minidv to mpeg2

[gehct]

hello all,
I am trying to convert avi that I captured via firewire from my minidv @ 640-480 to mpeg2 (to put on dvd), however when I try converting with tmpgenc nomatter what I use, E.G. noninterlace, interlace with bottom field fist, or interlace with top field first, I always get a streaky picture - especially on fast moving objects and when I pause the picture.
any help is appreciated.

[gehct]

no help?? how's this $10 donation to vcdhelp for a solution.
thanks

[Dragonsf]

Have you tried to deinterlace the movie first with VirtualDub + deinlace filter? This gave best results for fast scenes:
Capture->DV Type-2 avi->VD deinterlace->tmpgenc->mpeg-2.

[Xesdeeni]

Unless your camcorder has a "progressive scan mode" and you are using it, your video is interlaced. A TV is also interlaced, however your computer screen is not interlaced. Whenever you show an interlaced video on a non-interlaced screeen, you will get interlace artifacts. If your destination will be an SVCD or DVD for showing on a TV, then you want to leave the video interlaced to match the TV, and ignore the problem on your computer screen while you are creating the disc. But if your goal is to show it on your computer, then you should probably deinterlace it. My preferred method is to use the Area-Based Deinterlacer plugin for VirtualDub, and frameserve the results to TMPGEnc.

Xesdeeni

[gehct]

thanks for your reponses, my goal is for PC showing, I will try the deinterlace filter on vdub, However I would like to point out that the avi file plays fine with no interlace showing - before it 's compressed. Just wondering if this makes sense - I have no idea.
thanks again

[gehct]

hi again,
2 more problems - possibly 1,
when I try opening the avi I got via firewire in vdub, I get an error that it needs a "dvsd decommpressor" - I can't seem to find it anywhere.
also when I try captureing dv straight out of vdub I get "error getting commpressor output file size"?? thanks

[Dragonsf]

Ah yeah, this is the DV trap: one of the seroius problems are the DV compressors.You need either the Mainconpect DV codec or the Adaptec DVsoft codec.And you have to capture to DV type-2, which (in mysterious ways - at least for me ) can only handle 9 min (other say 20 min) of footage.So you need multiple file capture.If you like, I can send the Adaptec codec (which is free, but difficult to find) via email.Just drop me a line.On the other side the MC can be downloaded as demo.
the dvsd you're seeing is the Microsoft codec BTW, which can't be used by VDup.

[Xesdeeni]

gehct,

Dragonsf is right. You are probably seeing the miniDV footage played back through the Microsoft codec. The default setting for this is to reduce your 720x480 (NTSC) video down to 360x240. It does this by throwing out every other line (one out of every two fields) and every other pixel horizontally. There is a way to set it to play back 720x480, but this requires a registry modification (the configuration dialog just allows you to stretch the 360x240 out, but doesn't restore the missing pixels and lines) and for some reason it doesn't always work right when you open the video again. And for some reason the Microsoft codec isn't compatible with most other video software (go figure, Microsoft not compatible).

Anyway, I use the MainConcept codec, which is free for playback. It puts a logo in the upper left for encode, but it's seldom a problem (see below). The full verison is (a ridiculous) $50. With this codec, I do indeed see the interlace artifacts in the miniDV footage, as I would expect.

As for the length, I can get up to 4GB in Type 2, so I get about 18 minutes. This size is a limit of the AVI format. But using the AVI format means you are compatible with almost all other video software. I normally capture with Premiere, which uses its own internal codec, but the file is compatible with the MainConcept codec. Also, if I choose to output from Premiere after editing, the internal codec is used, which doesn't put a logo. Of course, I seldom output the file, unless I'm archiving the finished product for later conversion. Instead, I use AVISynth to frameserve to whatever software I want to process the video (usually TMPGEnc or VirtualDub).

Dragonsf, what codec are you talking about? For what is it adapted? Can you make it available through this site?

What do you use to capture? I tried Sonic Foundry's Video Factory capture, but it was buggy and I never got it to capture audio (it kept trying to capture two of the four 12-bit 32KHz streams when all my tapes have the two 16-bit 48KHz stream). The only good thing was it didn't require the pre- and post-roll that Premiere's capture requires. Although Premiere will let me do batch capture.

Xesdeeni

[Dragonsf]

This is the DVSoft codec from Adaptec.I'll try to make a package out of it (for Win2K and XP).It's used for firewire connection.
I'm capturing with DVApp, this is part of the DirectX SDK.You can capture files as long as your drive (with NTFS) permits, or you can capture to type-2 (4GB limit)
Try it:

http://home.t-online.de/home/Claus_anders/dvsd.exe

[gehct]

thanks dragon the codec worked flawlessly and so did the area deinterlace, however I'm still getting an error message "error getting commpressor output file size" when I try to capure from dv into vdub, I need to capture into vdub because I need the multiple file capture (I hope to get a full tape - after I get a bigger HDD) does premeir do multiple files? thanks again
also xesdeeni I sort of understand your reasoning however that doesn't explain why the avi file before compression please with no artifacts @ 720x480.


p.s. I jsut paypaled vcdhelp $10 THANKS!

[Xesdeeni]

The reason I'm guessing you aren't seeing the artifacts when you played back the miniDV file was that you were using the Microsoft DV codec. For some reason, the codec only plays 360x240. Even if you go to "200%," you only get 360x240 stretched to 720x480.

NTSC TV is actually two fields that are each 240 lines (technically NTSC is 262.5 lines per fields, but only about 243 of these contain video and we round to the nearest multiple of 8 for digital video). They don't lay on top of one another, they are instead vertically aligned so that they are interleaved.

For any kind of motion, the information in each field represents a different position of an object.

On most TVs, these two sets of fields are shown sequentially, meaning that they are not shown at the same time, but instead one after the other. On your computer screen both sets of 240 lines are shown at the same time (on more expensive TVs with "line doubling", something similar to the smart deinterlacers we have been discussing is used to improve the huge picture).

When showing the fields sequentially on a TV, this gives an "effective" 60 frame/sec fluidity of motion (the more instants of time, the smoother the motion), at the expense of lower vertical resolution. (But when there is no motion, you get an apparent higher vertical resolution, thanks to your eye/brain's persistence of vision that combines both 240 line fields into one 480 line frame.)

But on a computer screen, these two fields are shown at the same time, so there are actuallly two different positions being shown simultaneously. This is the interlace artifacting that we all despise.

Anyway, since the Microsft DV codec throws one field out, when you size the image to 480 lines, you get one field's 240 lines stretched, rather than both fields. This means there is only information from one instant of time on the screen, so there are no artifacts.

Xesdeeni

[TheInformer]

Xesdeeni:
...
As for the length, I can get up to 4GB in Type 2, so I get about 18 minutes. This size is a limit of the AVI format.
...

I used my MiniDV camcorder with ScenalyzerLive, and have captured 2 hours straight into one file. The file size was ~26 gigabytes.

If your software saves in Open DML format, and your OS supports file sizes > 4 gigabytes, then there is no 'practical' file size limit for ".AVI" files.

[Scobo]

What version of Premiere are you guys using ?
I am awaiting delivery of a Canon miniDV camcorder and would like to use Premiere to edit then framserve to TMPGEnc.
I have 5.1, is this version compatible with DV files ?

[jtor]

The reason I'm guessing you aren't seeing the artifacts when you played back the miniDV file was that you were using the Microsoft DV codec. For some reason, the codec only plays 360x240. Even if you go to "200%," you only get 360x240 stretched to 720x480.

...this is the player's fault. On Media Player, it's probably set to Half resolution. You can change this after loading the AVI file in Media Player, do a File/Properties, click on Advanced, select DV Video Decoder. Select FULL (NTSC 720*480).

If you're using a NLE software to view, it probably won't give you full DV resolution for viewing, as it would be better to allocate most of your resources to more useful stuff, and not on the preview. Although some software would allow you to adjust preview, why would you?

[gehct]

...this is the player's fault. On Media Player, it's probably set to Half resolution. You can change this after loading the AVI file in Media Player, do a File/Properties, click on Advanced, select DV Video Decoder. Select FULL (NTSC 720*480).



hmmm, winmedia ver. 8 doesn't seem to have an advanced tab.

p.s. just wondering is a "real" (commercial) dvd interlaced? if it is why does it play on my pc without artifacts? thanks