Blu-Ray Best workflow

[AccidentalVidGirl]

Hi, Newbie here. I am a photographer that inherited a long term video job recording stage performances twice a year. The past couple years I have SLOWLY and painfully worked out the bugs getting the hang of producing dvd's. Bottom line, I hate the quality and want to start moving to blu-ray. I know physical media is a dying art, but people still collect these productions, so going entirely digital isn't the way I want to go. Before I waste a ton of money on burning discs, I was hoping to get advice on my workflow.

Videos are filmed in 4k, I have been processing through premiere pro, I might change to Final Cut though. Is there a maximum bitrate I should be aiming for? 50? Any other settings I might not be aware of for export? I was planning to get the 50GB BRD from verbatim, along with the verbatim external blu-ray burner, as my current burner won't do blu ray.

I downloaded the tsMuxeR program and tested it out. It seemed to work for the full sized export that I already had, but when I tried to reduce the bitrate so the .iso would be under 50GB, it error-crashed. So I am assuming that I don't want to make any changes to the file in that program, and give myself as little room for error as possible?

I appreciate any advice, producing media has been an unexpected nightmare. I never expected the BURNING part to give me so much grief! Hoping to make this next learning curve a little less painful. Thanks!

[DB83]

Well you can start by checking out the Blu-Ray spec from the link at the top of this page "What is"And one of the first things you notice is that the maximum video bitrate for Blu Ray is 40 MBit/secSo, immediately, if your 4K source has a higher bitrate then you both have to downscale to 1920*1080 and reduce the bitrate.But what I suggest is that you download a little tool called mediainfo and upload here a text-mode report of one of your 4K source videos. I do not, personally, create Blu Ray (I find that as long as you have given your DVDs sufficient bitrate to start with - you can go to 8 MBit/sec for the video - quality really should not be an issue from a 4K source) but I am sure that others can then chip in with some tips.But also consider your market. Even now not all will have Blu Ray players.

[AccidentalVidGirl]

Thank you! I think part of my issue is that A) I am a photographer, so. the reduced finished quality drives me a little crazy. B). Because of the nature of the project, I am filming from about 35 feet away from the stage. So for scenes that are of the stage as a whole, the quality drops REALLY fast, rather than up close filming where you have a lot more pixels to work with before the image gets degraded. The AVStoDVD program is the FIRST program that I have tried that gave me an output that I could live with, and I just discovered that through this forum recently.

I downloaded the media info tool, that will be really helpful. I have often exported something and then wondered what my settings had been. There has been A LOT of experimenting over the past couple years. I literally went into this BLIND. (how hard could it be, right? Im good with a camera... ha. ha. ha. <-serious sarcasm).

I do know that there will be people who still want the standard DVD, but everything is pre-order, so I would rather have options that I feel good about providing. My goal is to at least offer the best possible physical media as I can. Although, if the bitrate is 40, then I believe that would be the same end quality as the USB option, which is pretty popular. So, maybe you are talking me out of going down the blu-ray rabbit trail. hmmm.

[DB83]

I would be the last person to try to talk you out of an option.

One other avenue, as far as this forum is concerned is to make available some short samples of the original video - one at the distant and one close up. But, and I guess you do not need telling this, final quality is itself dependent on the camera(s) at your disposal as well as shooting conditions such as lighting.

[AccidentalVidGirl]

Haha, I shoot with an a7iii. It does an adequate job. I am happy with the original product, as much as I can be, at least. it is the taking a 75-90gb 4k file and squishing it down to 8gb. And stage lighting IS pretty awful to work with, the hot spots, ugh! But it is what it is. If you have any gems of advice in regards to dvd, I will hear them. I really do appreciate your advice thus far, you probably saved me a couple hundred dollars and the bitter disappointment that I am not going to get better than the two options I already have. lol

[DB83]

I would like to see some original samples if possible (no re-encoding) - in the past, believe me, I worked with some pretty rubbish sources and still managed a watchable DVD out of it. You can upload up to 500 mb direct here as an attachment. That will not be very long for a 4K source but will still give a flavour.

But do bear in mind that file size is directly connected with bitrate >> size = runlength * bitrate << commercial dvds do not even go to 8 mbit/sec. They are, typically 5.5 mbit/sec. And where I stand whether you shoot from 35 feet or 5 feet you still have the same number of pixels to work with. So it probably lighting that has a greater influence.

[AccidentalVidGirl]

So, the smallest clip I have is really short and 1gb. I would be happy to share some clips with you, but I'm not sure how I would get something down to that size?

[DB83]

Sorry for the delay. Bed time intervened

In that case upload it to a file sharing site - even Google Drive - and post the 'sharing' link. But not to Youtube since that will re-encode.


As for 'shortness' even 10 to 20 secs would suffice as long as the 'issues' are present. There are various tools to trim a video without re-encoding such as avidemux where you set the A/B markers, select copy for video, audio is not important, and then select the file format. Not sure if it handles 4K but others will.

[AccidentalVidGirl]

https://files.videohelp.com/u/307092/DQClip.mkv

You recommend so many magical applications... easy peasy. There is an unedited clip. it shows the full stage size. Although the aspect ratio is wrong because I completely forgot to change it before I started filming, but whatever. Every application that I have tried for authoring DVDs BESIDES the AVStoDVD has been complete garbage. Dancing Roblox.

I am fine with the AVStoDVD, except the menu is not very professional looking. Anything I can do to squeeze as much quality as possible though. I usually use the 8.5DL discs and the productions are usually 1:45-2:01, so fairly long.

[DB83]

Thank you for the clip. A few comments and observations.

I do not understand why you say the AR is wrong >> 3840*2160 reduces perfectly to 1920*1080 were you to go down the BD route. The quality looks fine to my ageing eyes even when reduced to dvd but, as I stated, the bitrate is always critical. Of course tv screens are much bigger than in the golden days of dvd but with good upscalers it really should be fine.


Yes, the avstodvd menus are quite basic but do give a choice of text-based or thumbnail based (maybe you did not find that). But allow me to offer a more sophisticated authoring program called DVDStyler. I have used your sample and used one of their standard menus which has a 'Play All' with clip selection. That may be perfect for you if your video is 'split' in to acts. Download the zip, extract the files and play the dvd in vlc or another software player and see what you think.

[AccidentalVidGirl]

I would have changed the AR to 16:9. I will play with the DVDStyler. I thought I had tried that one, but maybe I haven't. Thanks for the suggestions!

[DB83]

Confused ! The AR of my sample dvd is 16:9 !!!

[AccidentalVidGirl]

that's weird... the original IS 4:3... but no matter. It isn't the end of the world. I will remember to change that before the next round of filming.

[4kblurayguru]

I hate the quality and want to start moving to blu-ray. I know physical media is a dying art, but people still collect these productions, so going entirely digital isn't the way I want to go. Before I waste a ton of money on burning discs, I was hoping to get advice on my workflow.

false, just last week there's been almost 500 separate DVD titles released, since jan1/23 there's been 5000+ blu-ray titles being released. It's far from dead, it's only output from the major movie studios that have dropped, they currently release only 5% of titles on disc. This has nothing to do with you since you don't release Hollywood blockbusters.

I suggest you keep at DVD then move to BD later.

Videos are filmed in 4k, I have been processing through premiere pro,. Is there a maximum bitrate I should be aiming for? 50? Any other settings I might not be aware of for export? I was planning to get the 50GB BRD from verbatim, along with the verbatim external blu-ray burner, as my current burner won't do blu ray.

you didn't mention frame rate or shutter speed and it doesn't seem you used a stand alone mpeg2 encoder (w/ 2 pass encoding) but rather used the editor, also i'm guessing you watched the final product on hdtv instead of crt? if you film progressive video, you have to convert to interlace with bff for DVD. Some settings you have to set manually instead of letting the software do it. Hollywood doesn't use maximum bitrate, it might affect playback on older players.

I downloaded the tsMuxeR program and tested it out.!

since you do this for commercial purposes i suggest you get higher end software to use. Anything that cost $100 or higher

My goal is to at least offer the best possible physical media as I can.

Offer what's popular and has more compatibility, DVD as standard, BD/usb/VOD as special order/add on. I suggest you have the DVDs replicated, you can do 300 bulk pieces for good pricing. If it's an exclusive event you can get away with charging higher prices $30-$60.

Haha, I shoot with an a7iii. It does an adequate job. I am happy with the original product, as much as I can be, at least. it is the taking a 75-90gb 4k file and squishing it down to 8gb. And stage lighting IS pretty awful to work with, the hot spots, ugh! But it is what it is. If you have any gems of advice in regards to dvd, I will hear them.

I advise you to use a handheld HD camcorder (w/ tripod) for event work, such as https://pro.sony/en_SG/products/handheld-camcorders
frame rate 60, shutter 1/60 or off
resolution 1080p
record mode: long gop 50Mbps
DVD: replicated dvd-5 bulk