Can VirtualDub save DV-AVI's?

[Undead Sega]

I know for a fact that VirtualDub 1.8.5 can read and accept DV-AVI files which is great, but i was wondering if it can do the same so exporting? very much like how a NLE does, when u capture a Mini DV tape and do an edit and back to the Mini DV tape, without loss of quality.

i am aware that DV itself is a lossy codec, and there a few DV Codecs around, but what differes from all of them? but as a matter of fact, can VirtualDub export to a DV-AVI?

[cd090580]

Yes, it can export if you have a dv codec installed. Or you don't need any codec to export if you use Direct Stream Copy for video. You can only use Direct StreamCopy if you only do cut in the video. Any filter application will require the full processing mode and a dv codec installed.

[jagabo]

Install Cedocida.

[Undead Sega]

Oh okay then, by the way, what advatage does Cedocida have compared to the other DV Codecs available?

[guns1inger]

There aren't many choices for DV codecs for virtualdub because you are limited to vfw codecs. The other main player is the Panasonic DV Codec, which is also free, but is softer and has clipping issues. Cedocida is sharper and more accurate.

[jagabo]

Panasonic DV codec has several problems.

It has a bug where it sometimes tells the system it can decompress other codecs -- but it can't. So if you open a file with one of those codecs you don't get any video.

It only decompresses to RGB with a rec.601 contrast expanding matrix. If your video has blacker-than-black or whiter-than-white areas (and camcorder footage usualy does) those parts will be lost, and what's left in between loses precision. On the compression side it always performs the rec.601 contrast reduction.

I haven't noticed any bugs in Cedocida. You can control whether it inputs/outputs YUV or RGB video and whether it performs contrast expansion when converting YUV to RGB or contrast reduction when converting RGB to YUV.

[Undead Sega]

i see then, well i do have one problem, it encodes fine, but when i take that DV-AVI file into Premiere Pro 1.5.1, it seems to hang up or crash, unless a solution might be that i convert it again using Canopus DV File Converter? would that work probably?

[jagabo]

i see then, well i do have one problem, it encodes fine, but when i take that DV-AVI file into Premiere Pro 1.5.1, it seems to hang up or crash

Can you open other DV AVI files in PP? Try saving with no audio.

[Undead Sega]

oh it definately can, bit it didnt hang up like this, right now its working very very slowly conforming the audio.

[jagabo]

I just checked -- Premiere Pro requires type 2 DV AVI. Save with audio set the audio to 48 KHz, 16 bit, stereo, uncompressed PCM.

[Undead Sega]

the audio is already 48 KHz, 16 bit, stereo but AC3, which can be accepted (only 2.0ch AC3 audio).

either way, does that mean this is where Canopus DV File Converter comes in?

[jagabo]

Your problem is the AC3 audio. Use uncompressed PCM. A different DV encoder won't help.

[guns1inger]

You didn't create a true DV avi file if it has AC3 audio. The Canopus DV File Converter converts between type I and II, which basically just re-arranges the way the audio is stored in the file. It does not do an encoding at all.

[Undead Sega]

in what way does it re-arranges the audio? isnt that what im looking for?

[guns1inger]

in what way does it re-arranges the audio? isnt that what im looking for?

No - you want to encode the audio correctly, which you needed to do in virtualdub in the first place.

If you want to know about the difference between type I and type II DV, have a read of this : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DV

[Undead Sega]

yeah, i know precisely what to do now, sigh...another night long job again, ive been through so many of these for other stuff, but at least i am perfecting it and become excellent to what i am now

[guns1inger]

You should be able to just convert the audio in your dv file without re-encoding the video. This should be relatively quick. Open the file you created. Make sure the video is set to Direct Stream Copy, then set the compression for the audio to uncompressed pcm. Save the results and see if Premiere is happier with the result.

[2Bdecided]

FWIW I often struggle to make that part work. I get an AVI, the video is DV, the audio is 48kHz 16-bit LPCM, but it's not a "DV-AVI" that's accepted by other things. It's AVIdemux which I think should work, but doesn't (for me). I'm sure I'm doing something wrong, but have never traced it.

If there's a trick to getting Type 2 DV-AVI straight out of this software easily, please share it!

Cheers,
David.