Enhanced Quality DVD's

[James Cash]

I'd like to improve my DVD's from shooting Dance Recitals. I currently capture using a SONY DCR-390 sending a S-Video
signal to a Canopus firewire converter into my MAC G4 Final Cut. Most of the recitals are 3-4 hours so after I edit the timeline
I use Edit to Tape and record to a Panasonic DVD recorder back thru the Canopus S-Video output. The DVD's are OK but I'm
wondering if I would see better color and resolution if I say converted componet video from the camera to firewire or if there was
a better DVD recorder out there. I don't really want to go to double side DVD's unless that's the biggest bang or the buck.

[jman98]

You do NOT mean "double side DVD's". You mean "dual layer DVDs". HUGE difference. If you do decide to go with dual layer discs, and I do not necessarily recommend this, you need to understand the following.
1) Verbatim DVD+R DL are the ONLY reliable DL media out there. Period. You use anything else, you WILL regret it.
2) No matter what you do, some moronic customer won't be able to play your DL DVDs because they will be using some old piece of crap DVD player that doesn't work correctly on DL discs. These idiots will blame YOU for your "crap discs" even though trying to use a DVD player bought 10 years ago is really questionable. But it happens.

Others will have to comment on your workflow and ways to improve it. However 3 to 4 hours on single layer DVDs is really too much. I generally won't go above 2.5 hours.

Crap - I just now picked up that you are a Mac user. Unfortunately your query is Mac specific. You may not think so, but it is. You should have posted in our Mac forum for the best help. I will ask a moderator to move this for you.

[aedipuss]

first i'd need to know what cam you are using. afaik sony never made a dcr-390. a dsr-390, yes. if that's the cam then your video would start off much better if you captured the DV firewire out directly from the cam, rather than the cam digital to s-video analog to canopus digital conversion.

[James Cash]

Excuse my typo - the camera is a DSR-390. I thought about using the camera's firewire but what about audio ? I currently mix the audio and send it to the Canopus. Does the 390 send audio out it's firewire if I input a line level through the XLR's ?
And yes to jaman98, dual layer DVD's would end up being a nightmare........

[aedipuss]

yes firewire sends complete DV exactly the same as what would be on tape, DV video+ pcm audio.

[poisondeathray]

Ignoring the analog workflow issues for the moment - Why are you using a DVD recorder at all? They generally produce lower quality encodings compared to multipass software solutions, especially when you are trying to squeeze so many hours on a disc

[James Cash]

I haven't been able to create a 3-Hr DVD from Final Cut Studio. It seems to limit DVD recording at 1.5 hrs. Is there another way ?
Thanks for the help !

[poisondeathray]

Before you even consider making a 3 hour dvd, you should know (if everything else is the same) , the quality is roughly proportional to the bitrate used. The more hours you try to squeeze on, the lower the bitrate. You can use a bitrate calculator (e.g. https://www.videohelp.com/calc.htm )

For example if you squeeze 4 hours on a dvd5, assuming 192kbps audio, the video bitrate will be 2344kbps - that is very low and the quality will be atrocious . Consider splitting to multiple discs or using dvd9. You mention "bang for buck" in one sentence and "quality" in the other. These are often opposed and you have to make tradeoffs. Are you trying to save a few cents or make higher quality dvd's? You will find very few "professional" dvd5's over 2hours for this reason

For a given bitrate, software encoders will be more efficient than 1pass CBR dvd-recorder hardware encoders (they will allocate distribute the bitrate more efficiently over "peaks" and "valleys")

For a mac workflow, most people export using Compressor to DVD Studio Pro - I'm not up to date on mac tools, so maybe others can help with the specifics

[johns0]

Thread moved to the mac forum where you can get more help.

[James Cash]

From what I've tried Compressor (Mac) will not encode over 90Min to DVD Studio Pro. I guess that's where Apple draws the line on a acceptable quality picture. Someone mentioned Sorrenson Squeeze (sp) might allow longer encoding times. Any experience with this ?

[poisondeathray]

You don't have to use the presets in compressor , they are meant as a starting point. You should be able to change the values in the inspector (use a bitrate calculator to figure what to use)

Content matters too - for example if the dance has lots of motion, action, it won't compress very well and compession issues will more likely arise (e..g macroblocking)

[James Cash]

This is great information. Thanks, I'll try setting a bitrate from the chart so see what happens.

[terryj]

1. Decide up front what you want to provide to your customer.
You are either going to keep your costs down ( per cent cost on DVD Blanks) and provide the customer
with Standard Def Video, or you are going to target the project to the output media it needs ( paying more
for the cost of the dvd blanks, but properly figuring that cost into materials charged to the customer)
and produce a higher quality product. You simply cannot do both.

2. Use a Bitrate Calculator as others have stated to get the optimal Video and Audio Quality you need.
I like this one: http://home.comcast.net/~c.linke/bitbudget/
or this one: http://urbanmacuser.blogspot.com/2011/04/week-of-favorite-apps-day-two-bitrate.html

3. Workflow should be: Ingest DV straight from Camera into Final Cut Pro, edit in timeline,
export out to Compressor as QT Movie at edited length and finalized audio bitrate,
and then using your bitrate calculator, set your target accordingly for SD ( DVD -5)
or HQ ( DVD-9). Use a custom made preset, that follows what your BitRate Calculator recommends.
Then import those assets into DVD Studio Pro, & set the Desired Project Build to match accordingly
(DVD-5/DVD-9) so that it won't choke on "1.5 hrs of video". Keep your menu assets lower than 250mbs TOTAL.
( I simply use: Static JPG file, 10 sec clip of 128kbs audio for menu music, and simple click and navigate buttons
without animations).

4. Export from DVD Studio to Compiled VIDEO_TS folder, and burn to burner with TOAST.

A video recorder will ignore your Bit Rate Calc settings and use its own proprietary
settings to get the video squeezed into the target; there is no manual tweaking other than
VCR like settings ( Runtime) for SP/SLP?LP/EP. A computer burner is essential
when trying to control finalized quality of output.