Why do people pirate movies?

[twilightzone]

This quote comes from the Digitalbits.com

Finally this morning, I've saved the best (or worst) for last. The NY Times has a new story up on how the Hollywood studios are rushing to cash in on the DVD boom. Here's your happy, happy, joy, joy from the article... Miramax is reportedly preparing to release a half-dozen different DVD editions of Kill Bill:

"This is the beauty of having two volumes," said Rick Sands, chief operating officer at Miramax. "Vol. 1 goes out, Vol. 2 goes out, then Vol. 1 Special Edition, Vol. 2 Special Edition, the two-pack, then the Tarantino collection as a boxed set out for Christmas. It's called multiple bites at the apple. And you multiply this internationally." Mr. Tarantino has also cut an alternate version of the movie for Japan.

I'm gonna ask the obvious right now: Can you believe the BALLS required to make a statement like that in public? To a reporter? For a story that people are going to READ?! Do you suppose Miramax planned to let fans of the film know about all this, so they could... oh, I don't know... maybe make informed decisions about which version they want to spend their hard-earned cash on? I can understand the need to put out multiple DVD versions of a film on occasion, but DAMN! A half-dozen different DVD editions, and Tarantino wants to release stand-alone Beneath the Crust-style discs of supplemental materials as well?! F#@K THAT.

Multiple bites at the apple, huh?

BITE THIS!

And to think the entertainment industry has the nerve to wonder why some people download this stuff. Greedy bastards. Doh!

[teph-lon]

Not to mention also that Kill Bill was suppose to be one long movie...

This marketing scheme reminds me of my comic book days when they had multi-fold-out-foil-stamped-join-covers-together dealies to get more sales. I only bought the newstand edition....

[redwudz]

The 'pirates' in this case appear to be the movie companies themselves. DVD profits probably aren't as high as ticket sales, but there are still millions to be made there, especially with directors cuts, special editions, boxed sets, and probably HDTV versions in the future.

[housepig]

there's a solution to this problem.

don't buy more than one edition.

if they sell a million copies of the initial release of Kill Bill vol 1., and then 15,000 of the second release of Vol. 1, there will probably not be a third release.

[gitreel]

to borrow an old quote.....because they can

[hech54]

MY question is:
If several movie studios are combating the almost 75% pirated movies in Russia by moving production TO Russia to keep the prices down..thus eliminating the cheaper prices by the "pirates"....what is happening in America and other countries?
The studios are taking the correct stance on so called piracy in Russia but attack piracy in STUPID ways in America...like blaming EVERY monetary loss they encounter on piracy...then NOT decrease the prices charged for DVD's....even going as far as making even MORE "too high" priced DVD's available to loose money on.....

I don't get it.

[gitreel]

They have been singing the same tune since the 80's when they tried to ban the vcr.

[indolikaa]

People pirate movies for the same reason they get fall-down drunk and urinate on public buildings at 2 AM in the morning.

Because they can.

[The village idiot]

People pirate movies for the same reason they get fall-down drunk and urinate on public buildings at 2 AM in the morning.

Because they can.

Not because they can, but because all that beer has to go someplace. Man you just have to go sometimes

AND that would be #2400, spent talking about pissing!

[JMO]

The way the Studios are dealing with piracy in Russia is by dropping the price of legitimate DVDs to the equivalent of $10 US. Unfortunately, to the average Muscovite that is the equivalent of dropping the US street price to $200 from its initial value.

Price isn't the issue. It's availability. The pirates fill a gap in the market of Hollywood's making because of its precious marketing model. If they'd open up a global market of day and date with the cinema release, their profits would go through the roof and proper organised piracy would crash and burn. But they're too scared to a) take the risk or b) upset the owner of the Flea Pit Cinema, Crotchscratch, Arizona.

[Moloko_Plus]

I dont think the authors posting has anything to do with piracy, bad marketting ideas maybe, but not piracy. People pirate movies even before they come out on dvd, sometimes even before they come out in theaters. Piracy and bootlegging is something that has been around since the 1800's and before, since radio/tv/vinyl records/filmreels/literature/paintings/alcohol/stamps/vcrs...the list goes on and on. Long before movie executives have come up with great ideas such as these. Personally I think the Most pirated movie of all time has to be Deep Throat. (think about that one for a minute..) A few people said it already: They do it because they can. They want to make Money and dont care how its done and whos rights it infringes upon.
The VCR point brought up was really good, and I feel this will turn out the same as that did. They gave up after they knew it was a losing battle.

When i buy one version of any movie, I feel logically owed any future version that may come out. They've already made their money from me, whats the harm in upgrading me for nothing?
Morally it makes sense to do something like this. Say i bought the 1st edition of kill bill 1 thats on sale now..then 6 months later a "special edition" comes out with like, one or two deleted scenes, maybe a few interviews and some trailers..Whats the harm in me getting that stuff for free? People buying it when it comes out are spending the same amount of money I did yet they're getting more. Doesnt exactly pay to give them money up front does it? Its like they want to Punish us into giving them MORE when they've already gotten their 20.00 from me. Its ridiculous.
Someone said the best thing to do is not buy more then one edition. Thats the best advice ever, and when they told the news that this is all a marketting scam to make as much as possible, that was just their mistake.

If they expect us to buy the future versions..why are they even advertising the current one? Why was it even made? Why not just release it like it should be once and get it Right. It'll make consumers happier, save the earths resources (all that paper and plastic has to come from somewhere), Miramax will have gambled nothing because its all being done in one bang, the list goes on...
I think a not-so-bad idea would be to package kill bill 1 and 2 together at the Same time vol 2 comes out on dvd...Itll save the customers a few bucks when they didnt buy part 1 before, yet making everyone happy and saving resources, paying their marketting department an Honest Dollar. As opposed to scams like these, trying to rip off whoever necessary to make the most money. Going this route, nitwit marketting departments from the likes of miramax have a gamble on their hands, if they do it once then everyone goes home happy.

[teegee420]

The studios are taking the correct stance on so called piracy in Russia but attack piracy in STUPID ways in America...like blaming EVERY monetary loss they encounter on piracy...then NOT decrease the prices charged for DVD's....even going as far as making even MORE "too high" priced DVD's available to loose money on......

Well how the hell else are they going to have a scapegoat? Get with it, man.

[Moloko_Plus]

The studios are taking the correct stance on so called piracy in Russia but attack piracy in STUPID ways in America...like blaming EVERY monetary loss they encounter on piracy...then NOT decrease the prices charged for DVD's....even going as far as making even MORE "too high" priced DVD's available to loose money on......

Well how the hell else are they going to have a scapegoat? Get with it, man.

You're right of course, its all we've been hearing about these past..oh i dont know..few years id say. Its only been getting worse though by the month. I still notice that the majority of software companies dont complain about it, they KNOW their prices are high, they KNOW people will try to get a free ride, and they will not lower prices. Its movie and music studios..The corporations are the MAIN takers of the profits. Disney, the big 5 record labels..Thats why you hear so much about it from these companies, because the fat cats feel they are not making as much as they should be, or did 5 years ago. Its not going to get better. If we look at how history has repeated itself time after time over the past 100 years, it Doesnt Get Better. Technology advances, it becomes easier. Right now..Anyone, ANYONE with a 25.00 cd burner can make a million dollars a year from selling top name brand expensive software cdrs. I know, ive almost been there. Its not right, of course, but its possible now. Anyone with a dvd burner has more capabilities, but the limits are less due to the size of dvdrs.
Again, the reason why we dont hear so much from the big software companies (and the likes of the BSA) is because they know whoever has that kind of money will pay it and not give a hoot, and who doesnt will settle for a pirated copy. The ones losing are ******** like the RIAA and MPAA. I hear about it from the BSA, i even got DMCA'd from the IDSA several months back for posting a video game onto a newsgroup.

[Nilfennasion]

But they're too scared to a) take the risk or b) upset the owner of the Flea Pit Cinema, Crotchscratch, Arizona.

Wrong. The reason film release schedules have been staggered ever since worldwide releasing became a business model (and this is more recent than you might think), is because of the cost of distribution. Using Gladiator as an example, each print cost US$2,500. 3,355 prints were required to cover every theatre in the US and UK upon opening. Which equals US$8,387,500 just for prints. This is to say nothing of the cost of putting the prints on boats, planes, trucks, or whatever you want to use, to get the film into theatres on time.

The bottleneck in release times, as you can see, has never been mere whim or fear. It is a real measurable cost. In markets like Russia or South-East Asia, it is one that the release in markets like the USA, the UK, or Australia have to subsidise. The solution to this is to hold off the release in places like Russia, South-East Asia, or even Australia, until a significant number of those 3,355 prints will no longer be in use. Sometimes that can take a week or two (especially if the film is shown on multiple screens in each theatre), sometimes it can take months.

The solution to this, of course, is going digital, but the theatres are being a pain in this sense because they are afraid of the initial outlay. Of course, the fact that digital cinema has yet to mature into giving us the same resolution as 35mm film is also a significant problem.

On the other subject, the reason studios blame pirates for their financial losses is simple. They have fallen into a situation where they throw bags of money at their staff's creative problems, and then have the nerve to be surprised when their films reach a budget that ticket sales cannot recover. That's just one reason. Recent history has shown that there are films made on relatively small budgets, Ringu or El Mariachi for example, that can become relative successes. The vast majority of films in Hollywood are now just tax write-offs for the studios.

Quite simply, if I ran a business the way the MPAA and RIAA run theirs, I'd be out of business, and piracy is not going to change that. There is also some cheek involved in putting out twenty different versions of Lethal Buddy Cop Chase 5, and expecting the public to pay for them all.

[Defcon]

I am not advocating piracy or being Robin Hood here, but I could really care less about the chump change they loose over piracy.

Compared to real money they pull in from the $10.00 movie theater viewings, merchandising, etc. It is a drop in the bucket...

[Will Hay]

there's a solution to this problem

In this particular case, there is one other solution....






...but the site AUP prevents me from spelling it out.
Greedy bastards.
Will

[Nilfennasion]

Compared to real money they pull in from the $10.00 movie theater viewings, merchandising, etc.

I once watched a documentary about filmmaking that makes clear the impact of multi-million dollar salaries and unions upon the industry. In today's world were films cost as much as $170 million to make, it would be more profitable for film studios to not make films at all. So this argument holds absolutely no water.

The other solution is, of course, for the companies to stop releasing films on home video at all, which would make pirate copies difficult to make of any value. Anyone who has seen a VCD made by some idiot holding a camcorder between his knees at a theatre can tell you what I mean. In comparison, DVD-Video provides source material that only a HD telecine can exceed.

The best way to justify piracy, and indeed the only way, is to look at how the major studios expect us to pay upwards of $35 (Australian) to own crap. Why pay that much for a cinematic turd like the Matrix trilogy when you can make copies of it for roughly $5 per disc (again, Australian)?

[Sefy]

So i'm the only one here who doesn't download movies from the web?
I'm also pissed about this "Special Edition" garbage that comes out, geez if you only knew how many copies of "Transformers" movie i've got (LD/VHS and two DVD).

I've personaly learned my lesson, when a movie first comes out to DVD, i've got no intention of buying it, i'll wait till there's a Special Edition and then wait some more for the price to drop, and then i'll buy it :P

The only things i'm download is TV episodes of Smallville and Justice League cause they aren't being broadcasted here

[teegee420]

The only things i'm download is TV episodes of Smallville and Justice League cause they aren't being broadcasted here

I never got into Smalville but Jusitce League rocks! I use to cap that show all the time when they were still showing new episodes. I even upped a few to usenet.

[Nilfennasion]

I think you'd be among a majority, really.

I don't download any movie files from the Internet that I plan on using on DVD or playing on a display unit. At 80cm, the average MPG or AVI file that you download from the net will look like crap.

I have such a hard time explaining to my old man that downloading DVD-quality material from the net is still impossible.

[teegee420]

Not to toot my own horn here but I didn't upload "avi crap". My posts were SVCD with an average bitrate of around 2500kbps. Damned near DVD quality for animation. I think you'd agree too. But you're right to assume that most of the stuff out there is crap.

[Sefy]

@teegee420, personaly I also think the first season of Smallville is rather crappy, but Season 2 and 3 so far have been awsome (especialy the first Christopher Reeve Guest appearance!). Justice League is awsome all the time, but it's pissing me off the only way I can see it is through downloads.

As soon as they have a Season Boxset, i'm buying it!

@Nilfennasion, you haven't heard Israel is considered to be a "one disc kind of country" huh ?
I'm a minority here, people call me a liar when I say I don't download movies cause I dislike the quality

[Nilfennasion]

I keep making the mistake of assuming that everyone on boards like these are from English-speaking countries.

Of course, the sensible solution is to release more discs in such places, but that involves setting up the markets, which means an outlay. Which might mean less control in the short term.

[glockjs]

so a ship captain walks into a bar with a steering wheel tied to his dick... the bartender says, hey! there's a steering wheel tied to your dick! the captain says, aaargh it's drivin me nuts... sorry i saw pirate


people do it cause they can, same reason im punk in drublic

[The village idiot]

I'm a minority here, people call me a liar when I say I don't download movies cause I dislike the quality

Isn't it sad... all this technology, and people still upload things with dropped frames, and bad audio. What passes for the norm is really pretty poor

[northcat_8]

I'm a minority here, people call me a liar when I say I don't download movies cause I dislike the quality

I don't download movies either....um, wait....does free porn videos count as "movies"???

[overloaded_ide]

Why do people pirate movies? Or anything else?

I think some people pirate for kicks, others are pissed off at the compaines and getting revenge the only way they can, and still others are confused as to what to buy or when to buy it! Some pirate also to replace stuff they actually bought and was destroyed! Then there are some that pirate because they can't afford the high prices, or to resell and make a profit. Some I think pirate to help preserve the rights of those that bought the products and paid the fees once already!

ME??
OK, I have watched Pirates of the Carabian about 15 times now and love that movie. I am happy to give them my money for what I consider a great movie! I heard they are making a second one, I can hardly wait to see it and get it, if it's as good as the first!
Why have I not bought the DVD yet? First is there gonna be a "Specail Release" in a couple weeks or months with extra footage, deleted scenes, more this and more that? OK I want that one! I will only buy one copy! I am waiting to see if a "Better" version comes out. (I think maybe there won't be a NEW version though because the DVDs on the shelf now say over 10 hours of extra scenes and bull)
If while I wait the price drops from $20 to only $15 or $10, then I am even more happy!
NO, I did not PIRATE Pirates
I have a friend that has it on VHS and I BORROW the actuall tape! THAT is not pirating. I have not made any copies of it, though I could if I wanted!
Also I loan them my tapes! I have a ton of tapes and they don't have a DVD player. They don't have to buy what I already have, and I don't have to buy the first released DVDs, because they buy all the tapes
THAT is not piracy!
Also Sometimes they buy my movie tapes used, then I go out and by the DVDs of the same movies, that also is not piracy! So we share alot, and LEGALLY do it! I am like a tape rental store at times, but I don't charge!

I learned my lesson on the first 2 Lord of the rings! NEVER buy a DVD untill it has been out at least 3-6 months! I got RIPPED when I bought those! For the same money other people get extra's I WAS CHEATED out of! THAT is the reason I have not even looked for Lord of the Rings 3 yet!
I would like to see the end, but I'll be DAMMED if they will ripp me a third time! ONE MOVIE, ONE RELEASE!!! That will help stop home pirates, because people like me won't be so pissed off! We won't have to wait months to see if there is going to be a new release! Also as a side point, they lose alot of sales to people like me that LEGALLY trade movies like I do. I might want to buy a DVD, but I am waiting to see if they release EXTRA versions, so I borrow tapes from a friend. Then by the time I am ready to buy and I think I am getting the best version that will be available, I am bored with the movie and say the heck with it! Has happened with at least 5 titles now that I can think of! Not pirating, but thier GREED has still lost them sales to me anyway!

MY REVENGE! When I find someone that has the SPECIAL releases that cost the SAME money I paid for my RIPPOFF releases I will make a copy for myself! I will also make a copy of the SPECIAL for anyone that owns the RIPPOFF for just the cost of the disks, or even free and I pay for the disks!
Anyone that says that is wrong I argue with in the open! RIPPOFF costs $20, SPECAIL costs $20, they have MY $20! What is the difference if I bought version 1 or waited 3 months and bought VERSION 2??? ONE purchase either way! Get half the material or all of it?? WHO RIPPED WHO?? Copyright fees are paid for the movie, no matter which "version" you bought!
Store has both on a shelf side by side for the same money, I pick up the wrong one, is it piracy to get the right one elsewhere? Once opened and you see your mistake they refuse to exchange for the correct one, even though it is the same price! Why even have the lesser one on the shelf to ripp me off in the first place if they both cost the same?
I made that mistake once! I saw a movie I wanted and there were 3 rows on the shelf all the same price, so I just picked one up and bought it, only looked to see if it was widescreen or not. I didn't know there was several extra versions so I did not look at which version I got. Again I WAS RIPPED, why even have it on the shelf?? And of course the store did refuse to exchange, it was opened! I could only exchange for the exact same version even thought the price was the same for them all!
There is no advantage to buying a lower quality package. If all you want is the full movie and no extra's, then for the same price you buy the one with all the extra's and then just don't watch them, same thing as the NON-specail version then! And why would anyone WANT to buy a movie with footage missing? There is NO such thing as 30 minutes EXTRA, the first was 30 minutes SHORT! The movie is either 3hrs or 4 hrs, not both, so any shorter version is not the full movie! RIP OFF!

Anyone that paid $20 for a movie has the right to have any version of that movie that costs $20!
Also widescreen fullscreen? OK is this wrong? You go to the store to buy a movie. You want widescreen but all the store has is fullscreen! The only thing you can find is full screen anywhere. So you buy a version you don't really want because it's the only thing you can find. Then I happen to have the Widescreen you were TRYING to buy to begin with. Is it wrong or piracy for me to give you a copy of my widescreen version? You paid the same money for it, you paid for the MOVIE, YOU PAID the copyright fees, but was forced into taking fullscreen you did not want! Not everyone can or wants to order off the net!

And to get into the piracy for kicks thing. Ya that's fun also! You take a VHS someone OWNS, strip out the protection and make them an EXACT COPY of the same movie on DVD. And just how would that actually be piracy? They own the MOVIE, They own the RIGHT to watch that movie! They PAID the copyrights fees, I just change the media that the movie is on!
To call that piracy is the same as saying it is piracy to buy a movie to watch on your 15" TV, then you upgrade to a 25" TV and that's piracy because you did not buy the movie for a 25" tv, only a 15"!
Basically that is the exact same thing! Whats the difference between changing TVs or changing from VHS to DVD??? It is still the same movie, same quality (or lack there of) and the same content! Either it has the extras or it does not! I only make it playable on a different piece of equipment! As far as that goes, it would be just as much PIRACY to buy a tape to watch on your Sanyo tape player, then buy a SONY and watch the same tape! UH, sorry that is piracy, you bought it to watch on Sanyo!
Totally unexceptable to watch that tape on a JVC! You just increased the quality above the level you orginaly purchased it for, right

Changing media, swapping versions ect.. is NOT a copyright violation! YOU PAID ALL COPYRIGHT FEES when you bought the movie! The copyrights are on the movie (or song), NOT the media or version!

If I buy a copy of ELVIS HOUND DOG, I paid the copyright fees to own 1 copy of that song! The copyright law does not state what media that song must be on! Legally I can buy one copy, I paid the fees, I can then change the media and destroy the original. Still only one copy, and I paid the fee to own one copy! Of course I never destroy the original on purpose! For one reason it's my only way to prove I paid the fees!
So for music I "PIRATE" because I already paid the fees required when I bought it! The fact that I cannot play phono records, 8track tapes any longer does not change the fact that I PAID the FEES required to have a working copy! I have a stack of MEDIA that is not useable, and I have a stack of home made copies I paid all required copyright fees on that are usable!

That is what I download at times! Call it piracy if you want, but I legally paid the copyright fees on the music! So what if I download a song like Rock Around the clock, Peggy Sue, Time in a Bottle? I already own them and paid the fees! Only ones supposedly losing any money would be the ones producing defective media! My 8 Tracks broke, cassettes got ate, records cracked and scratched and warped (sometimes they were that way new!) but I still paided all the FEES to own the songs! No-one has the right to force me to pay the fees again for the same songs by the same artists! Once I pay a copyright fee, it lasts as long as the copyrights last! And my right to own those songs last as long as they are copyrighted, and of course also continue as public domain rights when the copyrights expire! So downloading anything you bought and paid fees on is not piracy!

As for pirating to make a profit, I NEVER do that! The big time pirates do, and those are the ones that should be cracked down on. They are the only ones really hurting music and video sales to any serious point. Besides the Riaa and MPAA themselfs! I refuse to buy most new music Cds! My kid gets mad because I won't let her buy them either! It's a matter of principle and the RIAA can go to hell! We don't steal music either, but I do replace what I have LEGALLY bought and no longer works!

As for not being able to afford the high prices, some pirate for that reason also. Not that it makes it right, but abvousily if they can't afford to buy the real DVDs or CDs then no sales are lost, though it is still stealing and not right. I do not Pirate for that reason! If I want somethng I do not own I will buy it, if the price is too high I do without!
I can't afford a Rolls Royce to drive so I do without! I need a $20 CD even less than I need the car, so I can also do without the CD! Technically I could steal either if I wanted to bad enough, but I don't and won't!

And again as for replacing stuff that was destroyed. OK we again have the fact that people own the rights once they bought the movies or music! So I "pirated" a few of my movies and gave them to people I knew after their house burned downed! I know they owned the movies and therefore paid the copyright fees and have the legal right to own and watch those movies! I think it was like 20 DVDs, an extra DVD player and TV I had laying around unused, Some money, and a few extra needed Items that I gave them till they get back on thier feet. Everything they owned was lost when the house burned, including the kids toys. SO do I really care if the MPAA likes it or not?? The people owned the rights before the house burned, and still own the rights after the house burned, just the media was detroyed, not the right to own!
Does that cut into sales, yes probably, now those people don't have to buy the same things a second time that they already owned!
Is that piracy? Who cares?? I don't consider it to be! Replacing lost items is not theft! If I had given them copies of movies that they had never bought, then yes that would be piracy. Giving them copies of movies they paid copyright fees on is not theft, and therefore not piracy. Though I am certain it would clumped right in there with piracy under money grubing greedy definitions by those that would stand to profit otherwise!

But that's some of the reasons people so called "PIRATE" stuff.

No-one realy wants to admit once you pay copyright fees you FOREVER own the right to that many copies! You pay that fee everytime you pay a new copy of the same item!

That is another reason people so call pirate! I have the right to do whatever with my legally purchased copy! If I buy 10 Elvis albums and I get "HOUND DOG" and "Heart Break Hotel" on all ten albums then I paid and own 10 copies of that song. If I want to give away the album or sell it I have that right! Well I do not need or want 10 copies of the same song by any artist, so yes I will make 9 copies I have paid the fees on, and give those extras away FREE and keep ONE original for myself!
If they don't like it, then stop putting the same songs on every album as fillers when they add just 3 new ones or rare ones! I have paid the copyrights for every song on an album when I buy it, I have no reason to pay the same fees 10 times just because they want to rehash moldie oldies over and over in different orders. Release the song on one album only, and all different songs on each album! Then I only pay 1 copyright fee per song and don't have all those extras I paid the LEGAL fees on to give away!
Would that hold up in court, I dought it, is it legal, yes it is!
Once I buy anything I have the right to use it or get rid of it anyway I choose when I no longer want it! I can use it as land fill, sell it, burn it, give it away! That legally applies to all items including audio or video, cars, trucks, houses ect...
Only exception would be burning tires, might be illegal due to polution concerns :P

But otherwise I can legally give away the stuff I paid copyright fees on just as well as giving away a DVD player or TV!

And those are many reasons people pirate! OR so called "Pirate" when it really is not pirating at all!

[glockjs]

holy somebody wrote a story and a half.

reading through your post overloaded_ide i think your one of those people like the rest of us who got tired of buying hype aka in the music biz as one hit wonders aka total trash

[Sefy]

I'll give you a reason why I would rip, for example, I have about 40 Disney Classics on VHS. And you know their notice about superior quality and stuff but lets face it, VHS quality degrades. When they started coming with the DVD's I emailed Disney saying I want to replace my VHS for the DVD of that movie and adding of course the change in cost between the two.

I Was Rejected!

So, every Disney Animated I have a legal VHS copy, I borrowed the DVD of it and ripped myself a VCD copy (VCD=VHS quality right?) because atleast that doesn't degrade over the years like VHS does. Those movies I do not own (Dinosaur for example) I bought the DVD itself and then made a VCD of it for a copy.

[glockjs]

well sefy, you do technically have the "special edition" disney tapes with all the naughty stuff they edited out later...they dont make that on them new dvds n such