Help with fixing wrong AR of an original dvd

[Talayero]

Hi,
I bought a movie that originally had 2.35:1 aspect ratio. They had cropped it to 1.80 more or less. Most of the reviews I’ve read about the dvd complain about the cropping but say nothing about the images being a bit distorted, out of shape.

I would like very much to resize the film in order to get a dvd with a better aspect ratio. I tried it but I keep seeing the images too long.

Really, I don’t know if it’s possible to fix that. All I know when I see the picture is that in order to see it well I should reduce the height, keeping the same width.

I tried some script like this one (by the way, the movie is ntsc):
DirectShowSource("O:\saragosa manuscript.m2v")
LanczosResize(720,372)
AddBorders(0,54,0,54)

But nothing changed. All the figures are still long

This is one of the reviews: http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film/DVDReviews11/Saragossa_Manuscript.htm
(they say the actual dvd AR is 1.92:1, but I would say 1.80:1 at most)

Thanks in advance.

[Soopafresh]

You should run the file through DGIndex and use Mpeg2Source in AviSynth. DirectShowSource is much slower and less accurate.

loadplugin("dgdecode.dll")

Mpeg2Source("yourfile.d2v")

ConverttoYv12()

crop(0,96,-0,-96) #whatever these numbers are to get rid of the black bars

Bicubicresize(720, 400) #Make sure the numbers are multiples of 16

AddBorders(0,40,0,40) (or whatever works to make it 720x576)

You'll have to tweak the #s, but that'll work Download AVSP so you can view your changes in Avisynth.

[Talayero]

Thanks a lot!
Using DGIndex it does works.

Anyway I can realize now that I went too far resizing the height to 372. Now the figures are too short. I think I’ll have to try several resizings till I find the good aspect ratio to my eye.

I don’t know if there’s a better way to do that. I guess that if I could find some object in the film that is supposed to be square in real world I could try to make it square in the image. Well, I don’t know. I’m going to download AVSP, as you said. That may help.

[FulciLives]

Try the following:

LoadPlugin("dgdecode.dll")
Mpeg2Source("yourfile.d2v")
LanczosResize(720,448)
AddBorders(0,16,0,16)

That will give you a 16x9 WS DVD as per the original but this squashes it down a bit. Those numbers may not be exact but I based it on the images from the website.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
That script assumes that the original video is PROGRESSIVE video. If it is not then you have to resize in an interlaced friendly way. Also what MPEG-2 DVD spec encoder are you using? For instance if using CCE you add ConvertToYUY2() to the end but if you use TMPGEnc Plus then you add ConvertToRGB24() to the end.

[manono]

Are you quite sure it's "a bit distorted, out of shape"? Looking at the pics, they look to be in the right proportion to me. Perhaps the best thing would be to go find something round (a ball, sun, moon, etc.) and see if it's a slight oval. Do this while playing the DVD, and NOT looking at the 720x480 video in DGIndex.

If it is off, it's only by a little bit, so, as you discovered, 372 can't be correct. It's another crappy DVD from Image Entertainment. Not sure why you bother.

I tried it but I keep seeing the images too long.

Are you just looking at the 720x480 image? Or the resized image? If you want to see it resized, open the script in (the right) VDubMod. I'm using ver 1.5.10.2. Right-click the screen and hit 16:9 frame ratio.

[FulciLives]

It's another crappy DVD from Image Entertainment. Not sure why you bother.

A friend of mine bought a recent Asian DVD release by IMAGE and the master used was a PAL master ... he said the PAL to NTSC is one of the worst he has ever seen. I've also read a review that more-or-less said the same. This was a movie just released onto DVD!

The only other DVD of this movie is a Hong Kong release that is also NTSC but according to my friend they did a better PAL to NTSC job than the IMAGE release ... both using the same PAL video master. He still said the Hong Kong DVD is lacking though (better PAL to NTSC but still imperfect) plus the HK version doesn't have the English dubbing (and the IMAGE DVD does).

He says it is a shame because the image quality is very nice if not for the PAL to NTSC conversion issues.

IMAGE strikes again LOL

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[Talayero]

That script assumes that the original video is PROGRESSIVE video. If it is not then you have to resize in an interlaced friendly way.

The film is interlaced. So I added "ConvertToYUY2(interlaced=true)" to the script for cce. I hope that's right.
I'm now in the process of reencoding it. The resize is 720 x 444, close to what you said.

I didn't know that Image Entertainment had sort of bad reputation. The dvd is a bit crappy, yes. I'm sure the image is distorted, although sometimes is hard to tell, and to top it all a bit of the image is missing on both of the sides. You can tell it now and then.

What I don't understand is how it is possible to edit a dvd with a wrong AR. I have no idea about the way they transfer the film, but it's as if they didn't use the accurate lens. Anyway I've only seen another film with AR problems, it was "Next stop Greenwich Village", and with this one I did a poll among my friends and only half of them could notice the fault.

[manono]

Hi-

The resize is 720 x 444, close to what you said.

Didn't you say this is for DVD? So, did you pad it out to 480 by adding more black, maybe 18 both above and below? I guess you did if you followed some variation of the FulciLives script

And no, that's not what he meant by resizing in an interlace friendly way. You can't just resize it any old way. By doing what you did, you've destroyed the field structure and ruined it.

But it's not interlaced. It's a movie after all. You can make it progressive again and then resize the way you did. If Image Entertainment DVDs of European films aren't PAL2NTSC (I can find no mention in the reviews of it being so), then they're hard telecined and should be IVTC'd. That is, by IVTCing it, you can get rid of the interlace, make it progressive again, make the CCE compression much more efficient as you'll be encoding for 23.976fps progressive, rather than for 29.97fps interlaced, and generally improve the quality of your encoding tremendously.

[FulciLives]

Well there are all sorts of ways to resize interlaced video. If all you did was add the part at the end that you said you added then that was wrong or at least not enough. I mean yeah you need to put ConvertToYUY2(interlaced=true) if the source is interlaced and you are using CCE but that has nothing to do with the resize method.

manono may know a better way but here is the way I resize interlaced video.

Go to this website link ---> http://www.avisynth.org/stickboy/

Look for the download called, "jdl-util.avsi" and another download called, "jdl-interlace.avsi" and if you need further clarification then read this link ---> CLICK HERE

Basically copy both of those files into the AviSynth Plug-In folder.

Now your script will look like this:

LoadPlugin("dgdecode.dll")
Mpeg2Source("yourfile.d2v")
SetParity(true)
JDL_UnfoldFieldsVertical(true)
LanczosResize(720,444)
JDL_FoldFieldsVertical(true)
AddBorders(0,18,0,18)
ConvertToYUY2(interlaced=true)

The line that reads JDL_UnfoldFieldsVertical(true) separates the frame into two fields ... then you resize ... then the line that reads JDL_FoldFieldsVertical(true) combines the two fields back into a frame.
The SetParity(true) line simply means you have TFF or Top Field First video. If you have Bottom Field First video then you use SetParity(false) instead.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
Once again manono beat me to the punch ... I need to learn to type faster it seems LOL

[FulciLives]

Well now manono says to IVTC and that might be a good idea if you have a clean enough 3:2 pattern.

I'm not that great at doing an IVTC and truth be told I "cheat" by doing the following.

I load the source into autoGK as if I am going to make a XviD or DivX and I let autoGK figure out if it can do an IVTC and if so I wait until it gets to the first pass. Then kill it.

Now look in the folder that autoGK created and the AVS that says, "filename_movie.avs", is the file with the proper decomb plug-in path and decomb parameters.

I just did this with a DVD back-up using this method and here is what the AVS file looked like:

LoadPlugin("C:\PROGRA~1\AutoGK\DGMPGDec\DGDecode.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\PROGRA~1\AutoGK\filters\decomb.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\PROGRA~1\AutoGK\filters\RemoveGrainSSE3.dll")
movie = mpeg2source("G:\BETTIE_PAGE\VIDEO_TS\agk_tmp\BETTIE_PAGE.d2v")
Telecide(movie,guide=1,post=2).Decimate(mode=0)
RemoveGrain(mode=1)
Crop(8,4,-8,-4)
AddBorders(8,4,8,4)
ConvertToYUY2()

The 2nd line is the decomb plug-in path and the 5th line is the decomb parameter I "stole" from the autoGK created script.

So let's say as an example that you get the exact same decomb parameters when you try it. If so then you would change your script to look like this:

LoadPlugin("C:\PROGRA~1\AutoGK\DGMPGDec\DGDecode.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\PROGRA~1\AutoGK\filters\decomb.dll")
movie = mpeg2source("C:\DVD\VIDEO_TS\yourfile.d2v")
Telecide(movie,guide=1,post=2).Decimate(mode=0)
LanczosResize(720,444)
AddBorders(0,18,0,18)
ConvertToYUY2()

I hope this is all making sense

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
The RemoveGrain stuff is a "video noise" filter that works rather well but must be used with a progressive video source (or after the decomb parameters which make the video progressive). It really doesn't work for interlaced video. For a good interlaced video "video noise" filter I use Convolution3D.

[Talayero]

Well, I've never done an IVTC and I'm glad to learn new things. I don't know if some of the CCE Pulldown options could be a "clean enough pattern".

DgIndex says: Video Type: NTSC; Frame Type: Interlaced. Therefore, you are right, an IVTC seems very appropriate.

If I understood well I should go first from 29.97 to 23.97 without resizing and using the 3:2 CCE pulldown option. And also checking the progressive frame box in CCE picture quality.
I don't know how many pass. May be only one or two, since I want to keep the same bitrate and not to compress the film.

Then once I have the 23.97 film I can use my script:

LoadPlugin("mpeg2dec3.dll")
Mpeg2Source("saragosa.d2v")
LanczosResize(720,444)
AddBorders(0,18,0,18 )
AddAudio()
ConvertToYUY2(interlaced=false)

Well, I don’t know how may wrong things I just may have said. I’ll have another look tomorrow. Here it is almost three in the morning.

Thanks.

[manono]

Hi,

Well, I don’t know how may wrong things I just may have said.

Hehe, plenty.

Don't let CCE perform the IVTC. Do it in AviSynth.

LoadPlugin("mpeg2dec3.dll")

Old and obsolete. Where'd you get that thing anyway?

Get the DGMPGDec package from the link. Make a new D2V using DGIndex (the successor to DVD2AVI) with Video->Field Operation->Honor Pulldown Flags, and use the DGDecode.dll (the successor to MPEG2DEC3.dll) that comes included in the same package. The the script might go something like this:

LoadPlugin("DGDecode.dll")#use full path
LoadPlugin("Decomb.dll")#use full path
Mpeg2Source("saragosa.d2v")#use full path
AssumeTFF()#get field order from DGIndex by running preview
Telecide(Guide=1,Post=2).Decimate()
LanczosResize(720,444)
AddBorders(0,18,0,18 )
AddAudio()#not needed if you have an up-to-date CCE
ConvertToYUY2(interlaced=false)

Test out the script carefully in VDubMod before sending to the encoder. Set up CCE for 23.976 progressive encoding. Get the most up-to-date Decomb here:

http://neuron2.net/decomb/decombnew.html

Oh, and read the QuickStart guide (and the other 2 docs) that comes with DGMPGDec, and the Decomb Reference Manual (and the others) that comes with Decomb.

[Talayero]

Thanks a lot for all this information. The NTSC stuff is always hard to me.

Now I realize I didn't compresse well another ntsc movie I reencoded with cce a couple of days ago. This one was Film 99 % and Progressive. So I guess I should have chosen Force film in Field operation. I have to repeat this encoding. In this case I suppose I only have to check Force film in DGIndex and then to give cce this script:
LoadPlugin("dGDecode.dll")
Mpeg2Source("movie.d2v",idct=0)
ConvertToYUY2(interlaced=false)

I think I have to read a lot more about ntsc and film to video transfers. Till now most of the NTSC movies I had were Video Type Film. If I've seen one or two that are video ntsc is because they've been originally shot on video. But this old film, "Saragosa Manuscript", with the AR problem, is a pure NTSC. That means it was hard telecined. I read this in the "Telecine" entry of Wikipedia: "NTSC DVDs are often soft telecined, although lower-quality hard-telecined DVDs exist."
So, is that the difference? Ntsc films that were hard-telecined are always of less quality that the soft-telecined ones?

LoadPlugin("mpeg2dec3.dll")

Old and obsolete. Where'd you get that thing anyway?

From Doitfast4U. I have version 1.4.0.0. It may be a bit out of date.

Set up CCE for 23.976 progressive encoding.

With NTSC films do I have to check always 23.976 progressive encoding, no matter if Video Type is Film or NTSC?

[manono]

Hi-

In this case I suppose I only have to check Force film in DGIndex and then to give cce this script

If, when you run the Preview, DGIndex tells you it's NTSC/Interlaced, then you can't use Force Film. In the other example where it said 99% Film, yes, you probably should have used Force Film. But I don't think you'll be able to with this Image Entertainment film. Assuming it's been hard telecined, you'll have to IVTC.

If I've seen one or two that are video ntsc is because they've been originally shot on video.

Maybe. But you'll have to learn to tell the difference between true 29.97fps interlaced video, and telecined film. Both kinds will show as NTSC/Interlace in the DGIndex Preview. One can be IVTC'd, and the other can't.

Ntsc films that were hard-telecined are always of less quality that the soft-telecined ones?

Well, usually, often because inferior and obsolete encoders were used. And they're inferior for other reasons also, besides just having been hard telecined and encoded as interlaced. I mean, just look at the DVDBeaver screen caps of that Saragossa Manuscript movie, or any other Image Entertainment DVDs, and compare them to those from a good Hollywood Studio DVD. They have a very low average bitrate, the max bitrate is way too low, they always use the inferior Standard Matrix, and this one's cropped, contrast boosted, and edge enhanced. And over-priced.

With NTSC films do I have to check always 23.976 progressive encoding, no matter if Video Type is Film or NTSC?

If you're feeding it a 23.976fps AviSynth script, either from using Force Film, or from an IVTC in the script, you set up CCE for 23.976fps progressive encoding (progressive box checked, zig-zag scanning, framerate set for 23.976). When feeding it a 29.97fps script, you set it up for interlaced encoding (no progressive box checked, alternate scanning, framerate set for 29.97)

[FulciLives]

Thanks a lot for all this information. The NTSC stuff is always hard to me.

Now I realize I didn't compresse well another ntsc movie I reencoded with cce a couple of days ago. This one was Film 99 % and Progressive. So I guess I should have chosen Force film in Field operation. I have to repeat this encoding. In this case I suppose I only have to check Force film in DGIndex and then to give cce this script:

LoadPlugin("dGDecode.dll")
Mpeg2Source("movie.d2v",idct=0)
ConvertToYUY2(interlaced=false)

Yes that would be the correct script although you don't really need the idct=0 part and ConvertToYUY2() means the same as ConvertToYUY2(interlaced=false) ... only when you have interlaced video do you need to use ConvertToYUY2(interlaced=true)

With NTSC films do I have to check always 23.976 progressive encoding, no matter if Video Type is Film or NTSC?

As manono already pointed out if you can do FORCE FILM then you encode as if you have a 23.976fps source because that is the case. If you don't use FORCE FILM then you have a 29.970fps source and sometimes you will have a 3:2 pattern that will allow an IVTC to be done ... other times there is no clear 3:2 pattern or the video is 100% interlaced (usually stuff originally shot using a video camera instead of a film camera) in which case you must leave it at 29.970fps and encode it as interlaced video.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
Whenever you encode something at 23.976fps you have to apply the 3:2 Pulldown flags. Some version of CCE can do this while other versions cannot and will spit out 23.976fps without the needed 3:2 Pulldown flags ... in which case you need to use DGPulldown and run the 23.976fps ---> 29.970fps option. Thus you end up with a 29.970fps source that is a "soft" telecine.

[FulciLives]

I just realized that while this is an NTSC DVD that you are in a country that uses PAL and if you have a progressive NTSC source or you can make it progressive using IVTC then you can "very easily" convert it to PAL format so in the end you can burn a PAL format DVD instead of a NTSC DVD which will probably give you better quality on your equipment which is likely doing some form of NTSC to PAL conversion which is likely inferior to what you can do in an AviSynth script.

If you think you want to try this either manono or myself can help with the required AviSynth commands needed. It's actually a very simple "step" once you get the IVTC worked out.

For instance you said that with that other DVD that said it was 99% film ... you do FORCE FILM which give you 23.976fps NTSC (progressive NTSC).

You wanted to verify your script:

LoadPlugin("dGDecode.dll")
Mpeg2Source("movie.d2v",idct=0)
ConvertToYUY2(interlaced=false)

I said that was correct but you could instead just use:

LoadPlugin("DGDecode.dll")
Mpeg2Source("movie.d2v")
ConvertToYUY2()

Well let us say that you wanted to make it PAL instead. All you have to do is change the script to look like this:

LoadPlugin("DGDecode.dll")
Mpeg2Source("movie.d2v")
LanczosResize(720,576)
ConvertToYUY2()

Now when you encode this with CCE you will end up with a "hybrid" video file. It will have the PAL format resolution of 720x576 (instead of the original NTSC resolution of 720x480) but it will still be 23.976fps instead of 25fps. Well you simply run the file that CCE gives you through DGPulldown and select the "custom" option and fill in "23.976fps ---> 25fps" and a new video file is outputted for you (only takes a few minutes) and that new file is now 100% PAL format.

You can do the same thing with the IVTC script.

You cannot do this NTSC to PAL trick when you have a true NTSC interlaced video. It could still be converted to PAL but then the process gets much more involved.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[Talayero]

Thanks again. Now I have two projects in mind.
1) Compress the NTSC movie that is 99% film and convert it to PAL
2) Resize the NTSC movie that has AR problems and convert it to PAL.

I already did the first one, with this script:

LoadPlugin("D:\archivos de programa\DGDecode.dll")
Mpeg2Source("bunny lake.d2v")
LanczosResize(720,576)
ConvertToYUY2()

I put the script in my CCE 2.70.01.05 and checked the 3:2 pulldown box, and then I converted the resulting mpv to 25 fps using DGPulldown.

But something went wrong, the resize didn’t work and I ended with a 720 x 480 file.

As for the second project, the one is NTSC hard telecined, interlaced, I intended to use the script manono wrote:

LoadPlugin("D:\archivos de programa\DGDecode.dll)
LoadPlugin D:\archivos de programa\Decomb.dll Mpeg2Source("saragosa.d2v")
AssumeTFF()
Telecide(Guide=1,Post=2).Decimate()
LanczosResize(720,444)
AddBorders(0,18,0,18 )
ConvertToYUY2()

I’ll load it in CCE and this time won’t check the 3:2 pulldown. I’ll wait till I solve the convert PAL issue of the first project before applying it to this one.

[manono]

Hi-

But something went wrong, the resize didn’t work and I ended with a 720 x 480 file.

You probably have the "For DVD" box checked up at the top. And don't apply pulldown. Just get your 720x576 23.976fps MPV out of CCE and apply pulldown using DGPulldown set for 23.976->25 after you're done.

[FulciLives]

Hi-

But something went wrong, the resize didn’t work and I ended with a 720 x 480 file.

You probably have the "For DVD" box checked up at the top. And don't apply pulldown. Just get your 720x576 23.976fps MPV out of CCE and apply pulldown using DGPulldown set for 23.976->25 after you're done.

What manono said

CCE has this box you can tick off called "for DVD" in the newer versions (it's different in the older versions but similar) and that will force a resize and some other nastiness you don't want. So do it again with that tick box not ticked off (heh) and then be sure not to turn on 3:2 Pulldown inside CCE either.

As for the other script you need to add a change in resolution.

For instance you said this was your final script:

LoadPlugin("D:\archivos de programa\DGDecode.dll)
LoadPlugin D:\archivos de programa\Decomb.dll Mpeg2Source("saragosa.d2v")
AssumeTFF()
Telecide(Guide=1,Post=2).Decimate()
LanczosResize(720,444)
AddBorders(0,18,0,18 )
ConvertToYUY2()

You need to change it to this:

LoadPlugin("D:\archivos de programa\DGDecode.dll)
LoadPlugin D:\archivos de programa\Decomb.dll Mpeg2Source("saragosa.d2v")
AssumeTFF()
Telecide(Guide=1,Post=2).Decimate()
LanczosResize(720,444)
AddBorders(0,18,0,18 )
LanczosResize(720,576)
ConvertToYUY2()

Now there you are resizing twice but without writing one hell of a long ... very long ... detailed response ... that is the easy way of doing it in this situation. I don't think the double resize will really hurt the image all that much (knock on wood).

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[Talayero]

Thanks. You know everything. I had the "For DVD" box checked.
This time the thing went perfect . Now I'm starting the second encoding, with the double resize.

In the while I would need a tip to import well the chapters in my first project. I know I have to do something special because of the change from ntsc to pal, but no idea of what it may be.

[FulciLives]

Thanks. You know everything. I had the "For DVD" box checked.
This time the thing went perfect . Now I'm starting the second encoding, with the double resize.

In the while I would need a tip to import well the chapters in my first project. I know I have to do something special because of the change from ntsc to pal, but no idea of what it may be.

I just make up my own chapters. Sometimes I do PAL to NTSC conversions since I live in a NTSC country and when I do that I will sometimes play back the PAL DVD on my TV and watch the chapter stops and try to match them manually myself with my DVD authoring software.

There is a way to import chapters but I recently looked into doing that and it just didn't seem like as great an idea as I thought it was.

Maybe manono can fill in why ... he's the reason I decided not to do the auto chapter thing LOL

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[manono]

Hi-

About the chapters, if you use an authoring app that accepts them by time, the chapter times don't change. Your PAL DVD will be exactly the length of the NTSC DVD, and the chapter points stay the same.

If you use a frame-based authoring app, like Muxman or IFOEdit (Rejig evidently can automatically switch them from NTSC<->PAL, so you might consider using that), then the original NTSC chapter points are based on the displayed 29.97fps framerate. You want to convert to a 25fps framerate. Therefore, multiply each chapter frame number in the Celltimes.txt by 25/29.97 = 0.8341675 Have fun. It's easier going the other way. 29.97/25 = 1.1988

[machf]

Regarding chapter points and converting bwtween "pal" and "ntsc"... have you considered using the "Celltimes" plugin for PGCedit? First, use the "Convert frame numbers to timecodes" option, indicating the source framerate, and then use the "Convert timecodes to frame numbers" option, indicating the destination framerate.
Never mind, I just realized you may get errors, as the timecodes are stored as hours:minuteseconds.frames (not hours:minuteseconds.decimals)...

[Talayero]

Hi,

I used the Pgcedit plugin for the chapters. It wasn't totaly accurate but solved the issue. I authored it with a frame-based program, Muxman, and as manono said that's the reason for this issue. I remember other ntsc pal conversion I did time ago (with Procoder, automatic way, that's why I don't master the scripts for CCE) and then I authored it with Scenarist and didn't have this chapter problem.

Well, I've finished the two projects and both went well, but I want to experiment a bit more. I can see a slight problem of video smoothness. It's not that the image is jerky all along, but now and then I do notice some slight freezing of the characters when they move. It's hard to tell and I could actually leave it like that, but I' m going to repeat the two encodings without the ntsc to pal conversion.

As my standalone can play both sistems I just want to compare. I don't think I did something wrong with the dgpulldown from 23.976 to 25 fps. First I forgot to check the set drop frames box but next time I checked it.

Now that I'm sticking to ntsc encoding I remember what FulciLives said:

Whenever you encode something at 23.976fps you have to apply the 3:2 Pulldown flags. Some version of CCE can do this while other versions cannot

I think I do now have to check the box, at least in my first project. As you see I'm still a bit confused.

[FulciLives]

Some versions of CCE will output 23.976fps as 23.976fps without 3:2 Pulldown applied. Other versions (newer versions) allow you to encode 23.976fps but output it with 3:2 Pulldown applied. DO NOT confuse this with the CCE function of doing an IVTC.

Unfortunately different versions of CCE have slightly different interfaces so it's best to read the manual (should have come with a PDF file of the manual) to see what setting to use.

The older versions as I said just put out straight 23.976fps in which case you had to apply pulldown. DGPulldown makes that easy. Just tick the option, "23.976fps ---> 29.970fps".

Here is the deal ... progressive NTSC is 23.976fps but a NTSC TV is still 29.970fps so you have to apply 3:2 Pulldown to 23.976fps so that it plays back at 29.970fps ... it only plays back at 23.976fps if you have a progressive scan TV and a progressive scan DVD player. Otherwise it will play back at 29.970fps even though there are only 23.976fps there.

Isn't NTSC great

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[Talayero]

Hi,

things are clearer now. The encoded movie that was 99% film works very well, no matter if I leave it ntsc or I convert it to pal. I had the faulse impression that it was jerky when converted to pal but it's not at all. May be I made I mistake the first time I converted to 25 fps by unchecking the set frame drop box in DGPulldown. But even that "unchecked" version seemed quite well to me when I saw it after a good sleep.

What it's jerky without any doubt is the damned Saragossa Manuscript, the one that was hard telecined by Image Entertainment and I wanted to resize. I used the script written above (with Telecide, Decimate, etc), once with the resizing to pal, and another time without it, just to get the same bad resaults. Now I see that NTSC is complicated, specially this crappy interlaced one.
As I don't know if it is possible to change something in the script to have another try in the search for smoothness, I've just put the movie in Procoder and wrote the resize (720 x 444) to see what comes out. Nothing good I suposse.

[FulciLives]

I think it is jerky due to the IVTC not working as well as it should have. This could be due to your settings or it could be due to the fact that the 3:2 pattern is just not stable enough for a proper IVTC.

Try doing it again but leave it as interlaced 29.970fps NTSC video and make a NTSC DVD. It should be fine then as per the original but again your DVD player/TV will have to convert it to PAL but sometimes they do it better than you can when the NTSC is interlaced.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[manono]

You can also upload an unprocessed section of it (10-15 seconds showing movement should be fine) somewhere so we can have a look.

[Talayero]

Try doing it again but leave it as interlaced 29.970fps NTSC video and make a NTSC DVD.

Hi,

with the little knowledge I have of all this I guess that in order to make a ntsc from a source that is let as interlaced 29.970, I'll have to make a different script, because the one I have uses telecide and decimate, and if I'm not wrong, that means IVTC.(That IVTC script didn't work well, specially in some scenes, probably because the movie has not a clear 3:2 pattern, or at least I can't see it when I put it in virtualdubmod, sometimes I see four progressive frames and one interlaced, sometimes I see as if one frame were repeated)

So I have to try the resizing without doing the IVTC. I went back in the thread and found this FulciLives script that didn't have the IVTC:

LoadPlugin("dgdecode.dll")
Mpeg2Source("yourfile.d2v")
SetParity(true)
JDL_UnfoldFieldsVertical(true)
LanczosResize(720,444)
JDL_FoldFieldsVertical(true)
AddBorders(0,18,0,18)
ConvertToYUY2(interlaced=true)

But when used it didn't recognized the SetParity(true). So I changed for the "AssumeTFF()". Then it didn't recognize the JDL_UnfoldFieldsVertical and I got stuck. No idea of what to do.

[FulciLives]

Go back to the post where I mentioned that script.

Here is a link: CLICK HERE

You will notice that I said you have to download some stuff and copy it to your AviSynth plug-in folder/dir for that script to work. I'm guessing you didn't do that otherwise the script should have worked.

In fact I just used a similar script myself last night on a project although I didn't use the SetParity(true) because I think you use that do identify top field vs bottom field and the default is top field so you don't really need it unless you have bottom field then you do need to use it and use it like this: SetParity(false)

Again I was working with a top field MPEG-2 video as a source so I just eliminated the line that said, SetParity(true) and it worked fine.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman