Forget this capture crap, I bought a stand alone.. now what?

[thotholicious]

I bought the panasonic, I can return it within 30 days so I'm going to play with it and if it does what I need it to then I will keep it. So I have 39 tapes with 8 hours on each tape... and wnat to put them on DVD. I was told that I could buy the stand alone and then import what I record to dvd to the computer to do my editing? Any thoughts?? The media used will be dvd-r

[Bob W]

If you record with DVD-R then you can just copy the files onto your computer then use an editing program that will import VOB files and accept AC3 audio. NeoDVD Plus works fine for this (I use it all the time) but there are other programs. The downside of using DVD-R to record then do editing on the computer is you waste a disc.

If you record to DVD-RAM then you will need a DVD drive that also reads DVD-RAM in order to transfer the VRO files to your computer where you can then change the file extension to mpeg to do your editing.

[Popee]

I was told that I could buy the stand alone and then import what I record to dvd to the computer to do my editing? Any thoughts?? The media used will be dvd-r

a) Why in the world would you want to save the tapes first on a stand alone, and THEN edit them in the computer.
b) Once they are edited, what will you do with them?

Why not use a capture device to import the files to the computer, edit them and then just burn to DVD. Why the extra step?

[Bob W]

"Why not use a capture device to import the files to the computer, edit them and then just burn to DVD. Why the extra step?"

Because the DVD recorder quality is much better than you will ever get with a capture card (most likely due to the built in TBC or time base correction). Also it will save a ton of time since the files don't have to be re-encoded.

[lordsmurf]

I was told that I could buy the stand alone and then import what I record to dvd to the computer to do my editing? Any thoughts?? The media used will be dvd-r

a) Why in the world would you want to save the tapes first on a stand alone, and THEN edit them in the computer.
b) Once they are edited, what will you do with them?
Why not use a capture device to import the files to the computer, edit them and then just burn to DVD. Why the extra step?

I'm a fan of capture cards myself, but it'll take the length of the show to record, no matter if it is standalone or captured. The only extra step is copying the disc (rip not needed) to the HD for editing, re-author.

I won't call it better, just different. I've made tons of video on my ATI AIW cards, and don't see how it could get any better than near-perfect (perfect isn't available when the source is VHS or broadcast/cable). And I've seen standalone devices do just as well. Remember not to compare a $500+ recorder to a >$100 capture card. My $200 card (at the time, now about $125) can do the same as the recorder. Just preferences, as the recorder is like a VCR, and is why I want one too.

[Popee]

Because the DVD recorder quality is much better than you will ever get with a capture card (most likely due to the built in TBC or time base correction). Also it will save a ton of time since the files don't have to be re-encoded.

OK, understood. However, I suppose that the stand alone is making MPEG files. It is my understanding that MPEG is to video what JPEG is to photos, a lossy format. Therefore, each time you edit and resave, there is the inevitable loss of quality associated with the MPEG file type.

Or, perhaps the program he will use will just save the edit points as a seperate file. That being the case, there will be no loss. However, would he still not have to re-render the final product?

I have a ADVC-100. I capture from VHS via a svideo cable, as an AVI file. I then edit in Vegas Video, and then render as an MPEG2 file. Perhaps my eyes are fooling me, but the end product is certainly as good as the original VHS. In some cases, using the filters and image controls in Vegas, I can even better the original. At least in terms of brightness, contrast and sharpness of image.

[overloaded_ide]

Yea, I'd like a stand alone too, but I don't see how it's gonna be much better? Though I will admit right off I don't know much about them!

8HRs on a vhs tape? Ok correct me if I am wrong here, but does he actually have any quality to lose? He is talking VHS right?

Will he be actually making DVDs or will the recorder capture to Mpeg2 files or others without authoring a DVD? If he is making a DVD, what kind of editing is he wanting to do, and can he on VOBs or will he have to convert them to mpeg or avi latter anyway?

Once he has the file on the computer, does he have a burner to get them back off again? Something some people seem to forget at times, ya easy to put on with a reader, hard to get of with one though
I've seen people do this with Cd's
Or can he use a firewire to get the files back to the standalone recorder?

Since I don't know about the setop recorder, I'll skip that, but as for capture cards
I get about Comercail VHS quality from my VHS captures with my ATI AIW card. I capture to mpeg2. Lots of settings you can try, de-interlace, those Ip frame things, and various things I see in Tmpgenc Plus. I guess the ATI card should do it on the fly like tmpgenc does for encoding. I don't do any of that though.
So far I never have had any sync problems capturing directly to mpeg2.
8Hrs on a tape, does not sound to me like he has Comercail quality movies to start with.
So will he really come out any better with a Standalone than a capture card. Especially if he has to have 2 burners! One standalone, and one in the PC?
Will the stand alone also connect to a pc and act simply as an external burner?

I mention and ask such things because I would like to know more also about such things!

[FulciLives]

It is BEST if you use DVD-RAM
You can get a DVD-ROM drive that reads DVD-RAM for around $50
Toshiba makes one that can be found easily.

Then you need a software called MPEG2VCR by WOMBLE MULTIMEDIA

This program will allow you to edit to edit your DVD-RAM file

Then you can use just about any DVD authoring program that accepts AC-3 audio such as DVDLab or the TMPG DVD Author or SpruceUP etc.

You can also do this with DVD-R but you will want to probably use STREAM MODE to extract the MPEG file ... you don't want VOB files.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[mkelley]

Okay, don't shoot the messenger here, but I just thought I'd present an alternative opinion.

I have both a standalone (the Panny) as well as a burner, and I'd never do what the poster wants to do. To transfer and EDIT any VHS tape I would for sure use a capture card. I use the Hollywood bridge and the results are at least as good as the Panasonic.

The problem here is you are trying to mix apples and oranges in any number of different ways. You want to save time by using the Panny to capture, but a decent capture card can do the same thing (encode to MPEG). You want to edit out commercials but editing (even with Wobble) an MPEG file is never a good idea -- for one thing, DVDLab will have issues with it (trust me). You are locking yourself in with a compression rate on your capture rather than editing an AVI and THEN compressing -- also a bad idea, particularly since you want to reduce things down to a very huge compression level. You want to use DVDR to transfer things back and forth from the Panny to your computer, and you'll be double burning disks and creating a LOT more headache for you.

Here's what I would do (and indeed, is what I do): capture my VHS via a quality card (which together with a burner will still cost less than the Panny) as AVI. Top quality and no loss -- then edit in Premiere or some other program to get rid of the commercials, etc. Export as MPEG (you can do this as batch processing overnight, so no loss of time -- I routinely process four or five two hour shows overnight) and then author with DVDLab.

I've converted nearly all of MST3K (about 190 or so 2 hour shows) in a few months now, and I don't particularly have a lot of free time. Then again, I spend very little time at the computer, since it captures and encodes for me while I do other things.

I use my standalone only for recording things I am NOT going to edit (works great for that kind of stuff) and for where I don't care how the menus look.

[CHAOS]

Because the DVD recorder quality is much better than you will ever get with a capture card (most likely due to the built in TBC or time base correction). Also it will save a ton of time since the files don't have to be re-encoded.

Agree, my personal opinion & experiance 8)

OK, understood. However, I suppose that the stand alone is making MPEG files. It is my understanding that MPEG is to video what JPEG is to photos, a lossy format. Therefore, each time you edit and resave, there is the inevitable loss of quality associated with the MPEG file type.

Actually, if recorded on dvd-r it makes .VOB's ect just like any dvd, & then you can rip those to your hard drive & import the files with any program that will accept them. dvd-ram, which i use so not to waste a bunch of dvd-r's, records in a format called .VRO which also allows the same by just renaming the extension to .mpg, i have seen no quality differance or quality loss between the 2 & i have done both.

Or, perhaps the program he will use will just save the edit points as a seperate file. That being the case, there will be no loss. However, would he still not have to re-render the final product?

I use TMPGEnc DVD Author which allows .mpg's & .vob's to be imported, even in the same project together, editing, chaptering, cusom motion menus, allows the original ac3 audio recorded from the panny to pass right through, re-authors & will burn to dvdr. i upgraded to a pioneer dvd/ld combo player acouple of years ago and have trnsfered many laserdisc's with my panny and the final dvd with just this program gave great results. it seems alot of other people say you MUST HAVE MPEG2VCR by WOMBLE MULTIMEDIA to import .VRO files, all you have to do is copy & paste .VRO's to your HD then change the file from .VRO to .mpg, actually, TMPGEnc DVD Author will also accept .VRO files.
But yes, you must also wait for TMPGEnc DVD Author to re-author the finished product & write it to the audio_ts & video_ts folders.
Anyone who has not, should at least try it