TmpgEnc DVD Author states"GOP SEQUENCE HEADERS INCORREC

[GreatSinatraFan]

Everything started out working well with the ATI AIW 9000 Pro; it installed correctly; I utilized LordSmurf's Video settings in the new ATI MultiMedia Center; then, was able to capture old television programs from video tape that I had taped years ago with no problem.

I authored them in TmgpEnc DVD Author; then burned the DVD; the result was perfect.

Then, I wanted to capture some of our COMMERCIAL video tapes that we've owned for years; I also have a "RXII Video Stabilizer" that I picked up years ago; and put this box between the VCR and the Computer to eliminate any Macrovision problems.

When I tested the video tape; the result was a classic sign of Macrovision.. (bright Light going to extreme Dark).

So; I thought I was gonna have to replace the "RXII Video Stabilizer" with a newer model; but THEN I had a bright idea.

Why not see if OTHER video capture software will work ? So; I installed the Intervideo DVD Player and Recorder; and to MY own great surprise; the Macrovision problem had disappeared ! No More Alternating Light and Dark! Yay!

But - the Bit Rate and other settings CANNOT be adjusted with the Intervideo...which was a disappointment. So I tried POWER VCR.

Installed Power VCR; that worked well; the settings CAN be adjusted to a degree; captured pretty decently; with no sign of Macrovision.

HOWEVER; when I tried to click the "OFF" button, when the tape was finished...Power VCR WOULDN'T turn off. ! The ONLY way that I could get out of Power VCR was to utilize the TASK MANAGER..

Well, just for grins; I RE-TRIED the ATI Multi Media Center.. and whaddaya know? NO MORE MACROVISION problems.. !

So; I UNINSTALLED the Intervideo DVD Player and Recorder, then rebooted; then UNINSTALLED the Power VCR. I rebooted again.

Then; I captured the entire movie; utilizing the LordSmurf settings again.

HERE'S the PROBLEM= when I tried to AUTHOR the captured file; TmpgEnc DVD Author stated that it CANNOT accept this file because the "GOP SEQUENCE HEADERS were INCORRECT".

I then tried to capture one minute test videos, utilizing various settings; then putting them through DVD Author.

TmpgEnc DVD Author rejected every one of the tests; still giving the same ERROR message = "GOP SEQUENCE HEADERS ARE INCORRECT".

IN ATI's Multi-Media Center settings; there is a section that allows the specification of the frame sequence in the video output stream. LordSmurf recommends these settings to be placed at "Number of P Frames in Group = 2 Number of B frames in Group = 2, Closed Group of Pictures, and I Frames Only".

When I set these settings; TmpgEnc DVD Author will NOT accept the resulting file; HOWEVER, when I click "DEFAULT" to the ORIGINAL MMC settings, then TmpgEnc DVD Author WILL accept the file. (it will also accept the file when the GOP is closed, but NOT when "I Frames Only" is clicked.)

So; something MUST have changed when I installed Intervideo DVD and Recorder and Power VCR; then uninstalled 'em.

Frankly; it DOES work at present..just NOT with the best settings that Lord Smurf recommends. And I can author at the DEFAULT settings..

But; I sure would like to be able to utilize Lord Smurf's settings in ATI's MMC. These settings DO present a great result in the finished DVD.

I dunno about the factory ATI MMC DEFAULT settings however.. the resulting video from those settings seems a bit cheesy.

If I Uninstall the ATI Multi Media Center; reboot, then install it again.. I'll probably be able to set the frames correctly with LordSmurf's settings; and DVD Author will accept 'em...BUT I'm afraid that I'll ALSO have the Macrovision Light and Dark problem raise it's ugly head again.

So; there's my problem. How do I get TmpgEnc DVD Author to RECOGNISE LordSmurf's Frame Sequence setttings again, rather than the lousy ATI MMC Default settings ?

Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.

[daamon]

Hi GreatSinatraFan,

The max number of frames in a GOP is 15 for PAL and 18 for NTSC - I'm not familiar with the work you're doing or the tools you're using, but I thought I'd mention it in case there's somewhere you can set these when capturing.

If you're capturing to AVI and encoding to MPG2 (doesn't sound like it), then this guide:

http://dvd-hq.info/Compression.html

...on the settings in TMPGEnc is VERY useful. It also explains the GOP Structure in detail.

Hope that's of some help. Good luck...

[GreatSinatraFan]

Thanks Daamon,

I'm transfering from Video tape through the ATI AIW 9000 Pro card, with the ATI Multi Media Center software directly to Mpeg-2-DVD, at a 5 MB rate...

I DO have good news.. the problem I was experiencing seems to have resolved itself. I tried ONE MORE TIME to achieve the proper "LordSmurf" settings; with the "I Frames" enabled, Closed GOPs..I then put the test file through TmpgEnc DVD Author; and whaddya know? DVD Author ACCEPTED the file this time !

I honestly don't know WHY this happened. DVD Author would simply NOT accept ANY file last night and this morning with the LordSmurf GOP Settings. And I changed NOTHING.

But I tried ONE last time a few minutes ago.. and DVD Author ACCEPTED the file THIS time..

Good Grief. There must be little Gremlins in the computer or something...~ Sheesh ~

Well; I hope it STAYS fixed. ! 8)

Thanks for this forum, and all the help...if the DVD Author goes crazy again.. I'll let ya'll know !

[adam]

Frankly I'm not familiar with Lordsmurf's guides but I honestly can't think of any reason in the world you would ever want to use those settings. They most certainly will not give you the highest quality possible, on the contrary you are really limiting your output's quality substantially.

When you capture to all I-Frames you are essentially just taking thousands of still pictures. You are not actually using mpeg compression, so unless you use exceedingly high bitrates (15-25mbits) the quality quickly goes down hill. Mpeg is not meant to be used as a capture medium.

The only reason you would EVER want to do this is if you needed the output to be both mpeg and be easily editable. After doing your editing you would still need to re-encode the file again using I, P, and B frames and using a more reasonable bitrate. So the obvious question is why encode to mpeg, which is a ridiculously lossy encoding scheme, TWICE? Unless you are locked into using an mpeg editor then answer is that you wouldn't want to.

When it comes to capturing there are two roads to take. You can either capture directly to mpeg and just author it, the advantage being real time capturing, or you can capture to avi using as lossless a codec as possible and then encode to mpeg in the end. Though this typically takes at least double time (1x to capture, then 1x to encode) the advantage is better quality and ease of editing.

By capturing to all I-Frame mpeg you get the disadvantages of both options, and the benefits of neither!

In short, if you want to capture to mpeg then never use all I-Frames. That's not how mpeg is intended to be used. If you want a longer but higher quality method, then capture to avi instead, and then encode to mpeg.

With all that said, it just sounds like you were missing a sequence header before each GOP. I don't know if your capturing software has a setting for this or not, but this is something that is usually available in software mpeg encoders. If you ever run into this problem again you can use mpeg sequence maker to insert sequence headers before each GOP in your mpeg. That way you don't have to capture or encode again.

Another suggestion is to not close GOPs either. This directly, albeit probably only slightly, decreases quality. The only time you close all GOPs is if you need to do extensive editing of the mpeg or if you are encoding for use with multi angle footage. Otherwise let the mpeg encoder leave the GOPs open unless it has to close them. TMPGenc encoder actually appears to have a bug where leaving GOPs open may prevent it from maintaining your set GOP size limit, so in this instance you unfortunately have no choice but to close all GOPs. If using any other mpeg encoder than always leave them open. TMPGenc DVD Author should accept either input equally well and this setting has no effect on compatibility with any standard, ie: SVCD, VCD, DVD etc... Closing GOPs gains you absolutely no advantages, yet decreases quality.

[andie41]

Adam, you startled me:

TMPGenc encoder actually appears to have a bug where leaving GOPs open may prevent it from maintaining your set GOP size limit, so in this instance you unfortunately have no choice but to close all GOPs

Was this "bug" with older versions of TMPGenc. I have recently encoded around 15 clips and just checked most of them and the GOP size is correct. I have always left the GOP structure open. Should I change to "closed"?

[tigerman8u]

I have the ATI AIW pro 9000. I also use TMPGenc DVD Author. If I don't set up my template in ATI's MMC to close the gop TDA won't accept the mpeg2. Don't know why just that I found out the hardway that I have to close the gop

[adam]

andie41. It may be that recent versions of TMPGenc have addressed this problem, I haven't checked myself. But honestly, I highly doubt it. There is no logical reason why the DVD template would still use closed GOPs except because of this limitation, which I assume the author is aware of. In my opinion, the day the default template uses open GOPs will be the day this bug is fixed.

From my tests the invalid GOP size is intermitten. I know its somehow related to the open gops, because this is the only time I can reproduce the problem, but it may be compounded by some other settings as well. Sometimes it happens, sometimes it doesn't so I'd take your success so far with a grain of salt. But then again there is no reason to fix what ain't broke, so I guess leave them open until you run into problems. But if you do you know the first place to look. I'm curious how you are checking the GOP length and determining that it is accurate though. I wouldn't be suprised at all if TMPGenc DVD Author did not even check for this. I confirmed the problem because Scenarist simply won't accept PAL material with more than 15 frames per GOP or NTSC material with more than 18 frames per GOP. Most other authoring software doesn't adhere so strictly to the DVD specifications.

Others have reported this problem as well so I'm sure its not an isolated incident.

[andie41]

I thought I had everything sorted out - now I am puzzled again. I used Bitrate Viewer to look at the GOPs and all but the first showed 15, as per my setting. I tried encoding with higher GOP numbers (21, 24, etc.), but each time the encoded file showed 18.- it appears TMPGenc automatically limits the number to 18.

[GreatSinatraFan]

Adam,

I asked LordSmurf regarding the use of the "I Frames Only" option in the ATI Multi Media Center software. He agreed with you, Adam; in that this option should never be used unless some heavy editing is planned.

I have had the ATI AIW 9000 Pro card only since Christmas. I'm still learning the ropes regarding Captureing and Authoring.

I simply either misunderstood, or misread LordSmurf's instructions regarding how to adjust the settings in the ATI AIW Multi Media Software.

This misunderstanding is really not a problem.. I'm simply gonna have to capture the colorized version of "Casablanca" again (rare old video tape that was released once in 1989; never released again.. NOT available on DVD, or on VHS anywhere).. this time using the PROPER settings.

I DO appreciate all the help everyone has provided on this forum.. Thank you !

[andie41]

GreatSinatraFan,

After reading Adam's comment Re a bug in TMPGenc, I was so distracted I forgot my comment to you. It may not be the same error, but I know, in TMPGenc, if I inadvertently deselct the option to include an output sequence header, TMPGenc DVD Author will reject the mpeg with the error "The Video sequence header is incorrect". Perhaps the software you are using has such an option that needs to be selected.

This can be easily fixed (probably in a number of programs), but very easily using TMPGenc's Merge and Cut function to create a new mpeg with the sequence header.

[GreatSinatraFan]

Andie,

The ATI MultiMedia software which I use to capture does NOT have ANY option at ALL regarding sequence headers.

I've looked at "Power VCR", also the "WIN DVD Recorder" as well; these softwares do not include any option in regard to sequence headers either; actually; these softwares simply do not provide many options to do anything..

Sure; maybe if I were going to encode in AVI; THEN I'd certainly use TmpgEnc to RE-encode; but this seems to be a lot of hassle. (I've made any number of SVCD's useing TmpgEnc over the years.)

Since I'm now quite satisfied with the quality result of my Mpeg-2 captures; which I then author; then burn into DVD's; I truly do not see the point of encoding into AVI.

At any rate; the TmpgEnc DVD Author software is accepting my encodes now..as I said above; there must have been little Gremlins in the computer before...'cause it's working just fine now.

[petesimon]

The Doom9.org websites state this about proper TMPGEnc encoder GOP settings:

SEQ Header every 1
Specify the number of GOPs to which a sequence
header is inserted. The standard setting is 1.

You could use MPEG Sequence Maker to modify an existing MPEG file.

Also see this forum topic.