Converting .WTV Files

[ryangarfield]

Hi Guys,

I have almost 2TB of recordings from the just finished TV season and am now looking to convert them to .MKV for storing. These were OTA recordings done in the highest quality setting in WMC. I had started off with a few files in Handbrake and they came out looking fine, but the next 3 I tried and randomly stopped at various percentages. I tried each of them multiple times and they would always stop at the same point as the last time. i.e one would stop at like 24.14% every time, another 89.72% every time, etc. Same settings were used during times when it worked and didn't. Could it have perhaps been to an interruption in the video feed due to interference during the initial recording? I know not all of the recordings were perfect all the time, but it's hard to tell from the original video what would have cause it to stop. Is there something I should be feeding the video through before Handbrake? Not using Handbrake at all? I know a fair bit about conversion, but the easier the process, the better as I have almost 400 recordings to go through.

Any and all help is greatly appreciated. Let me know if more information is needed.

Thanks

[usually_quiet]

The problem is caused by errors in the recorded video and audio streams. The only programs I have used that are capable of doing a good job dealing with them are VideoReDo Plus and VideoReDo TV Suite H.264, VideoReDo TV Suite H.26 can open wtv files directly. .wtv files need to be converted to .ts files for VideoReDo Plus. Both are decent for frame-accurate editing and commercial removal, and their "quick stream fix" function can fix the recorded stream if errors are not so horrific as to make the recording virtually unwatchable. There are free trials available for both.

[ryangarfield]

Thanks for your quick response.

I have been trying VideoReDo TV Suite all day now and what I have been doing is running the quick stream fix, then running that file through Handbrake which then keeps getting stuck at a certain percentage.

Is VideoReDo capable of doing the things that Handbrake is capable of doing? Adjusting RF Values, Decombing, etc?

So far VideoReDo has had no problems chugging through the videos where Handbrake has failed.

I do not want to cut any of the commercials or anything like that, just looking to go from 1080p down to 720p, convert to .mkv, decomb the video, and other minor stuff like that

[usually_quiet]

Thanks for your quick response.

I have been trying VideoReDo TV Suite all day now and what I have been doing is running the quick stream fix, then running that file through Handbrake which then keeps getting stuck at a certain percentage.

Is VideoReDo capable of doing the things that Handbrake is capable of doing? Adjusting RF Values, Decombing, etc?

So far VideoReDo has had no problems chugging through the videos where Handbrake has failed.

I do not want to cut any of the commercials or anything like that, just looking to go from 1080p down to 720p, convert to .mkv, decomb the video, and other minor stuff like that

I use VideoReDo Plus. I never tried VideoReDo TV Suite H.264, so I don't know if it can resize from 1080i to 720p for H.264 conversions. Maybe you can ask VRD customer support if nobody here knows the answer. VideoReDo TV Suite H.264 can do something similar to adjusting RF value. http://www.videoredo.net/msgBoard/archive/index.php/t-29870.html

[ryangarfield]

So I've been messing around quite a bit with this, trying all sorts of different things and the one thing that seems to consistently work is to use MC-TVConverter (forget the actual name to be honest ha) to convert the .WTV to .TS and then open in Handbrake. My next question though is would it be better to first run the .WTV through VideoReDo's Quick Stream Fix first before then converting to .TS?

Appreciate all your help BTW!

[usually_quiet]

So I've been messing around quite a bit with this, trying all sorts of different things and the one thing that seems to consistently work is to use MC-TVConverter (forget the actual name to be honest ha) to convert the .WTV to .TS and then open in Handbrake. My next question though is would it be better to first run the .WTV through VideoReDo's Quick Stream Fix first before then converting to .TS?

Appreciate all your help BTW!

If you are going to convert to TS with MC-TV Converter, I would do that first, then run Quick Stream Fix using VideoReDo, and save as a MPG before converting to H.264 with Handbrake. In some cases Quick Stream Fix could help, particularly if you see sync issues in your H.264 files.

I don't convert to h.264 but I use MC-TV Converter to convert WTV files to MPEG-2 TS before importing into VideoReDo. (Since I have VideoReDo Plus, I can't import or save WTV files.) If there are not so many errors that I can't scroll through the file easily, I just edit and save the file as an .mpg. (VRD fixes the stream as the edited file is saved.) If editing is difficult because there are too many errors, I use Quick Stream Fix first, then edit the resulting MPG. The MPG files produced by VRD don't have sync issues, which I sometimes saw before I began using VRD.

[ryangarfield]

Is there a benefit to converting to .TS over simply opening the .WTS in TV Suite? Or do you just do that as you only have ReDo Plus?

I just tried opening one file and received an error saying that it could not find the PID's?

Also, is there an alternative program to TV Suite that could perform a similar task as Quick Stream Fix on a .TS file?

Just trying to save the cost of purchasing the program if all I end up using it for is that one task (provided I convert to .TS with MC-TV Converter in the first place)

Thanks

[usually_quiet]

Is there a benefit to converting to .TS over simply opening the .WTS in TV Suite? Or do you just do that as you only have ReDo Plus?

I have to convert to .TS with MC-TV Converter because I only have VideoReDo Plus which cannot import or export .wtv files. That being said, TS files are probably easier for any version of VideoReDo to work with.

I just tried opening one file and received an error saying that it could not find the PID's?

Open one file of what type produced by which program with what program?

Also, is there an alternative program to TV Suite that could perform a similar task as Quick Stream Fix on a .TS file?

Not that I know of. I tried a lot of free and paid programs before I decided to buy VRD, and none worked as well.

Just trying to save the cost of purchasing the program if all I end up using it for is that one task (provided I convert to .TS with MC-TV Converter in the first place)

If you think MC-TV Converter works well enough for producing files that Handbrake can convert to H.264, then don't buy VRD. If it turns out that you do need VRD, you can always buy it later on.

[ryangarfield]

Fair enough, I was a little vague there lol. I tried opening a file produced by MC-TVConvertor as a .TS in ReDo TV Suite and got the error of no PID's.

[usually_quiet]

Fair enough, I was a little vague there lol. I tried opening a file produced by MC-TVConvertor as a .TS in ReDo TV Suite and got the error of no PID's.

I have never see that kind of error opening any of my TS files with VideoReDo Plus. I use MC-TV Converter v1.5.0 to convert from WTV to TS with the TransportStream (.ts) option (under Stream copy) as the target format. MC-TV Converter v1.5.0 was a bit faster for this type of conversion than later versions, so I stuck with it.

[Timagain]

I always have some problems with .wtv files with Handbrake and others like Avidemux. I found MCEbuddy (http://mcebuddy2x.codeplex.com/ ) And seems to do a pretty good job so far. Not sure how it will handdle .wtv files that have errors in them. Worth a shot. plus you can set it up to automatically watch your tv directory and encode at any time you want. Another plus is it will name the shows for you and get metadata (season, episode) although i don't like the choice of pictures it uses for it (they look like banners).

[bnewt]

I also would like to learn this process..........
I have some ota recordings that I want to burn to blu ray and/or dvd to play in stand alone units without loss of quality or 5.1 sound track.
I was told to convert my wtv files to mkv & re-encode to x.264........will mcebuddy do that entire process?

[go45cvi]

You don't need any junk shareware. This can be done with these freeware (though it took 4 programs for me)
1. Use MCE buddy to extract TS mpeg from .wtv
2. Use avidemux to trim TS into commercial free segments (MCE buddy's commercial detection doesn't work all the time for me)
3. Use tsmuxer to join the segments
4. Use handbrake to encode to the format of your choice (e.g. mkv)

[usually_quiet]

Avidemux won't do a good enough job for a lot of people, myself included. Like most other editors, paid and free, audio and video are out of sync after processing if there are transmission errors in the recorded ATSC stream.

VideoReDo's products are the only ones I have tried for editing recorded TV shows from an ATSC source that did an acceptable job. They can compensate for a reasonable number of transmission errors and keep audio and video in sync. If the source contains so many transmission errors that VideoReDo can't process it, the recording was unwatchable to begin with. I eventually upgraded to VideoReDo TV Suite H.264, which can edit .wtv files directly.

Cypheros TS-Doctor is another program that is supposed to be able to cope well with transmission errors, although I have not tried it. It can't work with wtv files directly. They have to be converted to .ts first.

I tried MCEBuddy after MC-TV Converter inexplicably stopped working, and I couldn't get it working again. I didn't like the way MCEBuddy works. I prefer converting recordings one at a time on demand to batch converting automatically. Comskip is inaccurate, like every other automated commercial detection system, including VideoReDo's.

You do not need to convert to H.264 for Blu-Ray. MPEG-2 is allowed. The audio and video for recorded ATSC HDTV programming is most often Blu-Ray compatible as is. Some SD recordings would need to be re-encoded for Blu-Ray compatibility because the resolution isn't 720x480. Blu-Ray authoring programs are listed here: https://www.videohelp.com/tools/sections/authoring-bd-hd-dvd

[Mike99]

I used WMC7 & converted a WTV to DVR-MS in order to edit using VRD TVS V3. But the audio is wrong & appears to be only 1 channel. I searched & found that the WMC7 convertor does not handle multiple audio streams correctly, and the VRD forum confirmed that.

I could upgrade to VRD V5 which handles WTV files or use something like MC-TVConverter & see how that works.

That led me to think about which format I want the final video to be in. If WTV & DVR-MS are both mpg why choose one over the other? Or why not just use mpg? I searched but could not find out the pros & cons of WTV vs DVR-MS. Just that early Windows uses dvr-ms and newer windows uses wtv files. One comment said wtv allows WMC to use a couple extra functions such as Skip or FF or something similar.

I like to find out why or when to use either one, and why not mpg. Any comments & suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

[usually_quiet]

I used WMC7 & converted a WTV to DVR-MS in order to edit using VRD TVS V3. But the audio is wrong & appears to be only 1 channel. I searched & found that the WMC7 convertor does not handle multiple audio streams correctly, and the VRD forum confirmed that.

I could upgrade to VRD V5 which handles WTV files or use something like MC-TVConverter & see how that works.

That led me to think about which format I want the final video to be in. If WTV & DVR-MS are both mpg why choose one over the other? Or why not just use mpg? I searched but could not find out the pros & cons of WTV vs DVR-MS. Just that early Windows uses dvr-ms and newer windows uses wtv files. One comment said wtv allows WMC to use a couple extra functions such as Skip or FF or something similar.

I like to find out why or when to use either one, and why not mpg. Any comments & suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

The WTV container supports the use of encryption/copy protection that is strong enough to satisfy the folks at Cable Labs. This allowed Windows Vista with Windows Media Center TV Pack's and Windows 7's version of Windows Media Center to be certified for CableCARD tuners. Technically WTV and DVR-MS are used to hold transport streams (ts), not program streams (mpg).

Using Windows DVR-MS conversion also screws up closed captions. I would recommend VRD V5 to convert to .ts or MKV. It appears that Windows 8.1 will be the last version of Windows with support for Windows Media Center so for future compatibility it might be best to begin using a non-proprietary container if you can.

[Mike99]

usually_quiet,

Thank you for the reply.

I’m using WMC7 to record HD OTA programs. No CableCARD tuner. So I guess WTV is not needed, unless it lets me use some WMC7 functions that other formats do not. I basically record, watch, delete and rarely save a program. However I wanted to save a program & figured to keep an HD version on the HDD and maybe also burn an SD version to a DVD-R.

I’m somewhat familiar with the file structure of a DVD from using VRD V3. However I’m pretty much a beginner when it comes to HD video, containers, etc. I’ve heard of MKV but have never used it. I’m not really concerned about minimizing the video’s file size in order to save space because I don't save a lot of videos. I’m more concerned about compatibility when trying to play the video using different players.

Will an MKV file play using WMC7, VLC or MPC-HC?

Since I don't have a Blu-ray burner, could I just burn an MKV file to a DVD-R & will a PC be able to play the video right off the disc using something like VLC?

Is there a basic rule-of-thumb when to use MKV vs .ts vs mpg?

Sorry for so many questions, I'm just trying to learn a few things. I have been Googling and have a lot to learn.

[usually_quiet]

I’m using WMC7 to record HD OTA programs. No CableCARD tuner. So I guess WTV is not needed, unless it lets me use some WMC7 functions that other formats do not. I basically record, watch, delete and rarely save a program. However I wanted to save a program & figured to keep an HD version on the HDD and maybe also burn an SD version to a DVD-R.

I was simply telling you the main reason why MS switched from DVR-MS to WTV for WMC recordings. It seemed like you wanted to know why they felt it was necessary to make this change.

I’m somewhat familiar with the file structure of a DVD from using VRD V3. However I’m pretty much a beginner when it comes to HD video, containers, etc. I’ve heard of MKV but have never used it. I’m not really concerned about minimizing the video’s file size in order to save space because I don't save a lot of videos. I’m more concerned about compatibility when trying to play the video using different players.

Will an MKV file play using WMC7, VLC or MPC-HC?

Since I don't have a Blu-ray burner, could I just burn an MKV file to a DVD-R & will a PC be able to play the video right off the disc using something like VLC?

Is there a basic rule-of-thumb when to use MKV vs .ts vs mpg?

Sorry for so many questions, I'm just trying to learn a few things. I have been Googling and have a lot to learn.

VideoReDo normally saves only one audio stream in an mpg file, but saves all of them in a .ts file.

Some people use WTV or DVR-MS because they like having the metadata available. Since Microsoft has decided not to allow Windows Media Center as an add-on for Windows 10, keeping saved WMC recordings in DVR-MS and MKV form could become problematic going forward.

An MPEG-2 MKV would also allow you to save all the audio streams, but won't reduce the file size much. MKV supports tagging so it should allow you to manually enter the program metadata (synopsis, cast, etc.) from the WTV file, although I haven't tried it.

VideoReDo TV Suite H.264 allows the option of saving as an MPEG-2 MKV. Maybe MKVtoolnix could be used to create an MKV from a TS file created by VideoReDo Plus, but I haven't tried it.

[Mike99]

usually_quiet,

Thanks again for all the additional information.

Earlier today I upgraded to VRD TVS V5 and so far works great. Since I'm still learning I tried saving a WTV video using the "H.264 MP4" option. That was a mistake. I realize there was going to be some conversion taking place but didn't expect all 4 cores of my CPU to run at 90%. And the processing status bar barely showed movement so I aborted it. Would that high CPU processing be mainly due to converting from mpeg to H.264 or from changing from WTV to MP4?

If I saved the video as MPEG-2 MKV I'm presuming that process would be quicker.

I do have VLC and MPC-HC so should not have a problem playing any video. But is there any particular format that won't play correctly in WMC7? Basically if my wife picks up the HTPC remote & wants to play this video in WMC7 I'd like it to play & function just like the original OTA recording.

Thanks again,
Mike

[usually_quiet]

usually_quiet,

Thanks again for all the additional information.

Earlier today I upgraded to VRD TVS V5 and so far works great. Since I'm still learning I tried saving a WTV video using the "H.264 MP4" option. That was a mistake. I realize there was going to be some conversion taking place but didn't expect all 4 cores of my CPU to run at 90%. And the processing status bar barely showed movement so I aborted it. Would that high CPU processing be mainly due to converting from mpeg to H.264 or from changing from WTV to MP4?

Yes. VideoReDo is re-encoding the entire file to H.264

If I saved the video as MPEG-2 MKV I'm presuming that process would be quicker.

Yes. It should be about as fast as saving an MPG file.

I do have VLC and MPC-HC so should not have a problem playing any video. But is there any particular format that won't play correctly in WMC7? Basically if my wife picks up the HTPC remote & wants to play this video in WMC7 I'd like it to play & function just like the original OTA recording.

Thanks again,
Mike

To be honest, I don't know the answer to your question. I only use Windows Media Center to play WTV files. Once the files have been edited and converted to .ts I don't use Windows Media Center to play them, I don't use MKV. I only suggested it because it supports adding metadata. I have been trying to find out about what programs support viewing the metadata lke WMC allows with WTV. I'm not really finding much. Maybe MKV isn't the answer I thought it was.

[Mike99]

Thank you for all the information.
At this point in time I'll keep the edited video in the WTV format. For my situation I don't see a need to change it & WMC7 should be able to handle it just as if it was the original recording.

[Bonnevue]

Question? do they play in wmc correctly? you check that first. If they do then there is a solution.

[Trafalgar]

Online converter tools usually get stuck in converting a large file, so a standalone converter software maybe more stable in this case. You could try the freemake video converter, I usually utilize this freeware for converting my media files.