Can't burn a CD (only DVD) -- odd symptoms

[Seeker47]

I'm hoping someone here can help me troubleshoot this. When I put blank CD media into this computer's Pioneer 111D burner (one without excessive mileage on it -- it's not a recent model, of course, but had been an unused spare since I bought it, and has only been in service for about a year), ImgBurn spins the disc for a long time ("Device becoming ready"), then finally says "Incompatible Media." But these are the sort of major brand blanks I've always used: Maxell, Sony, etc. The drive does seem to read already burned CDs. And I just wasted a TYGO3, proving that it can still burn a DVD. If a burner is going south, shouldn't the ability to work with DVDs go before the CD capability goes too -- rather than the reverse ?

It gets stranger. I hooked up an external-housing Lite-On 1673 that I keep on hand, via USB , in an effort to burn this CD ISO to disc. ImgBurn got stuck in an endless "Writing Leadin" phase. I couldn't even kill its processes, had to power down the external burner and reboot the computer to get out. Tried this again with Nero, which stuck at 13 % and I likewise had to power off the burner but was able to kill Nero in Task Manager. No way it should take over 10 minutes to burn a 300M CD image at 24x, but only getting 13 % of the way there. I guess I should next try to burn a different ISO, to rule out there being some weirdness with that particular ISO. Now I'm starting to wonder about some sort of I/O problem (?).

[davexnet]

Perhaps an obscure problem in your Windows setup?
Try running a Live Linux CD (latest Ubuntu perhaps) and burn a disk from there.

[Seeker47]

Perhaps an obscure problem in your Windows setup?
Try running a Live Linux CD (latest Ubuntu perhaps) and burn a disk from there.

Thanks for your reply.

I suppose I could try that. Some more details trickling in: it is possible that we should disregard the result from the Lite-On in the DIY external housing: although it has served me well in the past -- for a variety of tasks -- I know that it had some kind of a timing issue that rendered it unable to be used for installing Windows on a laptop; when I switched to an "intended for laptops" Sony external burner, that issue went away. (But my problem above concerns a SFF desktop system.) I've just now successfully used that (faster) slimline Sony burner to boot the Acronis TI disc, and make an updated HDD image backup -- something I really needed to do, but could NOT, using the system's built-in Pioneer burner. Next, I will try to burn a CD with the Sony external, and see what happens.

When I had tried to boot the Acronis CD with either the built-in Pioneer, or the external Lite-On, I got the following errors. A long labored spin-up with the initial splash-screen, then "Unable to load initial Ramdisk," eventually followed by "Kernel Panic: VFS: Unable to mount root fs on 01:00." I've seen fairly similar errors in the past on systems that -- for whatever reason -- will NOT load live Linux-type discs. If I'm right about that, this system may have lost the ability to run them as well, although I know it could in the past. I'm sure that is tied in to something, but I don't really know what.

[davexnet]

Perhaps remove the BIOS battery for a few minutes, re-install and reset the clock and BIOS defaults.
If still bad, reseat the RAM and all add-on cards.

[hello_hello]

I suspect you have a couple of different problems and you're discovering them all at once. I returned a Pioneer 212 under warranty because it'd burn DVDs but CD burning would often fail and I still have a 112 I never got around to returning which only burns DVDs.

Being unable to boot from the CD using either of your internal burners might be completely unrelated, computers are evil creatures when it comes to co-incidence. Maybe try a different bootable CD. Got a Windows installation disc lying around? You might be able to eliminate the booting issue that way then concentrate on the burning one. You shouldn't have to install Windows, just run the installer long enough to see if it'll obviously work.

[ranchhand]

Probably the burner is bad. You can get a new one at Newegg for a few bucks, they are dirt cheap now. Before you screw with the operating system try replacing the burner. You can try a system restore, pick a date immediately before this started (hopefully you have one saved), but my bet is its the burner.

[jman98]

I've had burners lose the ability to write to DVDs and still be able to burn CDs and also the reverse. Losing the ability to correctly burn DVD+R DL discs is almost always the first thing to go with the ability to burn single layer DVDs or CDs going next randomly. Yes, I've had burners that could not burn DVD DL media or CDs but could burn single layer DVDs. It also sounds like a bad burner to me.

The Linux boot CD error concerns me that you may have other problems specifically with memory. So you may get a new burner and yet still find this PC to be unreliable.

[RabidDog]

Have you tried a new power supply? (long shot) It could be power related issues .. maybe right on the margin atm and trying to spin and burn is a step too far. Also the media is always suspect. I would suspect either a virus or someone has installed some software that is mislaigned with your stated goals.

[Nelson37]

You have established that you cannot boot a Live CD from either of two drives that both appear to have a problem.

Have you tried to boot the Live CD from the Sony drive that appears to be working correctly?

No real surprise that a drive that won't burn has a problem booting, as well.

[Seeker47]

I've had burners lose the ability to write to DVDs and still be able to burn CDs and also the reverse. Losing the ability to correctly burn DVD+R DL discs is almost always the first thing to go with the ability to burn single layer DVDs or CDs going next randomly. Yes, I've had burners that could not burn DVD DL media or CDs but could burn single layer DVDs. It also sounds like a bad burner to me.

The Linux boot CD error concerns me that you may have other problems specifically with memory. So you may get a new burner and yet still find this PC to be unreliable.

Thanks for all your comments.

@jman98:
That's interesting. I had thought that the "failure curve" on this was in one direction only. So, what you're telling me complicates the mix considerably. I've also more recently burned 2 or 3 Verb DLs in the affected burner (which I've not changed out yet, because doing so is rather a pain within the tight space layout of this SFF box, and I'd rather have that be the last resort), and this probably tends to shoot down some of the other theories, such as it being the power supply. That would be something of a disaster, since the PSUs for these are proprietary, have no substitute, are out of stock most everywhere, and I have just one spare left. That's also a nasty job, not undertaken lightly. And it's probably not called for anyway. If it's possible to have CD failures only with an optical drive, that casts this in a different light.

[EDIT: Have also recently had 3 or 4 successful burns with DVD RW blanks. Not sure where or if this fits in here. But, to reiterate: prior to jman98's comments, I would have expected DL capability to go first on an ailing burner, followed by DVD SL, with CDs being the last to go. If that is not necessarily the case, this becomes a rather untidy picture.]

I'm rather picky about the media I use. NO crap media. (I don't know if the old advice about most major brand CD blanks being fine -- unlike with DVD blanks -- still holds or not.) In any case, my stock of blank media is mostly a year old or older, and I don't leave it sitting in a hot garage, or anything like that.

I suspect that ranchhand is on the right track. I've got a couple of NIB Samsung burners here, plus a smattering of unused or barely used pre-115 Pioneer burners. Most likely, the next diagnostic tactic would be to connect one of those -- diverting the existing cabling, without having to unmount / remount the drive just yet -- and see if the CD problem went away. If that is the case, then it almost certainly was the Pio 111 burner. (But that would then become the shortest-lived Pio burner I ever had. In the past, I've had a 106 and a 108 that were still working fine after 4 or 5 years of solid use, which were ultimately replaced not due to problems but because it was high time to move on to burners with new features and better performance specs. Let me guess: they don't make 'em like they used to ?)

Nelson37 is also quite correct that I should have tried to boot one of the Live CDs from the external Sony drive. That was something I overlooked, but I might as well try it.

@Nelson37:
It's a curious thing, regarding this Live CD business. I basically standardized on the Shuttle "P" series as my preferred SFF platform. Even though Shuttle has moved on to other, later designs, I liked these the best, for a number of reasons. I've got a few different models from the P series, some AMD-based, some Intel-based. I've also got quite a collection of different Diagnostic & Repair CDs or DVDs, as well as various types of Linux Live CD. (I'm not even sure what the Acronis DD or TI discs happen to be using for self-boot. I know that DFSEE uses FreeDOS.) Most of these are built upon that IsoLinux loader thingie, though several of the former are based upon some kind of Win PE, whether from XP or 7. The thing with these Shuttle boxes is that most of them would boot certain of these self-contained CDs or DVDs but not others, even when new. I've been all up and down the BIOS settings, and I couldn't figure out, nor did I ever really document, the 'Why' of this. BUT, something that would concern me is a situation where a box like this particular SN27P2 under discussion definitely had a long demonstrated ability to boot certain of these discs that I may use from time to time, but suddenly no longer does. That is something I would want to address, if it takes a new burner or something else.

[Seeker47]

UPDATE: Ranchhand was right. Finally had some time to open up the case and check some things. I temporarily hooked up a never-used Pio 112 spare that I had here. In quick succession, I booted up both Acronis CDs, Multiboot Recovery Master, Hiren's, and Knoppix, then burned an ISO image to CD. No problem. I should probably make sure the DVD stuff works too, before I go to the trouble of swapping this out. Some disassembly is required, and lining this up properly with the spring-loaded drop-down door can be tricky. Due to the internal layout, going with another IDE burner on this puppy will be easier then trying to go with a SATA burner.

A memory problem likely would have exhibited some other symptoms, in addition.

An addendum to my previous post: some of these Shuttle models will boot from a stick, and some of them won't -- even though all the BIOSes show support for this. If there is some magic combination of BIOS settings that makes the key difference here, I have not yet figured out what it is. I've tried all the obvious variations. So, it wasn't just a matter of the bootable CDs. I'm no longer sure whether or not the SN27P2 (or at leaset this one) could previously boot from flashdrive, but I should be able to test it with a twin unit I have on hand.

Thanks again for all your replies.

[somebodeez]

I have a Pioneer BDR-206 that wouldn't burn CDs but did burn DVDs. I never did find out what the specific problem was but it magically cleared up when I installed SP1 for Windows 7.

Edit: Here's the thread in the ImgBurn forum I posted when I was having trouble:
http://forum.imgburn.com/index.php?showtopic=18070&#entry132462

[Seeker47]

I have a Pioneer BDR-206 that wouldn't burn CDs but did burn DVDs. I never did find out what the specific problem was but it magically cleared up when I installed SP1 for Windows 7.

Edit: Here's the thread in the ImgBurn forum I posted when I was having trouble:
http://forum.imgburn.com/index.php?showtopic=18070&#entry132462

Good to know about this. I have one of those burners, which I had intended to put into a certain computer, though that never happened. It's supposed to be a pretty good BR burner, and I see no compelling reason to get a later model -- if there is one -- so it will likely still go into another computer.

[nic2k4]

An addendum to my previous post: some of these Shuttle models will boot from a stick, and some of them won't -- even though all the BIOSes show support for this. If there is some magic combination of BIOS settings that makes the key difference here, I have not yet figured out what it is. I've tried all the obvious variations.

Have you looked through all the options when you hit the boot menu key? I've seen an AMI BIOS that would list USB flash drives under hard drives.

[somebodeez]

I have a Pioneer BDR-206 that wouldn't burn CDs but did burn DVDs. I never did find out what the specific problem was but it magically cleared up when I installed SP1 for Windows 7.

Edit: Here's the thread in the ImgBurn forum I posted when I was having trouble:
http://forum.imgburn.com/index.php?showtopic=18070&#entry132462

Good to know about this. I have one of those burners, which I had intended to put into a certain computer, though that never happened. It's supposed to be a pretty good BR burner, and I see no compelling reason to get a later model -- if there is one -- so it will likely still go into another computer.

I haven't had a problem with it since then. (note: I've never burned a BR with it though)