VHS to DVD - Pulling hair with research

[SomeDay]

Hi All;

I am in the process of researching how to convert my family VHS tapes to DVD. I have read quite a bit and I feel like its putting me in circles and frustrating me enough to want to pull my hair out.

I apologize if some feel that I have not searched enough to be posting this, but I am truly at my wits end with this and pretty soon I might just give up on the whole idea and put the vhs back in the closet for another 10 years.

What I am hoping to do. I would love to be able to convert these to DVD with indexing menus so that I can jump to certain parts without fast forwarding like the VHS is currently.

The tapes are mostly original (not copies), recorded about 25 years ago. I have about 50 tapes full of video. I have no equipment purchased at this point. I tend to try and research things before buying to make sure my money is invested properly, however this has to be one of the most confusing things I have ever researched. My computer is old, about 8 years to be exact. But in saying that I did sink a good amount into the computer back then. Its WinXp Pro Sp2, Pentium 4 Cpu 2 Ghz, 768 MB Sdram, Nvidia Geforce2 Mx 400 graphics card, Directx 9.0 and not sure about sound card. The Graphics card is agp and my slots are PCI. I do not have PCIe. I have lots of HD space and more drives to put in if need be 7200 rpm.

My computer is capable of up to 3 gigs of ram, but with 1 gig sdram pin 168 at $250 usd I do think I will be upgrading to that. But one of my sticks is 256 and upgrading it to 512 should be very doable. So that will give me 1500mb of ram, which is not bad for 8 year old computer.

My computer has 3 pci slots. two are currently taken. 1 for video card and other for sound. The computer also has onboard sound so if I need the sound slot i can always go back to the onboard sound. So at max I have two pci slots to play with.

Thats all for my computer. My VCR. Generic no name from Wally world. SVC something of another. Its actually dual dvd and vcr. Its not that great, it was a gift actually. I never used to much not even for the dvd. The Vcr part may have been used 10 times in its life so the only good news is that the heads are clean I have looked around locally for standalone VCR's and cannot find any. Sears website list a JVC HRJ693U and I am unsure if that is in stock locally, more likely not. The reviews on sears site is horrible 2 stars out of 5. Not very appealing. I have looked for VCR's in the local classifieds online and paper and cannot seem to locate a decent vcr. I have also searched e-bay and cannot seem to find a reasonably priced TBC vcr that I can afford. Surprisingly there are some brand new panasonics on their ag-1980 for $1800.00. Little out of budget

Problem with buying VCR for me online is that I am on a island in Canada and the shipping is crazy to get it to me. About $200 Canadian at best. Just to buy a used VCR that may or may not be in good shape head wise no matter what the listing says. Doesn't seem wise and almost all but ruled that out.

I have been researching Canopus ADVC boxes after reading about them hear. I thought the advc-300 would be my answer and found a slightly used one on ebay. Waited days for the auction to come to a end and bid 10 mins before to start getting auto bid beat right up to $70 less then a new one and 23secs left got bid out and lost. Person got a used one for $64 usd less then a new one on ebay. For me that is $100 less and made a difference, but if I were in the states I think I would have bought new, unsure what that person was thinking. for me to buy a new one it would cost me about $550 Canadian to get it here and I would still need to get a capture card and possibly a video card(have not researched that yet). Even then with my VCR I probably still not getting great results.

So I am lost. What to do? I have also read about feeding it through a panasonig DVD recorder to help stablize the video, but can seem to find one of those either. What about buying a camcorder to feed it through, would that work?

I have also thought about just buying a vhs to dvd all in one unit. I know that it won't create the indexing and can't really edit it and put filters on it. But at this point seems like the only thing I may be able to get my hands on. Wouldn't I then be able to upload the end result to my computer and slice and edit the whole dvd?

Arggg as you can see I am confused and unsure how to wisely spend my money to do this job as best as possible. I have about a $500 usd HARDWARE budget. That is to get what ever I need to capture the vhs into my computer, keeping in mind that could include capture card, video card, vcr, tbc, etc.. What to do?

PLEASE HELP.

Thank You

[AlanHK]

I have also thought about just buying a vhs to dvd all in one unit. I know that it won't create the indexing and can't really edit it and put filters on it. But at this point seems like the only thing I may be able to get my hands on. Wouldn't I then be able to upload the end result to my computer and slice and edit the whole dvd?

I can't advise if this is the best method, but it's certainly doable.
Your PC spec is fine for this, obviously a new machine would be faster, but the same result in the end.

Record to DVD (use an RW perhaps) in highest quality, finalise, copy to PC, use a MPEG editor like Womble's MPEG-VCR to cut and join, reauthor (eg, with GuiforDVDAuthor), adding menus, chapters, etc.

If you want to clean up the image or sound, you can do that, it's just a matter of how much time you want to devote to it.

[Relayerman]

I was in the same boat your were and managed to get the ball rolling. Here are the things to consider:
1) the VCR obviously needs to be able to play your old tapes and the tracking needs to be consistent. It would be good to get a VCR with a builtin TBC. I shopped around and bought a new JVC SR-V10U which does a great job and has the builtin TBC and lots of settings menus to play with. I think I paid about $150 or so for it. Here is a good reference page:
http://www.digitalfaq.com/dvdguides/capture/playback.htm

2) you need a way to capture the feed from the VCR. I bought my computer back in 2001 with the ATI All-In-Wonder 8500DV. Great card and does the job on my PC (I have 1gig RAM and 2ghz processor). I would recommend you upgrade your PC ram to at least 1gig. More would help. The thing about VHS tapes is that it contains lossy material already. Its not like there is HD material there to preserve. Keep that in mind. There are capture cards out there and one that converts to MPEG-2 on the fly would be nice (Hauppage, ATI, etc). Also keep in mind that you can get 2 hrs of VHS on one 4.3 DVD without a lot of quality loss (due to VHS material being lossy already). See here:
http://www.digitalfaq.com/dvdguides/capture/understandsource.htm

3) i personally use TMPGEnc DVD Author Pro 2 to take the captured material and make menus and chapters. Not hard to do and when doing home movies you'll probably find yourself using the same layout, fonts, backgrounds for each DVD. Its easier that way. I've done about 13 DVDs already. After the first few it becomes the norm.

Making the DVDs is time-consuming as you have to let the tapes play to capture them. Once captured, making the DVD is itself is not bad. The encoding and burning might take about an hour or so.

Hope this helps.

[jman98]

You could just buy a good DVD recorder and not capture to your PC. Some prefer that route. Capturing to your PC first is time consuming. DVD recorders are disappearing from the North American marketplace and while Philips does make one with a hard drive that's been well received (and also allowed it to be sold under the Magnavox name) I've read reports that this model is starting to disappear. If you can find it, you could use it for editing. It's the Philips 3575 (the 3576 is similar as well).

I cannot recommend ATI cards. I had one years ago - never again. Hauppauage makes some great PCI based cards. The PVR-350 has worked well for me for years for standard def video capturing. If you go with ATI, you absolutely cannot do anything else on the PC while you are recording video or you may have issues with your captures. ATI uses your PC's CPU for encoding. Hauppauge uses a chip on the card so you can, theoretically, do other jobs in the PC while recording video and not mess things up.

I wouldn't upgrade your PC RAM beyond 1 GB. On my PCs running XP I've never been able to get memory in use to go beyond 750 MB or so. Your experience may be different, but I just want to warn you of my experience. Going up to 3 GB will be a waste of money - I'm sure of that.

[Bjs]

Read those specs...

Agp gpu, then in later paragraph say 3 pci slots, one taken by gpu ???

Onboard video + agp slot + pci1 = share resources ... common issues can develop
(If onboard is available and used, then agp and pci1 should have no device installed = free's pc resources)
(pci2 / pci3 = shared resources)

As for the video question, which seems a bit long, and having checked the system specs, you should look more towards a device capable of hardware encoding.

Now just because you have a third pci free dose not mean you can fill it as this will cause further resource issues .

This limits you to usb devices such as > http://www.amazon.com/Hauppauge-WinTV-PVR-USB-Tuner-Personal-Video-Recorder/dp/B0000AL8XX, which would be within reason for someone wanting to minimize their expense for a project like this.

As for dvd recorders, forget them... one glitch and you'll pull the rest of your hair out... they are sensitive devices.

That's tape's to pc in mpeg2 ... then you just need a few free tools and a few of the guides to complete your work.

Unless you need to buy another vcr with tbc, then you'll have to take the bitter pill and pay the going rates for shipping ... it's only going to get dearer in the future.

PS: Minimize all tasks while recording is in process, and end all non-essential running tasks in the background should provide you with error free recording (some times programs can wake and cause brief system pauses which end up showing in final recording)

[SomeDay]

AlanHK

Record to DVD (use an RW perhaps) in highest quality, finalise, copy to PC, use a MPEG editor like Womble's MPEG-VCR to cut and join, reauthor (eg, with GuiforDVDAuthor), adding menus, chapters, etc.

If you want to clean up the image or sound, you can do that, it's just a matter of how much time you want to devote to it.

Thanks AlanHK.

This is the method I am currently leaning towards since I have having hard time finding a decent VCR. Thanks for the reference to software.

Relayerman

1.)the VCR obviously needs to be able to play your old tapes and the tracking needs to be consistent. It would be good to get a VCR with a builtin TBC. I shopped around and bought a new JVC SR-V10U which does a great job

I have tested some of my VHS tapes in my cheap vcr and all play without tracking issues except one that was in bad shape. I truely wish I could get a VCR with TBC. At this point I cannot find one. For about a hour now I have search for the model you listed and cannot find it either. Wish I did this a few years ago now.

Relayerman

2.) you need a way to capture the feed from the VCR. I bought my computer back in 2001 with the ATI All-In-Wonder 8500DV. Great card and does the job on my PC (I have 1gig RAM and 2ghz processor). I would recommend you upgrade your PC ram to at least 1gig.

Yes, I have yet to look into fine detail on which capture card to get as I have been focusing on what mediums to get it into the capture card. But I will be sure to read about the ATI products. I plan on upgrading the memory if possible. I think I can do that rather cheap as this time of ram is available in surplus stores. After my post I thought about it, I must have two 256mb ram. So maybe I will do both to 512mb to get that 1500 I was hoping for. Can have to much ram as long as its affordable.

Relayerman

3.) I personally use TMPGEnc DVD Author Pro 2 to take the captured material and make menus and chapters

Making the DVDs is time-consuming as you have to let the tapes play to capture them. Once captured, making the DVD is itself is not bad. The encoding and burning might take about an hour or so.

Thanks for the software reference, I will be sure to look into using that. As for the time consuming part, I realize this and that is why I want to do it now. I am laid off for a few months and no better time to do it then current. I think I will enjoy playing with the video and wasting time on it. lol

jman98

You could just buy a good DVD recorder and not capture to your PC. Some prefer that route. Capturing to your PC first is time consuming.

I've read reports that this model is starting to disappear. If you can find it, you could use it for editing. It's the Philips 3575 (the 3576 is similar as well).

Yes, I am leaning towards this method. I will look into this model if I choose to go this route, thank you.

jman98

I cannot recommend ATI cards. I had one years ago - never again. Hauppauage makes some great PCI based cards.

That is not good to hear. I will keep that in mind. I plan on reading many reviews to ensure I don't have issues like yours. Hauppauage seems to be a name that comes up many a time as good. I think I will pay close attention to them.

jman98

I wouldn't upgrade your PC RAM beyond 1 GB. On my PCs running XP I've never been able to get memory in use to go beyond 750 MB or so

After reading your post it rings a bell to me that I may have tried this in the past and that is why I now have two 256 sticks instead of 512. I think I will try it again tho and maybe a bios update will help. I am fairly good with computers, been on them for a long time. Worth a try.

Bjs

Read those specs...

Agp gpu, then in later paragraph say 3 pci slots, one taken by gpu ???

Onboard video + agp slot + pci1 = share resources ... common issues can develop
(If onboard is available and used, then agp and pci1 should have no device installed = free's pc resources)
(pci2 / pci3 = shared resources)

Caught me. That was a mistake. I do have one free pci slots, but not because one is taken by the video, one is used for sound and other for network card. AGP used for video. I typed it wrong on purpose to see if everybody was reading it all.. lol.. no just joking.. I made a mistake. I am not using onboard video. Its standalone in the agp slot. Nvidia Geforce2 mx 400.

Bjs

As for the video question, which seems a bit long, and having checked the system specs, you should look more towards a device capable of hardware encoding.

Now just because you have a third pci free dose not mean you can fill it as this will cause further resource issues .

This limits you to usb devices such as > http://www.amazon.com/Hauppauge-WinTV-PVR-USB-Tuner-Personal-Vide ... 0000AL8XX, which would be within reason for someone wanting to minimize their expense for a project like this.

As for dvd recorders, forget them... one glitch and you'll pull the rest of your hair out... they are sensitive devices.

That's tape's to pc in mpeg2 ... then you just need a few free tools and a few of the guides to complete your work.

Unless you need to buy another vcr with tbc, then you'll have to take the bitter pill and pay the going rates for shipping ... it's only going to get dearer in the future.

PS: Minimize all tasks while recording is in process, and end all non-essential running tasks in the background should provide you with error free recording (some times programs can wake and cause brief system pauses which end up showing in final recording)

sorry for the long question, tried to be detailed as possible to make sure I leave nothing out that could result in problems.

I should hope that I can fill the thrid pci slot, Maybe I should add something in there to test. I haven't had problems with this machine hardware wise ever and I have installed a few things in it over the years.

I always thought usb would be last resort and that things install directly in your computer were better. Specially since my computer is USB 1.0. I know I can pop in a expansion card for 2.0 but that will use my last slow and possible have hardware problems as you say. So maybe the pci is better way to try first?

Your thoughts on the DVD recorder is why this topic is so confusing, one says something and another say different. Two people seems to have recommended that method in this post alone, but yet you say I will lose more hair which I don't like! Hrmm.. what to do.

So not sure I fully understand your recommendation, just to sum it up. You think USB capture device and test with my current vcr. If problems arise then buy a better vcr at whatever the cost may be as long as its affordable to a degree. IS this correct?

AS for minimize, yes I realize that would be the best course of action for this old computer. With that said, my computer runs top for everything I have ever done with it, including what I do now. This is why I never bought another one. Granted I am leaning towards one now as soon as the funds are available. I don't do a lot of resource hogging things. Mostly word apps and internet browsing with a little coding. I don't play games or edit video until now. Just a note tho, I have seen my computer load up things faster then new computers with vista and even xp. I have it tweaked to the make and all none essential services shut off. Spyware and virus free. So it should run considering the lastest premiere suggest 2ghz with 2mgs of ram. I am off on the important ram but my cpu is bottom spec.

Thanks to all that have posted so far, please keep em coming to help me narrow this down a bit.

[Relayerman]

My ATI AIW 8500DV never gave me any problems in capturing and it DOES do MPEG-2 conversion on the fly via the card, NOT software (software sets the settings for the card). The more recent ATI cards seem to be more finicky than the older ones so maybe Hauppauge is the way to go for you.

YES, you should throw RAM at your machine up to 2gig for Win XP on a mahcine your age. Above that Windows doesn't utilize the RAM as effeciently.

[joecass]

50 VHS is quite a bit of work to convert to DVD on a computer, no matter what computer it is. It's very time consuming, and in my opinion, not worth the effort. What's not mentioned above is all the capturing, encoding,
re-encoding, editing and DVD burning using the suggested methods. You need tons of time and patience.
DVD recorders however, come in three flavors : standalone DVD recorder, DVD/VHS recorder/player, and
DVD recorders with Hard Drives. The last models of DVD recorders with hard drives sold in the US & Canada
were quite competent machines which made it pretty easy to record any video material to the hard drive, edit
the video, burn to DVD and, later on do fine editing on a computer. At least it's a starting point. All you need
to do is hook up your VHS machine to the input of the DVD recorder, and hit record. Also, VHS video can
be recorded directly to DVD on all 3 of the above machine if so desired, albeit without any editing, but the
editing can be done later on when time permits on your computer. DVD recorders let you choose the video
quality and recording time in incremental steps, i.e., one-hour, two-hour, four & six hour modes.
In 2 hour mode, there is absolutely no difference between the source such a VHS tape and the recorded DVD.
The Philips 3575/3576 models most recently sold in the US are very competent at recording to the built in
hard drive, editing segments, adding or deleting chapters, and burning to DVD-R, DVD+R or ReWritable discs.
The Panasonic DMR-EZ47VK/485VK models are DVD/VHS recorders without the hard drive, These machines
will convert VHS to DVD in a flash, simple as hitting one button, albeit without extensive editing.
Theoretically you could use a machine like this to do 50 quick transfers of VHS to DVD, and then at your
leisure put the DVD's on your computer for final editing.
Nobody seemed to mention how finnicky computer capture cards are, the learning curve involved, and the
numerous problems which can occur doing video transfers.
If TBC is not that important, I'd go with a DVD recorder of some kind. The Panasonics have built in noise
reduction when transferring VHS to DVD, make wonderful copies in real time. The Philips machines are very
easy to learn and use. And, on this site there are tons of tutorials and suggetions when it comes to DVD
recorders, no to mention other brands of very reliable machines available on the used market.
Sorry to be so biased in my opinion, but I have three computers, and nine DVD recorders. I wouldn't give up
my DVD recorders for anything !

[SomeDay]

50 VHS is quite a bit of work to convert to DVD on a computer, no matter what computer it is. It's very time consuming, and in my opinion, not worth the effort. What's not mentioned above is all the capturing, encoding,
re-encoding, editing and DVD burning using the suggested methods. You need tons of time and patience.
DVD recorders however, come in three flavors : standalone DVD recorder, DVD/VHS recorder/player, and
DVD recorders with Hard Drives. The last models of DVD recorders with hard drives sold in the US & Canada
were quite competent machines which made it pretty easy to record any video material to the hard drive, edit
the video, burn to DVD and, later on do fine editing on a computer. At least it's a starting point. All you need
to do is hook up your VHS machine to the input of the DVD recorder, and hit record. Also, VHS video can
be recorded directly to DVD on all 3 of the above machine if so desired, albeit without any editing, but the
editing can be done later on when time permits on your computer. DVD recorders let you choose the video
quality and recording time in incremental steps, i.e., one-hour, two-hour, four & six hour modes.
In 2 hour mode, there is absolutely no difference between the source such a VHS tape and the recorded DVD.
The Philips 3575/3576 models most recently sold in the US are very competent at recording to the built in
hard drive, editing segments, adding or deleting chapters, and burning to DVD-R, DVD+R or ReWritable discs.
The Panasonic DMR-EZ47VK/485VK models are DVD/VHS recorders without the hard drive, These machines
will convert VHS to DVD in a flash, simple as hitting one button, albeit without extensive editing.
Theoretically you could use a machine like this to do 50 quick transfers of VHS to DVD, and then at your
leisure put the DVD's on your computer for final editing.
Nobody seemed to mention how finnicky computer capture cards are, the learning curve involved, and the
numerous problems which can occur doing video transfers.
If TBC is not that important, I'd go with a DVD recorder of some kind. The Panasonics have built in noise
reduction when transferring VHS to DVD, make wonderful copies in real time. The Philips machines are very
easy to learn and use. And, on this site there are tons of tutorials and suggetions when it comes to DVD
recorders, no to mention other brands of very reliable machines available on the used market.
Sorry to be so biased in my opinion, but I have three computers, and nine DVD recorders. I wouldn't give up
my DVD recorders for anything !

Yes, I think 50 Videos is a fair bit as well. Tho I see people here transfering a lot more, I figure its more then enough work for me. As for it being worth it. I think maybe. Its my family history on tape here we are talking about. But, weather its worth all the time recoding, etc.. is debateble. Maybe straight from VCR to DVD recorder is the way to go. I have been leaning towards that since I started reading all this confusion. I do wonder why the second re-encoding in your method? Why encode and then re-encode? Isn't there a way to skip that step and go right to proper format to edit then burn?

Out of the three flavors you listed what is the perferable way? Would a self enclosed unit with VHS and DVD help avoid sync and drop framed issues? Are these even issues with this setup? I am thinking that with just a DVD recorder I am still going to need a good vcr with TBC to keep everything in sync. If I got that then its only a capture card away from hooking it up to my computer and with TBC I should have less hassles??

Out of the phillips and the panasonic, it sounds like the panasonic may be the way to go if I choose this method.

I have no experience at all with capture cards. The plus to them tho is that when this is all done, I have a capture card to put things into my computer which would be a nice bonus.

As for TBC. I have found a JVC s9800u. So maybe I should go the computer way? Argg.. What to do.. I still sitting on the fence here as this is my family videos and a fair investment to do it.

[joecass]

I'd say it's always worth the time and effort to do things the best way you can, especially for family videos.
I'm no expert on which way is better, except to say that I've done this type of work on my DVD recorders with
family videos, and tried it again on my computer. The computer way wins out from a technical standpoint,
but takes way too much time. Capturing video to a computer results in MPEG II or .AVI video files, which are
not DVD compliant. Whatever software you choose has to convert those files into .VOB and other files that
a set top DVD player can read. This would involve capturing, encoding to mpeg or .avi, and re-encoding to
DVD files. IMHO, too much work ! The upside to this is being able to edit your videos, and create your own
Chapters and Menus to your satisfaction. DVD recorders are pretty limited in what they can do as far as
editing, depending on which type and model you choose.
You cannot do the same computer-type editing on a DVD machine such as the Panasonic, however, other
machines made by Philips, Toshiba, Pioneer and Sony provide more options.
As far as using a high end VCR for TBC and Sync issues, I can't comment on that since those features are
not important to someone like me. I initially used a standard VHS machine plugged into a DVD recorder
to copy my family videos, and was happy with the result, as I am not a perfectionist.
Maybe you should consider attempting this project both ways, you already have a VHS machine and a
computer, just buy an inexpensive capture card, a used or refurbished DVD recorder, and try both methods.

[themaster1]

You'd need a capture card as i'm sure your tapes need to be fixed (chroma noise, colors etc...)plus if you wanna avoid sync errors the only card that will solve this is the avdc (never tried personnally but i know it's perfect for that) it capture in dv so you will need lots of space for 50 tapes. That is the ultimate solution if you're perfectionist and rich.

There is a cheaper solution: basic capture card + encoding in .avi huffyuv.You still need lot of space

and finally the dvd recorder encode directly in mpeg2 (*brrr) / dvd compliant ready to go. If your tapes are not in good shape, just forget about it.

In all cases, a very good vcr is required and maybe a full frame tbc.

It all depends on what's in your wallet

[victoriabears]

As you are in Canada and if you are near a costco, get a Pioneer DVD recorder to try out, they will always let you take it back in 90 days.

Keep it simple to start with, how do you know your tapes need a TBC or any filters, depends how much time and money you want to spend archiving something you will get out and watch ?? times.

I am not a PC capture fan as it usually means your PC is dedicated to that whilst capturing, but you can always do it at night. & I must admit you can capture at highest quality the finished (after editing) length will allow.

The learning curve with capture cards I found irritating, dvd recorders are easy to use, the Pioneer has incrimental encoding rather than just XP/SP etc so thats good for the 1hr 15 minute shows.

Using DVD+RW discs you can take to a PC and edit and menu them, using TMPG author.

[FulciLives]

Pioneer makes the best DVD recorders today. They are no longer sold within the USA but they are sold within Canada.

Very simple.

1.) Record from VHS to Pioneer DVD recorder.
2.) Import to your computer
3.) Use TMPGEnc DVD Author to trim, put chapters, create menu etc.
4.) Burn to a new DVD using the computer

Use a DVD-RW to go from recorder to computer and you can re-use the same disc over and over.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[AlanHK]

DVD recorders are pretty limited in what they can do as far as
editing, depending on which type and model you choose.

Once you have a DVD, you can import from that on your PC -- a good MPEG editor, like Womble's, can cut and join without reencoding, so no quality loss.
Then you can import your edited MPEGs into a DVD authoring app and add menus, subtitles, etc.

[SomeDay]

You'd need a capture card as i'm sure your tapes need to be fixed (chroma noise, colors etc...)plus if you wanna avoid sync errors the only card that will solve this is the avdc (never tried personnally but i know it's perfect for that) it capture in dv so you will need lots of space for 50 tapes. That is the ultimate solution if you're perfectionist and rich.

There is a cheaper solution: basic capture card + encoding in .avi huffyuv.You still need lot of space

and finally the dvd recorder encode directly in mpeg2 (*brrr) / dvd compliant ready to go. If your tapes are not in good shape, just forget about it.

In all cases, a very good vcr is required and maybe a full frame tbc.

It all depends on what's in your wallet

Ultimately this is the method I would love to go with, but after reading the post about the dvd recorders and ease of use, I think I am going to go that way. Since I have no experience, have to buy used vcr to do it, expensive capture card and still may have problems. I am not sure my computer spec are really up for that either. Having to add memory and possibly firewire card. I think I am very close to ruling that out. In about 6 hours I won't have a choice as the vcr will be gone.

[SomeDay]

Here is what I have found locally in the dvd recorder market. The units below are final price with taxes and everything included. Its exactly what it will cost out the door.

DVD Recorder - Panasonic DMR-EZ27 $316.00
DVD Recorder - Samsung DVD-R174/XAC $170.00
DVD/VCR Recorder - Toshiba D-VR7 $260.00
DVD/VCR Recorder JVC - DRMV793 $282.00
DVD/VCR Recorder - Panasonic - DMR-ES36 - $373.00
DVD/160gig Hard Driver Recorder - Pioneer DVR-560H-K $338.00


Misc....
VHS to PC - Ion Audio - VCR2PC - $260.00
SVHS VCR - JVC HR-S9800U - $395 Used Works Great!


Any recomendations. The Panasonic DMR-ES36 seems real good on paper. Tho in the forums here in says that it has IRE issues. Has that been corrected? I could not locate a phillips and the pioneer doesn't not have a vcr. Please keep in mind my vcr is cheap no name.

Link to features on the Panasonic DMR-ES36
http://www.panasonic.ca/english/audiovideo/dvdvcr/recorder/DMRES36.asp

[FulciLives]

Panasonic sucks. Samsung sucks. The new Toshiba and JVC models suck (older models from these brands were OK but such models are long gone).

Go Pioneer. It's the best that's out there now. After you use it for this project you will find that it works very nicely for recording from TV since it has a built-in HDD (can be used as a DVR in that sense plus for your project you can do some simple editing).

Get the JVC HR-S9800U if you can afford it. If not keep looking for another cheaper JVC S-VHS VCR.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[gshelley61]

Any of these JVC S-VHS units in good used working condition would be perfectly fine (the 9600 and 7600 had the best build quality of all these):

JVC HR-S9911U
JVC HR-S9900U
JVC HR-S9800U
JVC HR-S9600U
JVC HR-S7900U
JVC HR-S7800U
JVC HR-S7600U
JVC SR-V101US
JVC SR-V10US

These are the DVD recorders I personally would suggest for this project:

Toshiba RD-XS35 (160GB hard drive)
Toshiba RD-XS34 (160GB hard drive)
Toshiba D-R4 (no hard drive)

Record hand held camcorder footage to DVD at the highest quality level (1 hour per single sided DVD). Set the JVC VCR's video output settings to EDIT (not SHARP, SOFT or AUTO), TBC/DNR ON, STABILIZER OFF, DIGITAL R3 OFF. Use the s-video output of the JVC and the s-video input of the Toshiba. Set the Toshiba DVD recorder input settings to Black Level: Standard, input DNR OFF (the JVC will be doing the videotape noise reduction). The hard drive Toshiba DVD recorders have the best video recording quality of any of the units I've ever tried, and offer the most control over your recording, editing and the finished DVD.

There are other ways to deal with transferring 50 VHS tapes to DVD, but doing what I outline above will produce results that are very hard to beat.

If you are determined to buy new gear, Pioneer is probably your best choice for the DVD recorder. The only new S-VHS VCR's available from JVC that have the TBC/DNR feature are prosumer ("ProLine") combo models that are very expensive and are not built very well.

[FulciLives]

Very good advice from gshelley61 but do bear in mind that all of that equipment ... well all of it is old. None of those models can be bought brand new now.

There are those that feel the older Toshiba units (very few models other than those three listed and maybe one or two others) were the best DVD recorders ever. Some feel the first two generations (now long gone) of JVC recorders were the best. However Pioneer has always been right there and these days they are made the same (unlike the current models by Toshiba and JVC) so I recommend Pioneer as you can still buy them new. The one complaint about the Pioneer units is that they don't do any "cleaning" per se of the video signal. I think they do very good MPEG-2 encoding and are very faithful to the original source though and are fairly flexible. I've always been happy with mine (despite it dying on me ... although I was able to only recently get it fixed).

The thing about the JVC and Toshiba units (of old) is that they were able to help less-than-spectacular sources ... like VHS ... look a bit better due to the way they incorporated some filtering (of the image). The Pioneer does a fine job in my opinion but it does very little image clean-up (although it does have a decent TBC built-in as I've recorded some tapes with a lot of drop-outs etc. and it never failed to record them).

So if you want new buy Pioneer otherwise if you are willing to hunt around (eBay perhaps?) look for one of the two HDD models mentioned by gshelley61 and when it comes to a S-VHS VCR unfortunately you really are out-of-luck unless buying used.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
I looked at the B&H Photo and Video website. They have two JVC D-VHS/S-VHS units that are being sold as "refurbished" at what I would call reasonable prices. The have one model (CLICK HERE) for $149.95 US Dollars and another model (CLICK HERE) for $199.99 US Dollars and both look fine to me (I'd go for the cheaper one myself). They are based in the USA but do ship to Canada.

[victoriabears]

Which island off of Canada do you live on !

Only suggestion I can make it get it shipped to a more central location (friend/relative) and make a trip out of it.

Interesting to me that the JVC vcr to Toshiba option is mentioned , in my experience using a JVC M100 DVD recorder with a JVC vcr as mentioned actually causes more problems than it solves-weird.

I just caution against the JVC VCR solves all idea, as it hasn;t worked for me, the Panasonics do a better job for my tapes. Which have been carefully recorded and stored, may be thats an ingrediant, also not recorded on JVC vcr's ?

Some suggestions:-

http://cgi.ebay.ca/PANASONIC-AG-1960-AG-1960-VCR-EDITING-SVHS-VHS-DECK_W0QQitemZ390028...1%7C240%3A1318

http://cgi.ebay.ca/Panasonic-PV-S7670-S-VHS-VCR_W0QQitemZ150324151531QQcmdZViewItemQQp...1%7C240%3A1318

http://cgi.ebay.ca/Panasonic-AG-1980-S-VHS-Pro-Line-TBC-VCR-Editor-Works_W0QQitemZ2203...1%7C240%3A1318

[SomeDay]

P.S.
I looked at the B&H Photo and Video website. They have two JVC D-VHS/S-VHS units that are being sold as "refurbished" at what I would call reasonable prices. The have one model (CLICK HERE) for $149.95 US Dollars and another model (CLICK HERE) for $199.99 US Dollars and both look fine to me (I'd go for the cheaper one myself). They are based in the USA but do ship to Canada.

Thanks for the heads up.

I purchased the HM_DH4000U

I actually lost out on the JVC 9800 and many more things on ebay. I real hate ebay, I need some type of snipping software to win on it. I was looking at the AG-1980 until you posted this. That was my next bid. I do feel more secure buying for B&H and even paid for two years more warranty for $22.00 usd.

I have found the first model toshiba with HD on a classified site from another province. I am nowhere near there and would have to rely of the persons word. $150 Canadian. Says it was hardly used. But after reading about Burner and possible HD problems I think I should stick with the pioneer. With the HM_DH4000U and the Pioneer burner I think I am getting close to solving my issues with this task. Thanks to all the help it really steered me in the right direction when I was getting ready to give up.

Again, MAJOR THANKS! Appreciate it

[gshelley61]

The solution you have come up with sounds fine. Have fun!

[victoriabears]

You are very welcome, enjoy . and bidnapper works like a dream, used it dozen of times, good cost too.

[themaster1]

I real hate ebay, I need some type of snipping software to win on it.

Try Gixen it worked for me

[joecass]

So you're going with the JVC Super VHS machine and the Pioneer 560H-K ?
Sounds like a pretty good combinatin to me ! I've always been curious about the JVC Super VHS/D-VHS machines, let us know how well it all works out......

[FulciLives]

I think the JVC HM-DH4000U is a good choice. In fact I may pick up one of these myself here.

Also I think you will be very happy with the Pioneer DVD recorder. I do recommend as gshelley61 suggested to do 1 hour or 60 minutes per disc as that will use the least amount of compression but note that the Pioneer DVD recorders do allow you to select recording times in 5 - 10 minute increaments and it will maximize the bitrate accordingly. So you could probably go as much as 1 1/2 hours or 90 minutes and still get very favorable results. Just about all other DVD recorders available new now-a-days don't have such options with usually nothing more than 1 hour, 2 hour, 4 hour etc. modes.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[SomeDay]

Hi all;

Yes I decided to go with the refurbished JVC D-VHS HM-DH4000U and the Pioneer DVD Recorder DVR-560H-K

I am still waiting for the D-VHS and am pleasantly surprised at how fast its moving across the states and now into Quebec Canada. At this rate, I will probably have it by Tues/Weds next week.

I have already picked up the Pioneer as it was on sale for $299 Canadian, thus the price I quote above with tax and all. One more day and it was going back to $399 + tax. This week they have the sony on sale for $299 which I read is a copy of the pioneer. None the less, when get a copy when I can have the original.

I have hooked up the Pioneer dvd recorder and first impressions are mixed. I like the picture from the tuner. I am still on Analog, so I can use the built in tuner. Its very nice at tuning and seems better at it then the tuner in my JVC CRT TV.

As for the menu system, I think its ok, but I would rage about it. I haven't used another dvd recorder to compare, but with using satellite PVR's and many electronic gagets over the years, I would say I give it a 6.5 out of 10. Remember this is first impressions here. Things I don't seem to like so far is that it doesn't show the title of the program when I record something in the disc navigator. Even tho it will display the title when changing channels on most programs. When I change the view to show 8 titles in the disc navigator it doesn't show the titles again, but does show the date and channel recorder and speed.

I know this is not a pvr, but I keep wishing it had a guide to help setup the timmers, maybe guide plus?

Another problem that I have is that it will not pause live tv. I am sure when I first hooked it up it did and now it will not. I have to record everything if I want to pause and chase play, etc... I do have it hooked up differently now then when I first did it. Originally it was straight coax in and out. I am sure it paused then, I may have to try this setup again just to test. Now I have coax it and component out to tv. I can't see that making a difference, but maybe it is.

It looks sharp, glossy black and everything hidden on the front with a nice big flap. The unit feels well built with the exception of the disc tray seemly a little more flimsy then I had hoped.

The remote. The buttons are small, cluttered and missing one key button for me. I like to go from two channels and back when watching live tv. It doesn't have a previous channel key. It does have a previous button, but its for the menus it doesn't work for the channels.

Recording. Recording to the hard drive is nice and no complaints, works as advertised and the picture is great. I did hook it up to my cheap vcr and tried to recorder from VHS to DVD. I had some success. I manage to get it to recorder, but it wasn't direct to dvd. It went to the Hard drive and then I copied it from there to the Disc and finalized it. Worked it both my DVD players and played nicely. The menus were a bit cheap looky, but I expected that. Overall that went nicely. Now to figure out if I can go direct to dvd which is what I had hoped for.

Display. The display on the front of the unit is nice and big and I love it. The time goes smaller when its off, unsure why they would do that, but the text display is awesome and easy to read from a distance.


What I need to figure out still.

-How to recorder direct to DVD from VHS, skipping the record to Hard drive and copy to disc.

-How to set the genre for grouping my recordings, right now I have a bunch of FREE1, 2, etc... I have read a good chunk of the manual once and didn't find that.

-Learn the video picture settings for my captures. I read here that 1 hour mode /XP is the best for transfering. But if this is the case and I have a VHS that is longer, what happens? Does it stop at the hour mark and I have to piece it together later on my computer or will it keep going to accomodate? If it only captures 1 hour and my tapes are longer, this doesn't seem as set it and forget it as I thought it would be.

That is all I can think of right now, this is initial reaction to using it for the first time. All this may change quickly once I come familiar with the unit. Right now I have to figure out how I can efficiently transfer my tapes to disc without much hassle.

[victoriabears]

No dvd recorder I have ever used made menus easy.

The Pioneer I have has incremental recording, you set the bit rate and you can record 1hr 23 mins if you want at best quality.

[FulciLives]

The Pioneer DVD recorders have set recording times like 1 hour, 2 hours 3 hours etc. but there is also a manual way of setting it to what they call MN times and usually they go in 5 - 10 minute increments so if you know your video is 90 minutes long you can set it to 90 minutes (or to be safe maybe set it to 95 or 100 minutes).

For home video stuff to look best you really want 60 minutes ... maybe 90 minutes at once. By home video stuff I mean stuff you shot yourself with a camcorder. Such material usually needs a very high bitrate to look good so the less time on the disc the better. Most camcorder tapes are 60 minutes anyways so shouldn't really be a problem.

A note about recording times. If you record 1 hour or XP to disc then it will fit only 1 hour but you can record XP to the HDD and it will keep recording until the HDD is filled up. However if you record 2 hours of XP to the HDD then it will not fit on 1 disc unless you:

1.) Split it up into two 1 hour segments then burn on 2 discs

2.) You can burn to 1 disc and it will re-encode to make it fit but it will do so in real time and you don't gain anything by doing this ... in fact you loose quality due to the re-encode. Better to set it to the right speed at the get go so no re-encode is needed.

Remember if you record to the HDD first then record to a disc it will record faster than real time as long as you don't try to change speeds or do any editing outside of key frames. Frame accurate editing will impose a re-encode. The other non-frame accurate editing will only edit on key frames but no re-encode is done when you go to copy to disc. A full disc should copy in about 15 minutes.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[Probe1152]

Pioneer makes the best DVD recorders today. They are no longer sold within the USA but they are sold within Canada.

Very simple.

1.) Record from VHS to Pioneer DVD recorder.
2.) Import to your computer
3.) Use TMPGEnc DVD Author to trim, put chapters, create menu etc.
4.) Burn to a new DVD using the computer

Use a DVD-RW to go from recorder to computer and you can re-use the same disc over and over.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

Panasonic DMR-EZ48V can be found at Best Buys for $304.00 and J&R electronics for $279.00.[/quote]