Controlling CCE's output file size.

[astrocity20]

I'm doing a PAL to NTSC DVD operation at the moment using CCE only and running an avs script. And I'm wanting to hold the main movie at a size of 4,150MB and that is exactly what I put into CCE's "File Size" option. And it changes the bitrate to 5269 avg, 2000Min, 9000Max (it only automatically changes the average) I have it on 3 Pass and it keeps farting out a dud of 4.63GB. Is there any sure fire way to reel this in besides trial and error and waiting another 5 hours to find out if the operation is correct or not?

[guns1inger]

Use a bitrate calculator and get the number you need. What is the running time of the video ?

[astrocity20]

1hr 45min and when running a calculator should I consider it PAL or NTSC since it's converting TO NTSC?

[guns1inger]

If you use an average of 5396 kbps, with a max of 9000 and min of 500 you will get a file that 4150 MB.

Bare in mind this does not include audio, which must be added on top.

If you get a larger file size then you have mis-entered the data, or CCE is doing something very screwy. I have always found CCE to be pretty accurate.

[manono]

What's the framerate you've got in the script? If you don't know, open it in VDub(Mod) and go File->File Information and check. And what's the framerate you've got set in CCE? I suspect the problem is a difference in framerates between the 2. And if you're really setting the filesize and not the bitrate in CCE, then you're setting the MiB, right?

[levick]

Converting from PAL to NTSC does this change the movie total time?

I find when going back the other way I get a change in time which needs to be adjusted in when encoding...

[manono]

Converting from PAL to NTSC does this change the movie total time?

It can. It just depends on how you make the conversion, in the script, the CCE settings, and in how you apply the pulldown. That's why I asked what framerates you were using. Maybe post the entire script.

[guns1inger]

If you do it badly, yes.

What you should do is resize (carefully) to 720 x 480, leaving the framerate at 25 fps. This will not change the running time. Once you have your video, use DGPulldown to add 25 fps -> 29.970 fps pulldown patterns to the video so it plays back correctly in NTSC equipment.

[manono]

And uncheck the "For DVD" box at the top of the main screen.

[astrocity20]

Hummmm, this is strange. I'm confused now. I have a basic test script

LoadPlugin("D:\temp\dgmpgdec146\DGDecode.dll")
Mpeg2Source("D:\scandal_convert\VTS_03_1.d2v")

I opened that in vdub and looked at the file information and it says it's 29.976fps and 720x480

I did the same with my editting script

LoadPlugin("D:\temp\dgmpgdec146\DGDecode.dll")
LoadPlugin("D:\temp\decomb_25_dll_20050222\decomb5 21vfr1.3\Decomb521VFR1.3_P4-Athlon.dll")
MPEG2Source("D:\scandal_convert\VTS_03_1.d2v")
FieldDeinterlace(full=true)
LanczosResize(720,480)
ConvertToRGB24(interlaced=false)

And it says the same. 29.976 and 720x480 are both NTSC but it's a Pal UK Masters of Cinema disc of Kurosawa's Scandal. But I know it's interlaced. CCE automatically reads it as 29.976 as well and selects that as the Frame Rate. And no I used MB not MiB to set the file size.

[guns1inger]

It is not uncommon for even major studios to be lazy and release NTSC material in PAL countries. We are generally able to play both (unless you use a PS2 for playback). It could well have been NTSC, although I suspect you should have used the Film option in DGIndex.

CCE will assume that anything 720 x 480 is NTSC regardless, unless you tell it otherwise.

[manono]

Geez, no wonder. And you don't even know whether the DVDs you buy are PAL or NTSC? MoC often releases R2 DVDs as NTSC, because that's what the source master is. Here, read a review:

http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film/DVDReviews19/scandal_dvd_review.htm

But I know it's interlaced.

You know wrong. If, when running the preview in DGIndex, it shows it to be FILM, just use Force Film and get a 23.976 progressive D2V for use in your script. If it show it to be NTSC Interlaced (not very likely), then use Honor Pulldown Flags, make a 29.97fps D2V and apply an IVTC in the script to bring it back down to 23.976fps. Encode for 23.976fps. No conversion necessary.

And don't ever deinterlace a movie, particularly a nice one from the MoC people. That just ruins it. ConvertToYUY2() for CCE, not RGB24. No resize line is needed.

CCE automatically reads it as 29.976 as well and selects that as the Frame Rate.

That's its default setting. It reads everything as 29.97fps unless you change the default, as I have done.

Use MiB when setting the final size rather than the bitrate.

[astrocity20]

Amazon shows it as PAL for one. Also I thought combing... the lines through the picture particularly in motion meant it was "interlaced". That's how I always understood it. If not then what the hell is interlaced?

[manono]

If not then what the hell is interlaced?

Look, you made your D2V using the "Honor Pulldown Flags" setting. That gives you an interlaced 29.97fps D2V. If you open that basic script you showed earlier in VDub(Mod), scroll to a place with movement, and then start advancing a frame at a time, you'll see 3 good progressive frames followed by 2 interlaced frames in every 5 frame sequence, a sure sign of telecine. Most NTSC films on DVD are encoded as 23.976fps with pulldown applied so they output interlaced 29.97fps as required for NTSC DVDs. If when running the DGIndex preview it shows as FILM, make the D2V using the Force FILM Field Operation. Voila, progressive 23.976fps and no more interlacing. Then apply pulldown yourself (2:3 or 3:2 pulldown) either when encoding in CCE or afterwards. This is pretty basic stuff.

Amazon is wrong. Believe the DVDBeaver site. Want proof? Stick it in the DVD-ROM, open it in DVD Decrypter, set it for IFO Mode, hit the Streams Processing Tab, and check what it says about the video. Or open a VOB in DGIndex and check the resolution at the top of the screen or run the Preview and check the Video Type

[astrocity20]

Calm down killer sheesh.

[manono]

Who's excited? All you're doing is wasting our time because of your gross incompetence.

[astrocity20]

You can help or not help that was up to you. I appreciate your help but not the attitude.

[manono]

I give you gold and you reply with insults rather than thanks? I wonder how many previous encodes you've messed up with lousy scripts and CCE settings. Scandal is a fine movie. I own it myself, but it's not very hard to figure out that it's NTSC (even if all you have to go on is Amazon's incorrect info), and how to treat it.

[astrocity20]

Uhmm... when did I insult you? Seriously. \

[manono]

Uhmm... when did you thank me? Seriously. \

[astrocity20]

I said I appreciated your help... I thought we were still conversing if giving a thank you is what drove you insane all you had to do was wait for what would've been a happy finish to our fair thread. Thanks Gunslinger and Manono (I guess) for the help.

[guns1inger]

Children, children. Are we done yet ?

Astrocity20 - I assume you now understand that no format conversion is required. If you need to back it up and reduce the size to do so, I strongly suggest DVD Rebuilder and HCenc and burning with Imgburn.

[astrocity20]

THAT, i can handle :P. But for future reference what did you use to get those bitrate numbers? Videohelp's Bitrate Calculator? CCE itself?

[guns1inger]

I actually used an off-line bitrate calculator called VideoCalc or Vcalc. You can find it in the tools section. I set the audio and extras to 0, set a custom target size to 4150, and that was the answer I got.

[astrocity20]

Cool, I'll try it out the next time I need to do a conversion or shrink. Thanks.