Can't get letterbox to show up wtih SVCD on 4:3 TV playback

[johndeere]

Hi everyone,

I am using avi2dvd to convert to XviD to SVCD. I have tried multiple different times with multiple different encorders (QuEnc, FreeEnc and HCEnc). The output files look fine. When I look at the mpegs before I burn the discs, they are, in fact 16:9 widescreen format. When I try to play the discs on my DVD player (a Sony NVP-NS55P, I believe), however, they always show up as 4:3 (I believe it is zooming in on the image as opposed to compressing it).

I spent all night trying to play with the settings on the DVD player, but they're not so complicated. I have the screen output set to 4:3 Letterbox mode. But no matter which mode (the others are 4:3 Pan & Scan and 16:9 Widescreen) I put it on, the output to the TV looks the same. I can only help to believe that this is some sort of issue that the Sony DVD player has with VCDs. I should note that the resolution of the XviD before the conversion is 640x352.

The weird thing is that another XviD that I converted earlier in the week displays fine. Unfortunately, I got rid of the source video, so I can't do much along the lines of comparisons.

Does anyone know what might be causing this? Is the simplest solution simply to manually change the video to 4:3 format with a built-in letterbox before doing the conversion? If so, what is the easiest way to do this? Thanks!

[jbodin]

I have a successful method for producing DVD-compliant letterboxed MPEG2 files from 640x352 AVI files using gui4ffmpeg -- I'll post the details tonight when I get home. You should be able to use my method to produce SVCD files, but you might have to do some audio post-processing to obtain SVCD compliance.

At any rate, before I hit on the solution that I'm using I was having the EXACT same problem you are experiencing with the video output, so don't despair -- there IS an answer!



EDITED TO ADD: I just did a quick check, and gui4ffmpeg WILL produce SVCD-compliant output directly, so you should be able to use my method with NO need for audio post-processing.

[johndeere]

Thank you so much... I can't wait for the step-by-step (although I'll probably spend some time messing with it if I get to it first).

I have spent so much time in the past year trying to figure out ways to play DivX/XviD movies on my DVD player... I'm hoping that this will be the end of it. (Or, ya know, I could just spring for the $30 to buy a DVD burner... one day...)

[jbodin]

It's probably easier to walk you through it with pictures than it is to try to
explain it all to you, so here goes -- first, open up gui4ffmpeg and select
the file you want to edit using the "Open File" selection at the top, then
select the options that I've indicated below and choose a location for the
file you're about to encode using the "Save File" button as indicated at the
bottom:



This will create a 4:3 format with pre-defined letterbox framing (top and
bottom black borders) -- the "Correct ratio" checkbox is what enables this,
but the problem is that if you just do this, the resultant file will NOT have
the correct aspect ratio (the picture will appear to be squished or stretched).

The solution for this is to manually set the top and bottom padding. In order to
do this, you have to add these commands to the batch file, then manually
edit the batch file. Add these commands to the batch file by selecting the
"Add current command" option from the "Batch" menu as shown:



Next, you need to select the "View batch file" from the "Batch" menu as shown
below in order to modify the top and bottom padding:



After you select "View batch file" the gui4ffmpeg batch file will open in Notepad.
The file should look like this (the values you will be editing are highlighted):



Using 272 for the height value as shown, with top and bottom padding set to
104 will result in a VERY "squished" image, so you don't want to use the defaults.
For your purposes, you should use 368 as the height, and 56 for the top and bottom
padding as shown below:



After you make these changes, save the file:



Then you'll need to close Notepad, and from the gui4ffmpeg "Batch" menu,
select "Run batch file" to process your video:



After you select "Run batch file" a black DOS window will open showing your
encoding progress -- if you want to stop the encoding early, just close the DOS
box (you can do this if you'd like to preview an encoded sample of your file
without waiting 15 - 30 minutes for the full encode):



After the encoding is finished, the DOS box will not close automatically -- you will
know the encoding is done when you see a DOS prompt again in the window and
the counters will have stopped:



The resultant file should be a fully-compliant letterboxed SVCD file with the correct
top and bottom padding required to give you the correct aspect ratio based on the
dimensions of your source file.

Note, however, that I've only used this method to encode Full-D1 (720x480) and
Half-D1 (352x480) DVD-complaint files from 640x352 avi files, but this SHOULD
work the same for SVCD output.

Let me know if this works for you!

[johndeere]

Wow, so basically this will convert it directly from AVI to SVCD? How is it that this is so much quicker, than, say, AVI2DVD?

Also, any recommendations for a good, free tool to use to take the SVCD-compliant MPEG and split it into two discs and create disc images for burning?

[johndeere]

Hmm, I find that the video is compressed vertically... what is the formula for figuring out which numbers to use in that batch file? I should note that this particular video is 640x352. Also, the quality certainly seems to suffer more than when I convert using avi2dvd... is this just unavoidable using this tool?

[johndeere]

OK, sorry to keep posting without giving you a chance to respond, but I think that perhaps I solved this dilemma.

I took the output mpegs from avi2dvd, and used those as input into gui4ffmpeg. Since these are 16:9, I set the aspect to 16:9->4:3 (just selecting 4:3 results in an almost full-screen image). I left the settings in the batch file untouched (they defaulted to 480x360 with padding of 60). The output now looks correct -- no vertical or horizontal compression.

One thing I don't understand is why gui4ffmpeg tells me that the input resolution (of the MPEGs created with avi2dvd) is 480x480... shouldn't it be 480x360? When I play these MPEGs on the computer, there is no padding/letterbox/whatever (you can tell this from the video preview in Explorer).

Arrg... the more and more time I spend worrying about this, the more I feel like I'm going to go buy a DVD burner tomorrow.

[wulf109]

SVCD is 4:3 only,it is incompatible with 16:9 or 2.35:1. SVCD compatible DVD players will display as 4:3 by default. some DVD players will show it as 16:9 but it seems random the same disk that shows 16:9 will play 4:3 the next time I loaded it.
Look at the official SVCD spec it's a 4:3 format.

[johndeere]

Hmm... so maybe I should just suck it up and encode to VCD?

I really think I'm going to be buying a DVD burner in the very near future though... this all seems very futile. =)

[guns1inger]

VCD doesn't support 16:9 either. With a resolution that high, why not go DVD ?

[johndeere]

Simply because I don't have a DVD burner. And not having one is sheer laziness and stubborness. I'm ordering one for $30 before I go to bed tonight. Case closed.

[jbodin]

You won't regret getting a DVD burner -- I was living in the VCD/SVCD world until just a couple of months ago, and having a DVD burner has made the whole exercise of video capture and conversion a LOT more fun and rewarding. VCDs and SVCDs are okay for cartoons for the kids, but for TV shows and stuff that I want to watch and share with my family and friends, being able to convert this kind of stuff at DVD resolutions is GREAT.

FWIW, the if you want to convert 640x352 AVI files to properly-letterboxed Full-D1 resolution (full DVD resolution is 720x480) output once you DO get the DVD burner, you'll be able to do so following the method described above, BUT you will need to use 720x368 as the width/height settings in gui4ffmpeg and then use 56 for the top and bottom padding settings.

If you want to get more than 2 hours of video on a DVD, you can use Half-D1 resolution (which is 352x480), then use 352x368 as the width/height setting in gui4ffmpeg and then use 56 for the top and bottom padding values (this is the settings that I've been using to put together DVD copies of current cable TV shows for my own library, for example -- Half-D1 resolution looks very, VERY close to regular DVD quality, especially if your original source is a broadcast TV signal, for example).

[Cornucopia]

SVCD is 4:3 only,it is incompatible with 16:9 or 2.35:1. SVCD compatible DVD players will display as 4:3 by default. some DVD players will show it as 16:9 but it seems random the same disk that shows 16:9 will play 4:3 the next time I loaded it.
Look at the official SVCD spec it's a 4:3 format.

No, that's not true! SVCD can be either 4:3 or 16:9. It is in the spec, and it is quite simple to do. I have a set of 16:9 SVCD test discs.
Most players should play it correctly; if they don't, there may be other compatibility issues with SVCD anyway.
(**Note that VCD also can have a 16:9 PAR, but almost NO players support it because they don't know where to look for it--only Quicktime, IIRC--so one might as well say it can't)

I don't go for the 1button apps very often, so here's my method for something like this:

• (Vdub)
  Pad 640x352 --> 640x360
  Resize 640x360 --> 704x360
  Pad 704x360 --> 720x360
  Resize 720x360 --> 480x480
  frameserve to...
  
  (TMPGEnc)
  MPEG2480x480 Source and final rez
  16:9 NTSC PAR
  VideoArrangeMethod=Fullscreen
  Source Aspect Ratio can be anything (probably keep as VGA 1:1)

If you end up deciding to go DVD, you'll still want to handle the resize correctly before encoding.

Scott