LG V281 DVD/VCR Combo USB Capture Card strange problem

[lollo]

your avisynth script makes no sense

Well, help him out, don't just throw stones.

Not on this capture, Alwin, is useless. Let first have a good capture as starting point, otherwise makes no sense. Later. One step at the time.

[Sharc]

If so (?), the culprit is the Roxio. I guess it deinterlaces on the fly and encodes to mpeg2 at a much too low bitrate causing these ugly blocking artifacts.

It's a lossless interlaced capture.

Yes, my bad, I noticed it after downloading only.

[lollo]

If so (?), the culprit is the Roxio. I guess it deinterlaces on the fly and encodes to mpeg2 at a much too low bitrate causing these ugly blocking artifacts.

It's a lossless interlaced capture.

Yes, my bad, I noticed it after downloading only.

No problem Indeed, the blocking artifacts resemble a bad mpeg2 signature or a bad reception of TV channels encoded.

[VHS-Digital-Buddy]

How are my VirtualDub settings ? Or does it need a change. I am in PAL region.If you guys can recommend a tweak or additional settings, or even a redo, would be appreciated.

I'm going to post short clips with Roxio and Nero and you guys be the judge. Just want to make sure my VD settings are good.

[lollo]

How are my VirtualDub settings ? Or does it need a change. I am in PAL region.

Post a screenshot of the "Capture timing options". The rest of the setting is straight forward

Capture pin…	        PAL-G
			25000
			YUY2
			720x576
Capture filter…		: Standard Video PAL_G
Crossbar…		1: Video Svideo In (composite for you)
Cropping…		0 0 0 0
Compression	        Huffyuv (Lagarith for you)
					
Set custom format	720 576
			YUY2
			YUV 4:2:2 interleaved
			
Enable audio capture			
Raw capture format…		PCM, 48000Hz, stereo, 16-bit
Compression…			<No Compression (PCM)>
Audio source		X	Audio line

Capture						
			Settings…		25000
			Disk I/O…		512K
						2
					X	Disable Windows write buffering

[VHS-Digital-Buddy]

Herewith:



[Attachment 93565 - Click to enlarge]

[rgr]

Uncheck: drop frames when... and Force audio clock...
For some devices you must also enable the last option ("Ignore video timestamps...")

[lollo]

Herewith:



[Attachment 93565 - Click to enlarge]

It's ok! (force audio clock can be unchecked)

[VHS-Digital-Buddy]

Thanks people.

[lollo]

Some more detail to check:

What about dropped/inserted frames? Did Vdub report any?

What about A/V synch?

[VHS-Digital-Buddy]

No dropped frames.

Not sure about the latter.

By the way, I only get PAL_B. Cannot change to anything else.

[lollo]

The extension on PAL in not relevant here while capturing, don't worry.

[CaptureCraft]

Not having dropped frames reported doesn't mean much.
Also, having drop and insert frames checked in the setting (together with some others) gives the VD freedom to alter your video on it's own accord.
I don't like it and never use these settings.

[lollo]

If you do not enable them, Vdub will drop the frames without reporting!

If you whish a capture software not changing the stream, you have to design your own capture engine (i.e. with GraphEdit). But then you rely on the microsoft filtering, and no actions are taken to keep a/v in synch.

[CaptureCraft]

If you do not enable them, Vdub will drop the frames without reporting!

There is absolutely no connection between dropping frames on purpose (based on VD's logic) and reporting dropped frames by any other means.
The only other reason for VD to drop frames is the weak hardware (CPU, hard drive, USB channel, etc.).
If it does happen, then it is pretty bad. No software can/should fix it.
And yes, it does report such dropped frames, despite drop frames flag being unchecked.

[CaptureCraft]

If you whish a capture software not changing the stream, you have to design your own capture engine (i.e. with GraphEdit). But then you rely on the microsoft filtering, and no actions are taken to keep a/v in synch.

Why I have to design my software?
I'm pretty happy with VD with all the artificial synchronization turned off.
Just give me all the video frames and give me all the audio.

[lollo]

There is absolutely no connection between dropping frames on purpose (based on VD's logic) and reporting dropped frames by any other means.

Yes, there are different causes. VDub may decide to drop a frame not arriving in time, or a frame is dropped because it is lost before arriving to the software engine.

The only other reason for VD to drop frames is the weak hardware (CPU, hard drive, USB channel, etc.).

No, it may do so, and insert a duplicate frame later to keep a/v synch.

If it does happen, then it is pretty bad. No software can/should fix it.

In specific cases you can take corrective actions. AmarecTV for instance, performs well in keeping a/v synch despite incoming signal problems.

In any case, I do not like much Vdub, its core engine has been designed when the capture was done using separate cards for audio and video, hence a/v synch because clock skew in the different hardware; then all the different timing options (i.e resampling audio)

[lollo]

I'm pretty happy with VD with all the artificial synchronization turned off.
Just give me all the video frames and give me all the audio.

That's all that matters (if they are in synch)!

BTW: if you turn off all the options, it is simply a stream writer, not a capture software but something like this, with no control/detection/corrective action on the incoming signal:

[CaptureCraft]

I'm pretty happy with VD with all the artificial synchronization turned off.
Just give me all the video frames and give me all the audio.

That's all that matters (if they are in synch)!

Agreed!
The question is what makes them out of sync.
If you eliminate all the problems, then you're golden and you don't need to apply extra effort for synchronization!

[lollo]

Yes but you need a perfect signal out ot the player, plus a time base correction, plus a frame synch and so on. And a VHS signal is never like that. In an ideal world, maybe

[CaptureCraft]

There is absolutely no connection between dropping frames on purpose (based on VD's logic) and reporting dropped frames by any other means.

Yes, there are different causes. VDub may decide to drop a frame not arriving in time, or a frame is dropped because it is lost before arriving to the software engine.

Exactly. I just don't like/want it.

The only other reason for VD to drop frames is the weak hardware (CPU, hard drive, USB channel, etc.).

No, it may do so, and insert a duplicate frame later to keep a/v synch.

Oh, yes. I just forgot to mention that.

If it does happen, then it is pretty bad. No software can/should fix it.

In specific cases you can take corrective actions. AmarecTV for instance, performs well in keeping a/v synch despite incoming signal problems.

In any case, I do not like much Vdub, its core engine has been designed when the capture was done using separate cards for audio and video, hence a/v synch because clock skew in the different hardware; then all the different timing options (i.e resampling audio)

I use the latest versions of VD2. I'm pretty sure a lot of things were fixed/changed since then. I don't have any issues with audio being out of sync.

[CaptureCraft]

Yes but you need a perfect signal out ot the player, plus a time base correction, plus a frame synch and so on. And a VHS signal is never like that. In an ideal world, maybe

Aah! Now we're talking!
Yes, yes and yes!
I mean, it absolutely up to a person to decide if they want to patch up the video with software to keep it acceptable, or to invest into the hardware in attempt to make it perfect.

[lollo]

I don't have any issues with audio being out of sync.

So you have all perfect tapes with 0 defects, a high-end S-VHS VCR pristine with perfect transport/read/output mechanisms, internal time base correction, then an external TBC to rebuild perfect timings, then you reduce the capture software to just copy the streams as they arrive to the disk of the PC and have never experienced a/v asynch.

Congratulations, but difficult to believe.

[CaptureCraft]

[QUOTE=lollo;2802767]

BTW: if you turn off all the options, it is simply a stream writer, not a capture software but something like this, with no control/detection/corrective action on the incoming signal:


[Attachment 93567 - Click to enlarge]

OK. Would this stream writer be any better/easier to use then VD with all the bells and whistles?

[lollo]

If you reduce a capture software to just a dumper of the incoming streams they are equivalent.

But I really doubt that even removing all the options in Vdub you can simplify it so much and downscale it to a simple writer.

[CaptureCraft]

I don't have any issues with audio being out of sync.

So you have all perfect tapes with 0 defects, a high-end S-VHS VCR pristine with perfect transport/read/output mechanisms, internal time base correction, then an external TBC to rebuild perfect timings, then you reduce the capture software to just copy the streams as they arrive to the disk of the PC and have never experienced a/v asynch.

Congratulations, but difficult to believe.

Tapes, of course, are far from having zero defects.
However, I do have good VCR (HR-S8960E). Even though it has internal TBC, I prefer to use ES-15.
Of course, I had to tune up the VCR with service remote control. I had to take some measures to mitigate AGC in ES-15 and bypass its S-Video out.
At the end I have Sony HXD-890 to control the video range to keep it within legal range and as a frame TBC.
And I use Magewell IO card for the capture.
Could it be better? I'm pretty sure it could, but it is good enough for me.

[CaptureCraft]

If you reduce a capture software to just a dumper of the incoming streams they are equivalent.

But I really doubt that even removing all the options in Vdub you can simplify it so much and downscale it to a simple writer.

Why? I really doubt VD alters the digital stream unless you explicitly command it.
It literally becomes just dumb stream writer. The huge advantage though, is to have the encoders at your fingertips and overall GUI interface.

[lollo]

I'm not Avery Lee, so I cannot conclude for sure. I just know how is complicated to design such a software, and how sometimes the option that you disable/enable in a GUI may not be effective (i.e. using the "disable a/v synch for card with integrated audio video" in Vdub timing)

[lollo]

Tapes, of course, are far from having zero defects.
However, I do have good VCR (HR-S8860E). Even though it has internal TBC, I prefer to use ES-15.
Of course, I had to tune up the VCR with service remote control. I had to take some measures to mitigate AGC in ES-15 and bypass its S-Video out.
At the end I have Sony HXD-890 to control the video range to keep it within legal range and as frame TBC.
And I use Magewell IO card for the capture.
Could it be better? I'm pretty sure it could, but it is good enough for me.

Most of what you describe is not related to keep pristine streams in synch at the end, but again if you experience this, good for you!

(The Magewell card is sensitive to time errors, so still not convinced. Never mind)

[CaptureCraft]

I'm not Avery Lee, so I cannot conclude for sure. I just know how is complicated to design such a software, and how sometimes the option that you disable/enable in a GUI may not be effective (i.e. using the "disable a/v synch for card with integrated audio video" in Vdub timing)

Well, bugs, of course are possible. However, there are other, independent indications of whether re-synchronization happens or not. They all say it does not happen.