What's the big deal with VCD or SVCD?

[HgRising]

So, after reading all I can about these formats I've gone and made myself a few vcd's and SVCD's. The AVI's I capture from my Tivo are great by themselves, of course, but I'm starting to come to the conclusion that DVD might be the only way to go because, well, VCD looks like crap and SVCD isn't that far behind unless it's a bright picture with little movement (some music videos looked cool). I've used the highest possible quality, bitrate and motion detection through TMPGEnc and I'm still not impressed. S-video at least "looks" smoother during action sequences. This was also the concensus arrived at by the friends I had take a look at this stuff. I'd like to burn the episodes of Alias and 24 I've got but it's gotta be through a high quality medium. So, might XSVCD be a better option for me or is there still something I can do to get a better picture with SVCD? Or should I just go for DVD? I'd like to hear some opinions. Damn, I wish I could just take stuff straight off my Tivo. Thanks.

~HgRising

[Kdiddy]

My personal opinion is to do SVCD with CCE, also, there is the GIGO rule, garbage in = garbage out, VCD/SVCD/DVD will NOT IMPROVE what you capture, only maintain it as best as possible in that respective order.....so if you capturing process is subpar, so will be your encoding...

[SatStorm]

VCD is like VHS
xSVCD with low resolution (352 X 288) and interlace output, looks like near - SVHS. The SVHS is better on paper, but in true life a good xSVCD looks almost the same.
CVD (352 X 576) is a great format. It is compatible as D2 with DVD and it is compatible with SVCD 'cause it is china's own version of SVCD. With a bitrate about 2.600 looks great on standard TV Set.
SVCD (480 X 576) is the same like CVD. It is the "standard" for the western world, but looks in the same bitrate a bit blockier than CVD.
DVD (D1) is the best resolution you get with today's mainstream technology.

One great problem, are the encoders. Ain't good yet for mpeg 2. Only Cinemacraft is exceptable, but who can buy it? It is far expensive and also very difficult to use....

Anyway:
For VHS source, I vote for xSVCD with Low resolution
For SVHS, DV and DVD backup I vote for CVD/D2 (352 X 576). I can burn the file to a CD and watch today my media on a compatible with SVCD standalone DVD player. In a year, when I shall buy a CHEAP DVD recorder, I shall rip my CVD media on my pc and burn the riped files (as it is) on a DVD R disc, without any re-encoding or anything. So, I shall have full compatible DVD media, in D2 resolution (D2 is a legal resolution for DVD video, but some standalones don't support it). I already done some tests and all worked perfect...

For TOP quality from a DV source (or DVB broadcasts), the top solution is DVD. Higher bitrates, full picture resolution. It is the best picture you can get with today's mainstream technology.

The only problems with DVD are
1. Burners and Discs are expensive
2. You see the difference in resolution only to Hi-end TV's, HDTVs and High end Video projectors. On a standard television (even if the screen is HUGE), you will not see any difference between D1 (720 X 576) and D2 (352 X 576) resolution.
From this point making D1 DVDs, is more for the future, not for today

It is up to you!

[burned_once]

It would be a waste of money to encode DVDs at 720x480 when you're starting with broadcast or cable signals. If we're talking NTSC, stick with 352x240 and focus on the settings you use to encode it. Double-clicking on the filters in TMPGenc's "Advanced" settings panel opens up an incredible array of customizations. Increasing the bitrate as high as your player will accept also helps preserve video quality, but then you need two or more CD's to hold one hour.

I agree with your assessment of VCD quality - looks awful, except for animation which can be vastly improved with TMPGenc (see the how to on this site).

Have you considered opening up your Tivo box? I understand that inside it is basically a PC running Linux with an IDE HDD. Many users have developed Tivo enhancements, from upgrading HDDs to adding ethernet ports for free program guide via internet. The new Replay 2000 from SonicBlue touts sharing video over the internet; surely this would provide some kind of network stream you could intercept with your PC.

You could even switch out the HDD to your PC and access the data directly, given the right software (probably mpeg-4 encoding).

[HgRising]

Kdiddy.

You're telling me about the GIGO rule... My AVI's look pretty good (on computer). I'm using a Pinnacle Studio PCTV Pro (which I finally decided on after I tried WinTV and the DVCII crap card which could be nice if it were not so buggy and had much better software). What do you use that could be better? By the way, Tivo records in D1 at 480*480 lines. But of course my line in to my cap card is S-Video.


SatStorm.

Thanks for the info. Is CVD NTSC compatable? I'm going to have to take a look into CCE (hmmm...). We'll see.


burned_once.

Which of the "incredible array of customizations" would you recommend using and how do you increase the bitrate above the 2520 in TMPGEnc? I've already opened up my Tivo to upgrade recording time to 185 hrs with two 100GB drives but the actual process of ripping straight off the Tivo is incomprehencibly torturous. If you're curious about what that actually entails let me know and I'll direct you to the appropriate site.

Thanks for all your help kids.

~HgRising