Strange yellow-ish tint in Happauge captures

[techmot]

Hi, I've had my Happauge Win2 capture device for a few months now but only noticed that it produces a strange yellow-ish colour. I hadn't really noticed this because I just put it down to the bad tapes I was playing and/or tracking, but I tried a tape yesterday which was perfectly fine, no tracking needed (out of of a 100 or so tapes it's probably the best tape) but it the yellow-ish look at the (mostly upper half) of the image is more noticeable. I know this isn't down to the composite/scart cables I am using nor the tape because it appears on every other tape and I have been using the same cables when I was capturing on a cheap Easycap device but it never had this yellow-ish wavy tint look to it.

I have tried both AmarecTV and OBS using the Happauge and it still produces this yellow look.

Screenshots below:


[Attachment 75038 - Click to enlarge]

The above is from the Happauge Win2. I captured this with OBS, but it still looks the same using AmarecTV

Below was captured about a year ago using Corel Video capture with my old cheap Climax Digital capture device. Although the image is much softer the the strange yellowy tint isn't there.


[Attachment 75039 - Click to enlarge]

I'm getting the feeling this is a fault with the Happauge device, I could be wrong. Anyone else had the same effect?

[lollo]

You probably played with the drivers, setting SECAM and then back to PAL or whatever. Disinstall the drivers and re-install from scratch.

[Sharc]

^^^^ This.
And your capture is full of dotcrawl and rainbow artifacts. Did you capture via Composite? You should capture via S-Video if possible (or use a DVD recorder in passthrough).
The Hauppauge (at least the USB-live2) has poor (almost useless) luma/chroma separating filters. Maybe it's the same for the 'Win2' (what exactly is it?)

[techmot]

You probably played with the drivers, setting SECAM and then back to PAL or whatever. Disinstall the drivers and re-install from scratch.

I never played with the drivers, I just installed them.

[techmot]

^^^^ This.
And your capture is full of dotcrawl and rainbow artifacts. Did you capture via Composite? You should capture via S-Video if possible (or use a DVD recorder in passthrough).

Yes I captured via composite. I don't have S-video output on my VHS recorder only scart, I use a scart to composite cable to connect to the capture device. If this is an issue with Happauge than I never had this yellow tint on my cheap Easycap device. I've tried passthrough before using my Panasonic VHS/DVD recorder combo and i couldn't get it to passthrough.

[DB83]

Senior moment alert.

Pray tell me what a Hauppauge Win2 is ?


Link to item ?

[techmot]

Senior moment alert.

Pray tell me what a Hauppauge Win2 is ?


Link to item ?

I meant the Hauppauge USB Win-Live 2

[techmot]

^^^^ This.
And your capture is full of dotcrawl and rainbow artifacts. Did you capture via Composite? You should capture via S-Video if possible (or use a DVD recorder in passthrough).
The Hauppauge (at least the USB-live2) has poor (almost useless) luma/chroma separating filters. Maybe it's the same for the 'Win2' (what exactly is it?)

I meant Hauppauge USB Win-Live 2. Why should composite have alot of dot crawl and rainbow artifacts compared to using S-video?. What would be the point in using a composite connection it produces alot of artifacts?.

[Sharc]

^^^^ This.
And your capture is full of dotcrawl and rainbow artifacts. Did you capture via Composite? You should capture via S-Video if possible (or use a DVD recorder in passthrough).

Yes I captured via composite. I don't have S-video output on my VHS recorder only scart, I use a scart to composite cable to connect to the capture device. If this is an issue with Happauge than I never had this yellow tint on my cheap Easycap device. I've tried passthrough before using my Panasonic VHS/DVD recorder combo and i couldn't get it to passthrough.

A poorly screened 'SCART to Composite' cable will also produce such artifacts. The Easycap's low resolution (bandwidth) may just have masked it at the cost of sharpness and details.
Also reducing the contrast and saturation may help somewhat.
Re. DVD combo in passthrough not working: Probably a matter of configuration/settings.

[Sharc]

I meant Hauppauge USB Win-Live 2. Why should composite have alot of dot crawl and rainbow artifacts compared to using S-video?. What would be the point in using a composite connection it produces alot of artifacts?.

Because Composite shares the same wire for luma and chroma. The poor separating filter of the USB-live2 propduces cross-luma (dots) and cross-chroma (rainbows) artefacts. For S-Video luma and chroma is separated using 2 wires.
Just google for it and search the forum.

[DB83]

Ok.

A still image often does not tell the whole story. Can you upload a sample video. No re-encoding pls.


And, FTR, I use a usb-live2 (probably a much earlier model than what you have) and have no such issues. And since the video cable is detachable do make sure you have a firm fit in to the unit.

And my scart/composite adapter is old-school complete with cables. Not one of these cheapo metalic ones.

[techmot]

^^^^ This.
And your capture is full of dotcrawl and rainbow artifacts. Did you capture via Composite? You should capture via S-Video if possible (or use a DVD recorder in passthrough).

Yes I captured via composite. I don't have S-video output on my VHS recorder only scart, I use a scart to composite cable to connect to the capture device. If this is an issue with Happauge than I never had this yellow tint on my cheap Easycap device. I've tried passthrough before using my Panasonic VHS/DVD recorder combo and i couldn't get it to passthrough.

A poorly screened 'SCART to Composite' cable will also produce such artifacts. The Easycap's low resolution (bandwidth) may just have masked it at the cost of sharpness and details.
Also reducing the contrast and saturation may help somewhat.
Re. DVD combo in passthrough not working: Probably a matter of configuration/settings.

I checked Amarec again in the settings and for some reason it was set to PAL I and not PAL B. But changing the PAL B made no difference. The artifacts aren't really a problem as the tapes aren't the best anyway.

Maybe it masked it, but I think it still would've been noticeable on the Easycap. I noticed the yellow tint doesn't appear to be has noticeable when I encode a file. I don't think it's the tapes though. Could be the drivers being set to SECAM instead of PAL, but like I said I never messed with the drivers when I installed them (maybe I downloaded the wrong drivers?).

I probably got confused as to how to set up a passthrough. I wish I could just use the combo but it is faulty. I could post a video of it so someone may know how I could fix it, other than that or take it to get repaired which will likely cost me an arm and a leg.

[lollo]

about the "yellow" tone, remove the drivers and re-install

there is only one Hauppauge USB-Live 2 hardware.

Hauppauge USB-Live 2 is poor using composite input and without a TBC. Add a specific DVD-R recorder in pass-through mode if your VCR has no TBC nor Y/C output.

[techmot]

about the "yellow" tone, remove the drivers and re-install

there is only one Hauppauge USB-Live 2 hardware.

Hauppauge USB-Live 2 is poor using composite input and without a TBC. Add a specific DVD-R recorder in pass-through mode if your VCR has no TBC nor Y/C output.

But how do you passthru, what's the set up?. So do I connect the scart-comp cables from the working VCR to the composite inputs on rear of the DVD/VHS combo, and then using separate audio composite cables and an S-video cable from the rear the combo to the Hauppauge device?.

I read on the AVS forum that the Panasonic ES10 is the only recorder that is agreed by most video people that has a noticeable effect as a passthru. I doubt my Panasonic DMR-EZ47V will make much difference.

[lollo]

But how do you passthru, what's the set up?. So do I connect the scart-comp cables from the working VCR to the composite inputs on rear of the DVD/VHS combo, and then using separate audio composite cables and an S-video cable from the rear the combo to the Hauppauge device?.

I read on the AVS forum that the Panasonic ES10 is the only recorder that is agreed by most video people that has a noticeable effect as a passthru. I doubt my Panasonic DMR-EZ47V will make much difference.

https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/403635-Panasonic-DVD-recorder-passthrough-settings...15-DMR-ES25%29

[techmot]

But how do you passthru, what's the set up?. So do I connect the scart-comp cables from the working VCR to the composite inputs on rear of the DVD/VHS combo, and then using separate audio composite cables and an S-video cable from the rear the combo to the Hauppauge device?.

I read on the AVS forum that the Panasonic ES10 is the only recorder that is agreed by most video people that has a noticeable effect as a passthru. I doubt my Panasonic DMR-EZ47V will make much difference.

https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/403635-Panasonic-DVD-recorder-passthrough-settings...15-DMR-ES25%29

Thanks but it doesn't tell me which way I connect them to my capture device just talks about comb filters.

[Sharc]

Basically: S-Video out of the Panny to S-Video in of your Hauppauge

[DB83]

1. Your vcr/dvd combi may be different to mine. But with mine input connections are at the front and output connections are at the back.

2. My own vcr/dvd combi only outputs s-video via dvd. NOT vcr.


3. I assume that you actually have a vcr as a separate unit to the combi. You can hardly expect to pass-through with only one irrespective of the comments at 1. and 2.

[lollo]

Thanks but it doesn't tell me which way I connect them to my capture device just talks about comb filters.

As Sharc alreay said, if you have a composite out of the VCR and you want a Y/C input to the card through the Panasonic, there is only one path: VCR composite out --> Panasonic composite in --> Panasonic S-Video out --> USB-Live 2 S-Video in.
What else could you think is possible?

Then you have several options for the connections, SCART vs Mini-DIN and input port 1, 2 or 3 or whatever and output port 1, 2 , 3 or whatever, but that's another story, and it has been addressed in the thread I linked.

In any case check if your Panasonic is one of the recommended device for TBC correction.

[TimA-C]

3 questions:

Have you always had this yellow cast since you got the Live2?

Have you disconnected and re-connected the connectors on the Live2 as DB83 suggested? (I had to replace the connectors a couple of years ago because I had an increasingly poor connection, and then lost of the audio channels completely. They'd redesigned the plug that plugs into the Live2 slightly, and the individual sockets had slightly thicker wires than on my original connector.)

Do you still get the yellow cast in the Hauppauge Capture software? (The newer versions give access to the Procamp settings, so you could maybe try adjusting Hue and Saturation easily. I think I'm right in thinking that for some reason they haven't included the 'Sharpness' setting . . . ? You can use GraphStudio to get at the Procamp settings, but it's simpler in Hauppauge Capture to get at the relevant options.)

[oln]

I read on the AVS forum that the Panasonic ES10 is the only recorder that is agreed by most video people that has a noticeable effect as a passthru. I doubt my Panasonic DMR-EZ47V will make much difference.

No, that's not true as shown by a number of people here. For European market ones nearly all models post 2005 do a decent job (for that matter the earlier ones also work to some extent as far as I know)* So, your EZ47V very likely will too and would suggest giving it a try as described by others in this thread. These Hauppage cards and other cards based around the same chipset handle video direct from vcrs pretty badly so suspect that's most likely the problem here and not anything wrong with drivers or the card itself otherwise, and passing the video via the EZ47V should help both with the color issue, and make the image more stable.

* It's a different story with the US market Panasonic DVD-recorders from 2007 and on as Panasonic started using a different chipset on those with a very basic video decoder that lack the fancy video stabilizing functionality but I presume it's an European one we're talking about here since your profile says UK.

[DB83]

Given what has already be written, the only time I have seen skin tones not as they are expected to be seen was when I out-sourced a Secam transfer from, assumedly VHS to DVD and compared that to two examples of NTSC and PAL dvds for a rather rare film (the French version having content not seen elsewhere)

It's been some time since I installed or even upgraded my drivers for the usb2. Even so, I suggest the OP, as suggested, uninstalls the drivers he has and re-installs them but actually reads the screens and not click on 'OK' (or whatever) regardless.


And is it that hard to provide a sample video as requested ?

[techmot]

3 questions:

Have you always had this yellow cast since you got the Live2?

Have you disconnected and re-connected the connectors on the Live2 as DB83 suggested? (I had to replace the connectors a couple of years ago because I had an increasingly poor connection, and then lost of the audio channels completely. They'd redesigned the plug that plugs into the Live2 slightly, and the individual sockets had slightly thicker wires than on my original connector.)

Do you still get the yellow cast in the Hauppauge Capture software? (The newer versions give access to the Procamp settings, so you could maybe try adjusting Hue and Saturation easily. I think I'm right in thinking that for some reason they haven't included the 'Sharpness' setting . . . ? You can use GraphStudio to get at the Procamp settings, but it's simpler in Hauppauge Capture to get at the relevant options.)

Yes I think I have only had the yellow cast since I got the Live-2, but for some reason I never noticed it that much until a few days ago when I was trying one of my better tapes (most of the tapes suffer badly from scratches and jumps with the very odd exeption). Considering the tape I tried at the time had no jumping I knew it wasn't due to bad tracking. I never noticed this on my older cheap Easycap device (now thrown away).

I have disconnected the cables and reconnected them but still looks the same. As others have said it's probably the drivers. I'm away from the VCR at the moment for a few days so will have to try the drivers when I get back. Could be a fault with the device and it may've been damaged, I was surprised it's such a small and delicate looking device. I'll get round to hooking it up to my Panasonic and my current working VCR to see if I can do a passthru to help improve the video, would benefit I think from the Panasonic with alot of the tapes I have as those Panasonic combo's seem to do a good job at tracking; it would still be working if I hadnt tried to load a tape wth the back flap missing as it seems to have jammed one of the tape loader wheels, it just keeps moving up and down thinking there's a tape inside, probably just an easy fix but haven't had time to look at it.

[lollo]

Once more: remove all the drivers and Hauppauge software and reinstall everything from scratch. When installing the drivers on its own or through "WinTV" or "Hauppauge Capture" software, choose PAL.

Capture first with "Hauppauge Capture" software, you should have no "yellow" tint. Then move to AmarecTV.

[techmot]

Given what has already be written, the only time I have seen skin tones not as they are expected to be seen was when I out-sourced a Secam transfer from, assumedly VHS to DVD and compared that to two examples of NTSC and PAL dvds for a rather rare film (the French version having content not seen elsewhere)

It's been some time since I installed or even upgraded my drivers for the usb2. Even so, I suggest the OP, as suggested, uninstalls the drivers he has and re-installs them but actually reads the screens and not click on 'OK' (or whatever) regardless.


And is it that hard to provide a sample video as requested ?

Yes I will try and re-install the drivers, at the moment I'm away from the VCR for a few days so will do that when I get back.

Here's a sample though this was captured in OBS and not raw in AmarecTV.

https://forum.videohelp.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=75077&stc=1&d=1701009094

[DB83]

That has to be one of the worst, if not the worst, captures I have EVER seen on these pages.

But then it is, possibly, the proof that one should NEVER use OBS as capture software (assuming you knew what you are doing and now I even doubt that).

[lollo]

Something really weird in that capture: strange movements across fields architecture, corrupted fields/frames, all sort of color contamination and scratches in the fields, ...
I ignore the conditions of that tape (possibly is bad), but better to restart from the beginning with a proper workflow (hardware and software) and a 4:2:2 YUV lossless interlaced capture

[techmot]

That has to be one of the worst, if not the worst, captures I have EVER seen on these pages.

But then it is, possibly, the proof that one should NEVER use OBS as capture software (assuming you knew what you are doing and now I even doubt that).

Well comparing it to a raw capture in Amarec or Virtualdub there's hardly difference apart from compression, IMO. The defects are likely down to the tape itself, and that tape was one of the better tapes in my collection of about 100 plus tapes. I've no idea why so many of them have suffered so badly, could be down to many reasons like dust or continuous playback. I've got Beta tapes nearing 40 years old that are in better condition than most of my VHS tapes. Didn't help when the VCRs they were played on had bad or clogged up heads.

I have to agree OBS isn't great, why so many "experts" on youtube seem to think it's a good program for analogue capture I don't know as the compression even when set at a set bitrate is quite poor.

[techmot]

Something really weird in that capture: strange movements across fields architecture, corrupted fields/frames, all sort of color contamination and scratches in the fields, ...
I ignore the conditions of that tape (possibly is bad), but better to restart from the beginning with a proper workflow (hardware and software) and a 4:2:2 YUV lossless interlaced capture

The scratches in the fields will be from the tape, and that tape has rarely been played hence why it's one of the better tapes I have, and no jumping. I don't think there is any tape I have that doesn't have a few sratches, even retail films I bought which I have played only once or twice and kept in their cases have them. I see alot of uploads of recordings on various youtube channels of old programmes and it's amazing how they are in fantastic condition. Likely the reason is that once they wee recorded never got played again and were stored away. My tapes got played to buggery which is the whole point of a video tape not played once and then stored for years.

[techmot]

Thanks but it doesn't tell me which way I connect them to my capture device just talks about comb filters.

As Sharc alreay said, if you have a composite out of the VCR and you want a Y/C input to the card through the Panasonic, there is only one path: VCR composite out --> Panasonic composite in --> Panasonic S-Video out --> USB-Live 2 S-Video in.
What else could you think is possible?

Then you have several options for the connections, SCART vs Mini-DIN and input port 1, 2 or 3 or whatever and output port 1, 2 , 3 or whatever, but that's another story, and it has been addressed in the thread I linked.

In any case check if your Panasonic is one of the recommended device for TBC correction.

Ok will try that. Thanks