This place is dead....

[thecoalman]

Like a ghost town in here.

[doppletwo]

The mods keep deleting threads. I have see at least three disappear in last two days.

But I know what your standard response to my posts is.

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=244978

That was to me, not to you, thecoalman.

[glockjs]

go have a beer evi...errr coal :P

[doppletwo]

go have a beer evi...errr coal :P

What no beer for me?

You think I've had too much to drink?

[shelbyGT]

who's giving out the beer?

[canadateck]

Yeah It has been dead.

@doppletwo
I swear man nobody has made me laugh as much as you..Really....

[sacajaweeda]

It's not dead, they just "fixed it" is all.

[BJ_M]

dead ? everyone was watching the "L-Word" when you posted that ... haahahaha

[makntraks]

It's not dead, they just "fixed it" is all.

Yeah and it appears that, as it is sometimes in life, the cure is worse than the disease...

Peace,
makntraks

[BJ_M]

3 threads do not make a quorum ..

[makntraks]

3 threads do not make a quorum ..

3 or 300 - Can yiou honestly say things haven't changed here???

makntraks

[Cobra]

I doubt the forum is "cured" - more like being in the "treatment" phase of things. Like chemotherapy, it is hugely unpleasant but will make life better once it is done.

OT should be a pleasant place to be, and shouldn't spawn users who misbehave in other forums and cause trouble for other members. We don't mind the subject matter (within good taste, obviously) but it is the problems caused by those who abuse VideoHelp that we are trying to stamp out.

That is just my personal view on the matter, and does not represent the views of the Mod team as a whole.

[makntraks]

I doubt the forum is "cured" - more like being in the "treatment" phase of things. Like chemotherapy, it is hugely unpleasant but will make life better once it is done.

OT should be a pleasant place to be, and shouldn't spawn users who misbehave in other forums and cause trouble for other members. We don't mind the subject matter (within good taste, obviously) but it is the problems caused by those who abuse VideoHelp that we are trying to stamp out.

That is just my personal view on the matter, and does not represent the views of the Mod team as a whole.

Well I truly agree with your comments Cobra, but I fear that this "cleansing" should have been come about a long time ago or not at all.
I understand that there were some "rules" that were blatantly abused, but once the mods jumped in - it seemed as though every little infraction was duly noted/carded/warned... I myself have kept under the radar for fear of reprisal..

One of the many reasons I continue to hang here is that not only does this place have great content, but the forums, namely OT, and the people that made it and continue to make it up. When I got here it was still a heyday with Will, jeex being the ones I followed most... then it was Cap, Fulci, Indo, Sac and so many others. Once the initial "cleansing" started (probably back in Aug(?) with the PW competion) things started to be throttled back, for me at least, at an alarming rate...
Once people have come to know something it is hard to start taking back...

Duty calls.... Peace,
makntraks

Just my $0.02,
makntraks

[Shadowmistress]

This is what some of you wanted isn't it? An end to drama, practical jokes, big fish getting too much attention, people being human instead of robots who strictly follow rules? You cried out in consensus that you would not tolerate these things and the rules were changed to accomodate what you were asking for. That is why things are this way today.

How could you not see it coming?


Sucks when the shoe is on the other foot, doesn't it?

[makntraks]

This is what some of you wanted isn't it?

No, not really....

An end to drama, practical jokes, big fish getting too much attention, people being human instead of robots who strictly follow rules? You cried out in consensus that you would not tolerate these things and the rules were changed to accomodate what you were asking for. That is why things are this way today.

How could you not see it coming?

Who cried? Certainly not me..... The only reason I "saw" anything was the fact that I saw a lack of anything remotely interesting here... Topics that sucked, users that blatantly violated rules, games being played and a bunch of wanna be post whores trying to compete with people here who have ACTUAL post whore skills... and what I mean by that is that even though they post whore'd it was done with flair, panache and generally made a point and much more so with the humor that only a certain few here have...

On the other hand others here have tried to post whore and failed - miserably.... and by failing caused the hammer to come down, people to leave, etc, etc...

And on a final note, once the whole "female" OT member thing started, well that is when I basically changed the channel...

I did not ask for any change, nor did I read or see anything by others that I know here. I feel it was all choreographed by a certain few with mods who chose to take the path of least resistance......

makntraks

[Cobra]

We did not choose the path of least resistance, trust me. We've taken a lot more flack than we should have had to put up with.

[northcat_8]

Everything changes. The whole site is a far different place today than it was in the days of Jeex and some others.

Although, I didn't really see how things were so out of hand, but then again, I don't leave the OT much anymore...well...until recently that is.

[makntraks]

We did not choose the path of least resistance, trust me. We've taken a lot more flack than we should have had to put up with.

Isn't that what the "BAN" button is for?? 8)
The flack you say you put up with or other mods put up with... that is your doing not mine, by not "nipping it in the bud" If you decide to flag someone then do it. If you chose to ban than do so. I just feel as though EVERYONE is getting penalized, not just the few that have stirred the pot.

Example - Once I saw the whole IBTL thing, that is when I finally said **** it.... and I believe I was the one who started the IBTL and stuff....

Everything changes. The whole site is a far different place today than it was in the days of Jeex and some others.

Although, I didn't really see how things were so out of hand, but then again, I don't leave the OT much anymore...well...until recently that is.

"The more things change, the more they stay the same"... at least not here...

Peace,
makntraks

p.s. I hope in this case that using "IBTL" and the image don't get me carded or banned as they are being used to convey a message, not to PW

[Shadowmistress]

Who cried? Certainly not me.....

There was a cry, just as there is today to a lesser extent for more interesting threads, more activity and for better quality in posts. Some took pity and tried to deliver that to their friends, but somehow that intent was misinterpreted and they were made targets for hostility. Used as scapegoats to blame the uneasiness many felt due to past changes that were already inevitable. Many members never heard these cries, yet to a select few it was a roar.

When did we as a group forget compassion? When did we decide to withold forgiveness? Aren't we all just human? Why the need for such witchunts?

I feel it was all choreographed by a certain few with mods who chose to take the path of least resistance......

Not choreographed. That's too strong a concept to describe what was going on. Some merely stepped to the plate who had something to offer to amuse and entertain. Nothing was ever meant to be anything more than the usual ribbing and joking that goes on everyday, and moreso in the days of Jeex and Indo. It still astonishes me how so many misunderstood that.

Isn't that what the "BAN" button is for??

Why on earth would anyone ban someone for having a difference in taste? That would be unfair and cold hearted to do to friends. Granted the entertainment was not up to par for some people's standards, but it was the best that was out there and I didn't see anyone else offering a new show. It's impossible to please everyone and it was never meant to be as big a spectacle as it turned out to be. Recognize all the participants here. Somehow, people thought those originating the show were somehow responsible for the mass's amusement and the witchunt commenced when they were disappointed.

"The more things change, the more they stay the same"... at least not here...

Doesn't that imply that we should learn from our mistakes? Isn't forgiveness and compassion an integral part of that?

[zzyzzx]

We don't mind the subject matter (within good taste, obviously)

Ummm.. if good taste were a requirement I would have been gone a long time ago...

[doppletwo]

This thread is not vanilla.

This thread will be gone soon.

[makntraks]

I feel it was all choreographed by a certain few with mods who chose to take the path of least resistance......

Not choreographed. That's too strong a concept to describe what was going on. Some merely stepped to the plate who had something to offer to amuse and entertain. Nothing was ever meant to be anything more than the usual ribbing and joking that goes on everyday, and moreso in the days of Jeex and Indo. It still astonishes me how so many misunderstood that.

Well from the cards being handed out and people being banned I can only assume (I hate that word) that the mods were the ones misinterpreting the topics/replies... Certainly not me or any other user here who does not have that capacity...

Either way, I believe the OT's time has come AND gone but I will look forward to a new improved version... hopefully in the near future

makntraks

p.s. SM, with all due respect I appreciate your comments but I find it hard to concieve how you can make such statements when a majority of your posts, etc have been confined to a handful of threads...
ex: Hunkiest Man or whatever it was, plus a few other fluff topics...

[northcat_8]

Well you see makntracks, that is the problem. People are people, and rules are rules. The issues really came about because the powers that be tried to be nice guys, they let some things slide, or whatever and before you know it, it gets out of hand and chaos is all you have left.

I teach high school kids for a living. If rules are not applied directly and unbiasedly you are in for a long school year. Everyone pushes the bounds of limitation, that's just human nature but the bounds were allowed to expand occasionally because of human nature, and at some point things get so expanded that no rules are followed anymore.

The process of reinstituting the rules is never popular. The first stage of it is silence, which we are experiencing now. Just waiting on someone to step up and try the limits once again to see if the rules are being strictly enforced or if it is actually just a verbal warning to shape up. If the rules are let slide when the limits are again tested, the forum will slide right back to where it was a few days ago. If the rules are applied equally to all offenders, then slowly but surely the OT will regain the post counts per day and will return to a hangout spot but a hangout spot at work...not the local bar.

It's a mistake that I have made before and it sucks to have to lay down the law and be a dick about what was once considered little things. But sometimes it just has to be done. Now 10 years into a teaching career, I start the year off as a prick and hammer every kid for every infraction, without exception and then when spring comes, my students are not stressing me out everyday with their behavior, while other teachers are on suicide watch.

With all that being said, discipline and the application of it has to come from your own personality. I have no problem being strict because I am a disciplinarian. My kids, my students and my players all feel the ramifications of breaking a clearly stated rule. Consiquences are handed out equally across the board and there are no exceptions. The guy I coach with is not that way and his rules are somewhat fluxuary and everything "just depends". One of my rules is "don't miss practice" if you do, you do not start on Friday night. A few years ago a kid missed practice because his grandpa died and he left school to be with his family. Which was the right thing to do. But I didn't start him on friday because he missed practice. I know that seems a bit extreme and really it was, but since that game, not a single one of my kids have missed a practice, hell they aren't even late. I did take quite a bit of hell over my decision and some people dislike me to this day because of it. Probably didn't help that the kid was my cousin's son...but rules are rules, I made them, I enforce them and if you break them, you suffer the consiquences period. That's really the only way to have consistent discipline.

OK, well that's my novel for today. 3 day weekend this weekend (President's Day ) So until tuesday then

[doppletwo]

Discourse not allowed please assimilate.

[Shadowmistress]

Well from the cards being handed out and people being banned I can only assume (I hate that word) that the mods were the ones misinterpreting the topics/replies... Certainly not me or any other user here who does not have that capacity...

Yes, assumption is the real evil here. There has been too much of it on both sides from my humble observations. When people don't know confidential details they assume there's a conspiracy going on. That's not the case. There was never anything remotely like a conspiracy. In reality, everyone acts like an ass from time to time and deserves to get banned.

Either way, I believe the OT's time has come AND gone but I will look forward to a new improved version... hopefully in the near future

The OT's glory and relevance, from former days gone by to several steps in the future, is directly proportional to the tolerance of it's members. We are all each responsible for our part in a society. An abuse or abdication of this responsibility by some means that the rules must be tightend to account for the actions of all. It is not a sin to be your brother's keeper.

Whether OT survives or perishes depends on us all.

P.S. Makntraks, I never really left. I've seen things I was not happy with, but it is not in my nature to cause trouble for many just to satisfy myself. Don't do the usual evil of assuming what my knowledge is based on unknown facts.

[doppletwo]

I am bitching about nothing.

Even though I do come off as a weirdo or an ignoramous, inactuality I have not been a target of the rules change.

My yellow card is almost a month old and will be removed soon.

I just added to my avatar recently for flair, there is a new OT rule that all OTPW's must have at least 15 pieces of flair.

I thought I might be one of the 3 or 4, but I haven't been even given an informal warning.

The only two that I can see that have been targeted are Sacajaweeda and MackemX.

What happened to Viral1 he hasn't posted in a while, maybe he was scared off.

[Shocker Milwaukee]

[doppletwo]

I just checked. Viral1 hasn't posted for two days unless he posted in some of the closed forums during that period.

Which might be the case since it says he was here last night.

Come back Viral1.

[Shadowmistress]

@ Shocker Milwaukee: Not conformity, responsibility. Otherwise there would be chaos. It's a sad part of growing up.

[makntraks]

To all I appreciate the comments and know that I can relate to the things that you have replied with (Nortie and SM). I guess the troublwe I am having is that I am an OCD'r from way back and change is one thing that I have a hard time with....

Yet again I'm sure the OT will more than likely be reborn and with any luck some of the old guard will remain to mentor and entertain......

Peace,
makntraks