not Mainconcept PVR, that's buggy).

Of course this is not a cheap solution: MC 1.4.2 costs. A second hand ATI or Hauppauge 250 could be better (also let's see what the future revisions of PVR 150 would do to fix that audio problem that card has)
But if you already have MC 1.4.2, why not to use it? It does excellent job!

[FulciLives]

Just for the info:
Bt8xx cards with the btwincap drivers can do excelent reatime mpeg 2 captures with mainconcept 1.4.2 (not Mainconcept PVR, that's buggy).

Of course this is not a cheap solution: MC 1.4.2 costs. A second hand ATI or Hauppauge 250 could be better (also let's see what the future revisions of PVR 150 would do to fix that audio problem that card has)
But if you already have MC 1.4.2, why not to use it? It does excellent job!

I might have to give this a try ... that is using my BT chipset capture card (with the BTwincap driver) to do a direct-to-MPEG capture with Mainconcept MPEG encoder.

I never tried this in the past because my old computer was much to slow for this but I got a new screaming fast computer so I will give this a try sometime. It will give me something "fun" to do one day LOL

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[SatStorm]

Just remember: Set video input the higher you can (768 x 576/480). If you don't the results won't look as sharp as they have to.

[FulciLives]

Just remember: Set video input the higher you can (768 x 576/480). If you don't the results won't look as sharp as they have to.

Well the BTwincap driver has a "proper" aspect ratio of 712x480 for NTSC but to be "in spec" with the NTSC DVD format I would have to either do my direct-to-MPEG capture at 720x480 or 704x480

Of course either way I will get a very slight (not at all noticeable) aspect ratio error but I surely cannot do the capture at a width of 768 ... unless I want to re-encode to make it DVD spec ... but what point is there in direct-to-MPEG encoding IF you need to re-encode the capture?

I will just chock this one up to a "brain fart" on your part :P

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[reboot]

With my BT878 card, I tried capping with Mainconcept 1.4.2, and it will only cap to avi.
I never could figure out how to get it to cap mpeg-2.
Other software I tried that would cap to mpeg-2, wouldn't cap to 720x480 without about 50% dropped frames. I could cap to 320x240 in just about anything, with no/minimal drops. I probably just don't have enough horsepower to do it, even with a gig of RAM and a separate capture drive.
I will definitely try MC now though

So far, I love the PVR-250. Quality is easily twice as good as the old BT ever was, no matter what software.

A couple of screen caps.

[FulciLives]

@reboot

Let's pick and agree on a source we can both duplicate (a popular movie on DVD that we both have) and have a shootout!

My BT chipset card VS your Hauppauge WinTV PVR-250

We both do a DVD to capture card recording then post screen shots (from the same scene(s) and same frames(s) when possible) and see how they compare

You do 720x480 (proper DVD A/R for your card) with a CBR video bitrate of 8000kbps

I will do HuffyUV AVI at 712x480 (proper DVD A/R for my card) then do a CBR of 8000kbps with CCE

Some popular DVD titles I have that come to mind ...

1.) THE MATRIX (I have the 10 disc set not the original DVD release)
2.) Any of the extended LORD OF THE RINGS movies (I have all 3)

Actually my mainstream DVD movie list is not great and my memory is crapping out on me (very little sleep in the last 24 hours).

I have mostly horror movies on DVD if you don't have those listed above. I'm flexible on movie choice just so it is one we both have

It will be fun

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[reboot]

Um...I currently OWN one commercial DVD. Some Jean Claude VanDamme thing which I've misplaced.
I could acquire others on a temporary basis

I wish I'd saved a screenshot from the other card, cap with virtualvcr using picvideo, then encoded in Mainconcept...they're long gone...I did a major housecleaning yesterday, right after I got the PVR-250 installed and working.

When I said quality is twice as good, I meant given the same format, at the same resolution, on the same channel (full D1 mpeg-2), no matter what capture program.
My picvideo avi caps were much better quality than the mpeg-2 ones, even with mainconceptPVR, Intervideo WinDVR, Mainconcept EVE, and the few others I tried, but the encoding time, and the sync issues just pissed me off enough to give up.