Which is easier? Capturing directly to MPEG-2.

[BIGTIME]

Hey guys, I am a newbie on this. Which is easier? I am trying to capture directly to MPEG-2. Using an ATI 9000 pro, or a digital camcorder, or a DVD recorder. I have a HP pavilion a230n, with a 2.08 GHz processor, and 512MB DDR SDRAM, and NVIDIA 4 MX 64MB DDR Graphics card, and 120GB HARDDRIVE just added 160GB MAXTOR HARDDRIVE. I am trying to make good quality DVD's from my home VHS collection. All advice would be highly appreciated. Thanks.

[Bodysurf]

Hey guys, I am a newbie on this. Which is easier? I am trying to capture directly to MPEG-2. Using an ATI 9000 pro, or a digital camcorder, or a DVD recorder.

A DVD-recorder is easiest.

I have a HP pavilion a230n, with a 2.08 GHz processor, and 512MB DDR SDRAM, and NVIDIA 4 MX 64MB DDR Graphics card, and 120GB HARDDRIVE just added 160GB MAXTOR HARDDRIVE. I am trying to make good quality DVD's from my home VHS collection. All advice would be highly appreciated. Thanks.

Learn how to capture to AVI, edit in a NLE and render to DVD-Video using VBR MPEG-2 and Dolby Digital (AC-3) audio for best results if you have the desire to tinker, experiment and get the best possible results.

If you just want to convert in the fastest possible manner, then go with a DVD-recorder.

[spectroelectro]

The previous poster, like so many folks on this forum, wants you to do it *his* way. That is not an answer to your question.
Capturing to MPEG-2 is easier in some ways, harder in others. If you capture directly to MPEG-2, you don't have to worry about taking time and trouble to encode an AVI file to MPEG-2. That's easier. However, if you want to edit out commercials, or if you have an audio-video sync problem and need to fix it, you will have to edit MPEG-2, and that is definitely *not* easier. In fact, editing MPEG-2 is much harder than editing DV format AVI files.
If you need to edit MPEG-2 the only reliable solution that consistently works is to bite the bullet and shell out $100 for Womble MPEG VCR. This is the only piece of software in existence that cuts native MPEG-2 files without distorting 'em. m2 Edit Pro, which costs a lot more money, will edit native MPEG-2 files but typically increases their size by about double in the processof transcoding 'em. So I don't recommend m2 edit pro. Using TMPG to edit MPEG-2 files requires a complete re-encoding, which is *not* easy and which takes so long I don't recommend that either.
Cpaturing directly to MPEG-2 in real time with your computer probably also doesn't produce MPEG-2 files which are as small or look quite as good as capturing a DV AVI file and encoding to MPEG-2 outside of real time. I own a PCI vid cap card and occasionally I capture to MPEG-2 in real time, but not often. Aside from the other issues, the resulting file is always alrger than a TMPGEnc'-generated MPEG-2 file and it doesn't look quite as good (minor motion artifacts, etc).
On various FAQs on this forum you'll find people pointing out that it's usually quicker and less troubleto capture in DV format AVI and then batch encode to MPEG-2 rather than cappping direclty in MPEG-2. That's probably true, but it depends on whether you can stand to have your computer locked up for many hours each day encoding video. I queue up my video and let it encode overnight and this works pretty well for me, but if you absolutely positively don't want to hassle with encoding all that video and authoring and burning DVDs, then a DVD recorder may be the best way to go. They're getting cheap now (< $370) and the quality is not quite up to well-encoded DVDs produced on a home computer but it's so close the difference isn't worth arguing about.

[lordsmurf]

Splicing footage (ie, removing commercials) does not qualify as "editing". You can splice without re-encode. And its easy (Womble MPEG VCR).

Editing involves more cumbersome adjustment of the footage.

AVI to edit/restore, MPEG to convert (maybe cut away excess).

http://www.lordsmurf.com/capture/avivsmpeg.htm

You need a good card and software for MPEG capture. Any old junk works for AVI. So budget affects quality in the end.

Remember to have fun. This shouldn't be a chore. Unless you're paid.

[mnkyboy]

Splicing footage (ie, removing commercials) does not qualify as "editing". You can splice without re-encode. And its easy (Womble MPEG VCR).

My captured mpeg2 files play fine after capturing, but when I cut the commercials out with Womble, i have audio drift problems. The only program I got to work correctly, is Nanopeg. I like Womble better, since its faster to skip throughout the video stream, but I always get audio sync problems.

Do you know a workaround for this?

You need a good card and software for MPEG capture. Any old junk works for AVI. So budget affects quality in the end.

What mpeg capture card do you recommend? It seems to good to be true to have a "perfect" capture card that works everytime. My current capture card, Leadtek 2000XP Deluxe, seems to work great, but when I author the files, i get the audio drift problems.

[Tom_Oliver]

I’m hardly an expert so someone might scoff at this, but I use the 9800 Wonder card to capture to MPEG and then edit with TMPEGEnc DVD Author. Works totally awesome and it doesn’t re-encode the video. I setup the ATI TV thing with the settings I want and record. When I’m done I boot TMPEGEnc DVD Author, edit out the commercials, save it as a DVD file, and burn. Takes me about an hour tops from a finished recording to DVD for a three or four hour recording. I record NASCAR races.

Before I had a capture card and it was a nightmare. First I had to record the race to a VCR or something. Then transfer to the PC with the capture card. Took forever to get the settings right using VDub. Then I had to use TMPEGEnc to convert to MPEG. That normally had to run all night and it still never looked very good.

Now it’s a piece of cake.

[q1aqza]

The previous poster, like so many folks on this forum, wants you to do it *his* way. That is not an answer to your question.

I thought the previous poster gave good advice.

Reading what the original poster asked, he/she is talking about making quality DVDs from a home VHS collection, so undoubtedly the easiest, fastest and arguably the best quality (due to the built in TBC that most DVD Recorders have) results will be obtained using a DVD recorder.

If some of the VHS collection is copy protected then a macrovision filter device would need to be used between the VCR and the DVD Recorder.

[Bodysurf]

The previous poster, like so many folks on this forum, wants you to do it *his* way. That is not an answer to your question.

What are you talking about? The OP said:

"Hey guys, I am a newbie on this. Which is easier? I am trying to capture directly to MPEG-2. Using an ATI 9000 pro, or a digital camcorder, or a DVD recorder."

to which I replied:

"A DVD-recorder is easiest."

I answered his question. Are you merely trying to stir up trouble?

BTW, you said:

"If you need to edit MPEG-2 the only reliable solution that consistently works is to bite the bullet and shell out $100 for Womble MPEG VCR. This is the only piece of software in existence that cuts native MPEG-2 files without distorting 'em. m2 Edit Pro, which costs a lot more money, will edit native MPEG-2 files but typically increases their size by about double in the processof transcoding 'em. So I don't recommend m2 edit pro."

I have had no such issues using M-2 Edit Pro. I can snip out stuff using M-2 Edit Pro and the file size is less than the original, as would be expected, and not doubled in size. Perhaps you didn't set the parameters correctly in M-2 Edit Pro. Womble MPEG2VCR certainly has less parameters (less powerful), but it simpler to get set up if all you want to do is do simple cuts on a MPEG file.

[courtrrb]

I only capture to MPEG-2 accross my lan to my linux box. I then remove all commercials using Linux utilities. I have no and I mean no audo-sync problems. The price of the editing/slicing software is free.

[SatStorm]

The fastest way PC based?

Capture mpeg 2 @ 15.000 using any card and software.
Then author this mpeg 2 file with TMPGenc Author, avoid what it says and export. Then use dvd2one to re-encode it (shrink it if you prefer...) to 1 DVD-R. Unfortunatelly, dvdshrink 3.5 doesn't work with TMPGenc author...

Limitations: About 2 hours on a DVD-R this way, using 704 x 576/480 as framesize. Not filtering at all, which IMHO is an important step for VHS to DVD transfers. You need a good VCR with TBC, good cables and perhaps a demacrovision device.
Pros: You have a virtual identical picture with the VHS tape. Fastest way for PC based solutions.

Best method?
Capture VHS through a videocamera (pass through) to DV. Minor filtering, encoding.

Limitations: Expencive compared other methods. Can be use only on the system of the camera (PAL/NTSC: Forget exotic formats/crossovers...). More time the previous method
Pros: Best quality possible, with non-pro equipment. Since the encoding comes from avi, you can resize, filter or whatever, so you can have about 2.30 - 4Hours per DVDR that way, with excellent quality.

The typical method?

Capture to avi using typical cards with video-in. Filter, encode.
Limitations: The slowest method.
pros: Cheapest method. Can succeed results indentical with the other methods in triple time. You can use it with exotic formats like PAL60 or NTSC50.

This is my opinion of course. Others may have other.

[presto]

Big Time,

I really recommend that you follow Lordsmurfs guides. In my experience the only reason to capture avi is if you plan to add transitions and other special effects.

Tom_Oliver,

I do things exactly the way you do except that a few weeks ago I decided to try Womble Mpg-vcr as per Lordsmurfs advice. It really does make editing out commercials even easier than doing it in Tmpgenc DVD Author. Also the splices are perfectly smooth instead of the slight pause you get from Tmpgenc DVD Author.

My trial period of Womble Mpg-vcr is almost up and I'm going to buy it.

[courtrrb]

You all must be rich or something and have mony to thow away. Buying software to do somthing when you can get software for free that does the same thing. I see M$ has got you all sucked in.

[SatStorm]

@courtrrb: You don't help the linux community with posts like those....

The cheapest method in windows is:

- Any cheap bt8x8 card, like let say kworld mpeg 2 station. Cost, less than 50 euro at most.
- Win 98SE for OS. Cost: 10 euros at most for a second-hand legal CD from any ebay-like online place
- Virtualdub for capture and proccess. Cost: free
- YMPEG to use with virtualdub at w98se so to capture realtime to mpeg 2 at any framesize. Cost: Free
- Ifoedit for basic authoring, if you can't afford TMPGenc Author OR you don't have any authoring application shipping with your drive. Cost of Ifoedit: Free
- Burn4Free, burnatonce or DeepBurner to burn, if you don't have any legal copy of any nero after version 5.5. Cost of those programs: Free.

Total cost (PCI card for capture + neccessary programs: 60 Euros). Well, this price is afforable even for Romanian citizens, which have a basic month salary about 100 euros per month!

So, what is all this about "rich" users?

Look, I don't like M$ also (just search a bit for me, you'll see related topics...), but hell, if you are here only to create mess, better post on other forums, with less advance users!
There are FREE solutions for windows also...

[courtrrb]

The last time I used Win98 I had more problems than I could shake a stick at. I would get the machine loaded and than take a day to get my video capture working. Than when I would start capture the stupid os would give a BSOD half way thru the capture no other software was loaded. So I moved onto Win2000. I finaly got the capture to work all the way thru. So now onto editing. I had audio-sync propblem up the ying-yang(I still laugh when I hear sombody say I have this audio-sync problem in window) what a pain in the *^%$& So I went out and bought Xp what a peice of crap. No email no browser and it still virus and locks-up when I try to encode or edit or when it dosn't lock up its very very slow. I loaded Xp at least 20-30 times onece for every peice of software mentioned here. I would try the remove software but the machine would become even more unstable. I just a stable system or one that will do want I want. As much a pain in the *&%## it is I finaly wiped the disk clean loaded Xp for the last time and ONLY loaded the video capture software. I still have to reload the machine once a mounth because I keep losing the boot sector and you want me to pay for all these problems. If I can get the Windows program running under my windows emulator and it stable I'll buy it. Which I have done. But I willl NEVER use any MS product as my main production system just to unstable. I've tried virtualdub audio-sync problems and I don't want to use other software to fix it's problems,

From end of VHS capture to playing in my home DVD player is less than an hour without all the hassles.
From capture of a TV show to editing out commercials to playing in my home dvd player is less than a half hr again with audio-sync problems or hassles.
Now can you beat those times in any pure windows Enviroment. I think not from what I've been reading here.

[SatStorm]

Linux is more stable and if you learn it, you can succeed great results for free. Undoubtly. In the matter of fact, most of the free windows applications are based on other Linux programs.

But this has nothing to do with where you tried to lead this descussion.
Now you try to lead it further. I repait to you: You don't help the linux community with posts like this.

If you want to present a Linux solution, write a "how to" guide and point it to every relating discussion. This is the correct way. By critisize an OS and simply post your experiences with it, doesn't help anyone. This is the sad true.

I believe that you know pretty well your stuff, so I suggest you to sit down and write a wonderfull and fully helpful article about Linux and our hobby. In detail. It is an area which only few articles exist online.

Personally, I use w2k and I don't have a simply problem on all my 3 PCs at home and my PC at my job. I also use linux (madrake distribution, I'm old ...) on many - many things.
The reasons I dislake m$ is what m$ became over the years. Not the buggy programs offered to users over the years. Bugs exist and gonna exist for ever. Bug fixes exist and gonna exist for ever.
What really suprices me, is that you are able to do things with linux many can't even imagine, and you fail to set up any buggy m$ OS.
A linux user knows M$ OS's inside out if you ask me...