Crappy CCE, acceptable (but slow) TMPGEnc

[DVbuilder]

I have searched the forum for DV to DVD-R conversion, but most of the guides and posts seem to be how to convert DVD-9 to DVD-5. Cut the chase. DVD2ONE is the solution! Briliant speed, and high quality, no extras (and other crap)..... If you need better quality buy the original DVD!

My problem is DV to DVD-R (video from av DV camcorder via FireWire), and I'm sure a lot of users have the same problems as I experience.
I have tried both TMPGEnc 2.59 and CEE 2.66 based upon the different replies/advice given from different users. My experience is that TMPGEnc gives acceptable quality (a bit blurry compared to the original AVI), using the DVD wizard, but takes appx. 48 hours to encode...! (high quality setting on my P4 2,0 GHz, 256 MB). CCE produces a jerky result and it seemes that interlacing is a problem....? The result is not good!
Trying to set up my own templates makes no difference. The only thing good is the speed, 3 hours of encoding. If 3 hours of encoding could produce the same quality as TMPGEnc, I would be satisfied. If even better quality could be produced for longer encoding time that would be acceptable as well.

As you propably can tell, I'm not interested in tweaking the matrix setting, GOP's or using additional tools as VirtualDup to filter the AVI, but plain and simple capture and encode (and burn) at reasonable speed.

Anyone?

[RoopeT]

DV material is bottom field first, and there' s no option for selecting bottom field first in CCE (CCE's upper field first setting isn't exactly what one would think it is). I have personally no experience with DV material but I suggest this might work:

Frameserve your avi to CCE with avisynt, here a basic sample script:

Avisource("d:\path\mydvavi.avi")
SwapFields()

Try encoding with CCE, uncheck "upper field first" in MPEG2 video settings.

[DVbuilder]

Thanks for your reply,

>>Frameserve your avi to CCE with avisynt, here a basic sample script:
>>
>>Avisource("d:\path\mydvavi.avi")
>>SwapFields()

Avisynth is not the most user friendly 'program' I have seen... I'm trying to use VirtualDubMod to run the script, but: 'Couldn't locate decompressor for format 'dvsd' (unknown).' Tried to use AVSGenie as well, but even more complicated, and with the same result 'Couldn't locate decompressor...'.

I know this is a problem using capturing programs as MS Moviemaker, but as I said in my previous post, I want to keep this simple, and Moviemaker is simple.... I know converting the file with Canopus file converter might solve this, but so far I'm using 4-5 programs to do the job... And converting takes time.

I have tried to capture via VirtualDub, but VirtualDub could not locate my DV camera.... Don't know why..?

Is there a way to overcom this, or is it a way to run the script not using VirtualDub/AVSGenie?

I'm still a newbie, but I'm learning....

[Baldrick]

You can't capture dv with virtualdub but you can open dv if you have a dv codec installed.

www.dvdrhelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=482590#482590

more free dv codecs here www.dvdrhelp.com/tools#codecs

or maybe you tried this but you have to convert to dv type1 or type 2....and you didn't want to that....

[RoopeT]

Avisynth is not the most user friendly 'program' I have seen...

Actually it is! What could be simpler than just write a few lines in notepad and save as a .avs script.

[Heavensent]

from what i have tried, i think you should try "MainConcept Mpeg Encoder"
or "Honestech Mpeg Encoder".
they are both fast and main concept seems better when it comes to dv.
try it out and tell us if it does work better for you.

[q1aqza]

If you're not comfortable using AVISynth then try a product called restream which will allow you to swap back to bottom field first for the CCE produced file MPEG file. This will stop the jerkiness you are experiencing.

http://shh.dvdboard.de/

[DJRumpy]

Of course you could always just crop one pixel from the top of your source too, effectively changing the field order. I'm assuming this works. I forget who pointed this obvious fact out to me, or I would give credit where credit is due. I agree with the others though. Use AVISynth. There are programs out there that will write the script for you, if your squeemish about such things.

[Robert@MZ3.Net]

First a comment on the TMPEG speed: You said it gave a 48 hr estimate, you must have been using the wizard and it must have added the noise reduction filter. Remove the filter and it will speed things up A LOT.

Now for DV (field order B) to SVCD using TMPEG... this is something I have spent a lot of time with. Tell TMPEG the source is interlaced field order B, do NOT use the deinterlace or other frame/field conversions but rather tell TMPEG to simply create an interlaced SVCD MPEG. I ended up making my own template for interlaced sources.

Now here's the important part: The output will look strange when played back on a computer (you can see the interlacing), but burn that with Nero and go watch it on your (interlaced) TV and Wham... Rock Solid Perfect.

By the way this method also works for DVD's with interlaced video (although that is usually field order A). I just change that one setting in TMPEG saying the source in A instead of B.

However if you are wanting to make an MPEG that is not intended to be viewed on TV then you are forced into using those deinterlacing options.

[DVbuilder]

Thanks for all your good advice. I tried using MainConcept 1.3.1 (as recomended) for converting the 13 Gig file. I'm impressed of the speed (less than 2 hours!)and the quality of the result. However TMPEGEnc produced a better result (48 hours). I would say 95% of the TMPEGEnc video. Viewed on my standalone (Philips DVD player, and a Philips Wide screen TV, not state of the art, but good value for money...), the picture was a bit blocky, and jittery edges, loosing som information in high speed scenes (my son running...)
My next goal is trying to set up MainConcept to produce even better quality, as this is the most promising app yet (considering out of the box ease of use).
Any good guides of how to tweak this application (VBR 4 passes...)?
I am also going to give CCE another try, changing fields from top to bottom, and VBR 4 passes using 'restream' (I have to find this application first...)

[DVbuilder]

I'm back form a long easter holiday, and I'm still trying to find the best way to encode my DV-AVI. Thanks to RoopeT for information about using Avisynth and CCE.
I tried
Avisource("d:\path\mydvavi.avi")
SwapFields()
in CCE but the quality is not up to MainConcept (or TMPEGEnc) (thanks to Heavensent for the tip). I agree Avisynth is the app to use for tweaking video, but using Swapfield() still does not make the MPEG-2 file as smooth as MC (MainConcept 1.3.1). Better yes, but good no.
I have tried to read the MC manual, but not finding the tweaking options I feel I have in CCE (or TMPEGEnc).
I have tried:
Motion search mode: 8
Do half-pel search (enabled)
Set motion search areas from pixel movement to H:2 V:2

My preference for converting DV-AVI is as follows:
1. TMPEGEnc (slow but good quality, very slow.... But not as good as the original DV camcorder playback)
2. MainConcept (good speed, but not as good quality as TMPEGEnc)
3. CCE (not able to handle bottom field first in a precice manner)

I always test my encoded videos on my standalone DVD player for evaluation of the quality.

DVbuilder :gear:

[DJRumpy]

For DV Video in CCE, I would suggest the following settings.

Under the VIDEO button:
Luminance Level: 0 to 255
Select Quantization Matrices button, and put it on MPEG Standard. Leave all other options Unchecked.

Audio: Set it to your preferences

Quality:
Disable the Low Pass Filter
Enable the 'Effect Restricted vertical filter'. Set it to 16
Turn off Dithered Quantization
Set the Quantizer Characteristics to somewhere between 16-32
Set Intra Block DC Precision to 10
Set your Block Scanning Order to Alternate
Ensure the 'Progressive frame flag is unchecked

On the main settings page, select the following:
For Video Setting: select Multipass VBR. Set your MIN to 0, your Max to 9000, and your AVG, according to your movies length, and your space available. Use at least 1 pass (actually performs 2 passes using a setting of '1'). 3 or more passes is better.

Disable 3:2 Pulldown detection, Letterbox Hint, and Panscan. Set your aspect ratio according to your input source.