Encoding downsized HDV 24p footage to MPEG-2 properly

[stantheman1976]

Yes. The HuffyUV file makes Virtual Dub freeze up a few seconds into the clip.

[jagabo]

I guess there's something wrong with the export from Vegas then. There's no way HuffYUV could cause the problem.

[stantheman1976]

I'm going to go ahead and encode the DV renders I have and use those. They are still good. The original is just a little crisper. This is my brother-in-law's wedding and I know it will be good enough for them.

So what settings do I need to use in TMPGEnc then? Vegas has the option to render as 24p widescreen inserting 2-3 pulldown, which is what I used.

[aedipuss]

10 years ago i would have said use tmpgenc 2.5 over mainconcept but those days are long gone. you will get better results using the vegas encoder. save a boatload of time also. no need to render twice. go direct from the source HDV to mpeg-2. i use vegas/adobe mainconcept encoder everyday for my video business over cce, procoder, temgenc, et. al. and wouldn't go back to tempgenc if you paid me.

next time shoot 30p though, 24p sucks for amateur videos, it needs set shots, little or no movement to be acceptable and offers zero advantages, as it will never "look like film". a small single sensor cmos and slow frame rate also makes for nasty rolling shutter distortion.

[stantheman1976]

Next time I probably will. For now though I've got those DV AVI files rendered from Vegas as DV Widescreen 24p with 2-3 pulldown. I'm just going to use those because it would literally take another 2+ days to render again. So I'll stick with what I'm familiar with just to finish this off. So I just need to know what settings are best in TMPGEnc to handle those two AVI files I already have. Do I still select 23.976fps (29.976fps internally) and 3:2 pulldown during playback as the encoding method or just non-interlace and 23.976fps.

[jagabo]

So I just need to know what settings are best in TMPGEnc to handle those two AVI files I already have. Do I still select 23.976fps (29.976fps internally) and 3:2 pulldown during playback as the encoding method or just non-interlace and 23.976fps.

You can either leave them interlaced and encode as interlaced BFF, or use the inverse telecine option and encode progressive with 3:2 pulldown flags. In the former case you have to encode with more bitrate. In the latter you have to hope that TMPGEnc does the inverse telecine properly.

[stantheman1976]

aedipuss, I'm going to go ahead and render straight from Vegas to MPEG. So what settings do I need to worry about there? I should select 23.976fps + 3:2 pulldown right? What about I and B frames? I used the bitrate calculator at dvd-hq.info and it said to use I=1, P=17, B=0. Vegas doesn't give me an option to change the P frames though. so will I be ok just selecting the I and B frames as it suggested?

[poisondeathray]

You would use the DVD architect template preset for 24p . This will give you 23.976 fps with 2:3 soft pulldown, ready to put into your authoring program

Don't change the I or B frames . I - B gives you the P frames per GOP (there are only 3 frame types, so if you change the B, you change the P given an I). GOP length for NTSC 2:3 pulldown should be 12. That is your I-I length or GOP interval.

I used the bitrate calculator at dvd-hq.info and it said to use I=1, P=17, B=0.

I think that GOP length of 18 is illegal for telecine. There are rules for it, I can't recall the specifics. Using no b-frames usually impairs compression (unless you have a lot of bitrate given the complexity of the content - that practically never happens with a regular DVD, unless it's something like no motion, like an interview)

You might want to change DC to 10 (won't make a big difference), and definitely use 2pass if doing VBR, unless you are using a high bitrate CBR encode

[stantheman1976]

Thanks. I am outputting as M2V elementary stream at 9mbps so I'm using CBR.

[aedipuss]

go with pdr's suggestions.

when using the mainconcept vegas/adobe encoder you really only need to change on the "video " tab - the video quality slider to high, aspect ratio when required, framerate if wrong, cbr/vbr, bitrate, field order if wrong, put a check in" header before every gop" if not checked, check prioritize quality over speed, then go to advanced video and put a check in "use closed gops" and in the project tab set the video rendering quality to best. the rest leave alone.

[aedipuss]

when you get the encoder options set to how you like them, make a template out of it so you can reuse the settings - up on the top of the options tabs, give it a name and save it.

[stantheman1976]

Thanks for the help guys. Exporting from Vegas straight to MPEG-2 worked great. Just as well as anything I ever encoded with TMPGEnc to be honest. I may shoot in 30p next time to compare the difference. This particular video looks really nice to me so with low motion footage I may go with 24p.