Selling Original Videos

[Tyler2000]

There are probably a lot of professional for-profit video creators on this forum, so hopefully this is the right place to ask this question.

If a person wanted to create an original video, one where they would own all the copyrights to the music/content contained in the video, how much could they expect to charge for this video?

Say, you had a small business who wanted you to create a training video for them, would you charge for each VHS copy you gave them or is there usually a one-time fee, which might also give the copyrights to them?

If they purchased 1 copy of the video, but they made other copies on their own, how would you go about proving that they broke your copyright?

Is it true you can claim copyright to a video production without a lawyer or paperwork of any kind?

A lawyer would be able to answer these questions, but I'd like to hear from the experience of people who have gone through this process.

[ROF]

Whenever dealing with copyrights whether you plan to hold the copyrights or sell the copyrights to those who you produce material for I'd recommend retaining a lawyer and make sure all copyrights are clearly stated, signed, and certified by such a lawyer. In this way you can take or protect yourself from or against any legal action. The lawyer would also be knowledgeable about your business dealings as it relates to these copyrights and could relate first hand accounts of what transactions had happened in the past if you found it necessary to defend yourself or your copyrights.

Personally, I'd sell them an original and the copyrights. In this way you have been paid and the copyright holder can do as they please with the material you have provided.

[harley2ride]

Whenever dealing with copyrights whether you plan to hold the copyrights or sell the copyrights to those who you produce material for I'd recommend retaining a lawyer and make sure all copyrights are clearly stated, signed, and certified by such a lawyer. In this way you can take or protect yourself from or against any legal action. The lawyer would also be knowledgeable about your business dealings as it relates to these copyrights and could relate first hand accounts of what transactions had happened in the past if you found it necessary to defend yourself or your copyrights.

Personally, I'd sell them an original and the copyrights. In this way you have been paid and the copyright holder can do as they please with the material you have provided.

I so agree with that... I would make a deal to produce a master copy, and sell them that with the copyrights for a predefined fee. Then if they want additional copies, and you have a source that can do it for a better deal than they can get, I would negotiate that separately...

[daamon]

@ Tyler2000: A friend and I are looking at going into pairing up and doing wedding videos and photos between us.

We've discussed this very subject and, like those above, feel it's best to get paid for the entire project and an(y) initial copy(ies) and hand these over saying "It's all yours, do with it as you will".

You may include a phrase saying that you retain the right to use part or all of any project as promotional material - i.e. building a portfolio of work for future clients to assess you by. A lawyer may or may not be required for this.

You have to balance the income from a project against the expense of getting a lawyer to initially set up your copyright clauses, then running the risk of being landed with the bill of a copyright breach lawsuit going against you.

Then there's the burden of proof, which implies that you are somehow going to police how your copyrighted assets are used - not to mention the hassle and impact to your time of such a lawsuit. Time, if you're in business for yourself, that you can ill afford to lose...

To me, copyrights are better suited to larger companies who are going to be selling to the masses. Doing a few weddings / training videos / seminars etc. isn't in the same league - it's not like you're going to lose out on millions if they make a few copies.

You could provide an additional service (for a one-off fee), and retain a master copy in the event that theirs is lost or damaged. From this they will get a perfect replica of the original - contents on disc, printed disc, printed case insert etc. You'll need to store not only the disc contents, but all images used to produce the final article.

That's my thoughts... Holpe it helps.

[adam]

You don't need a lawyer to register your copyright, in fact, there's really nothing they can even do for you. You gain your copyright automatically in the US just by creating the work. To get full protection you must register it but all you have to do is fill out a very simple form and pay $30. Go to the US copyright office's homepage and read their circular and just follow the instructions. I am an attorney and do substantial copyright work, but when someone like yourself comes into my office I tell them the exact same thing. Do it yourself, its no more complicated then paying your bills.

Some steps to take for full protection are to include a copyright notice on your work and the words ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. This will protect you in most countries outside of the US.

Do not contract to sell your copyright along with the work. I am sorry but that is terrible advice and something that is simply never done. If you want to grant wide latitude to copy or edit the work then you allow that in the license. If you go assigning your copyrights to others and continue making similar types of productions then you are going to find yourself getting sued for infringing on your own works.

There's no good way to police copyrights when you license the work for private commercial use. So just negotiate a fair deal for yourself and use common sense. If they are a large company they are probably going to need more than 5 copies of the work, so don't let them push the price down by limiting quantity. When you license software you typically license them a certain number of copies each with their own separate license but with identical terms. Do NOT sell all rights to the work for a fixed price, make them purchase a license agreement from you. Now if you plan to do large numbers of works like this then a lawyer may be beneficial to retain so that you can get some help drafting your licenses but you can also just purchase form books with typical licenses.

One more thing to note, because it wasn't entirely clear from your post, if you are an employee of the company that you are developing the work for than in most cases the company will own the copyright of any work that you develop. You need to do the work on your own time or contract to do the work and expressly agree that you will be the copyright holder...and you need to make such a contract before you create the work.

[Nelson37]

Price determined by what the market will bear. If the video is only useful to the original customer, then ALL expenses AND profit must be paid by that customer. If the video has a wider market, then the first customer should be charged standard retail. What that price should be has no possible correct answer. Best guess would be to survey several potential customers and ask what they would pay to have their employees trained and knowledgable in whatever the video subject is.
Also check what similar products sell for. Using an actual human trainer or teacher may be preferable, for both buyer and seller.

Some similar products are sold with a company site license. One I am familiar with gave unlimited rights to reproduce as long as usage was within the "same contigous office complex". Format change, even basic editing was allowed, as long as content was not changed. The company even gave permission to re-encode their DVD to SVCD, this instance of logal copying of a copyrighted DVD was discussed here long ago.

[Tyler2000]

Thanks for all your opinions. One thing I forget to mention is that I am talking about U.S. copyright laws.

I realize that setting a price can vary a lot. Finding out what a human trainer would cost sounds like a good measure of what a training video could cost.

I'd like to hear from people who have actually sold their training/weddings/seminars/whatever videos and what they charged per video.

[daamon]

I'd like to hear from people who have actually sold their training/weddings/seminars/whatever videos and what they charged per video.

While this will provide some guidance, it may not be as useful as you think it could be. Here's why:

1) Local markets / demand will be different - meaning that someone's price in New York City could be markedly different to someone else's price in Florida, or Texas, or Seattle.

2) This is a global website - what I sell my wedding videos for (if I were to sell them, still building a portfolio) has no relation to what price you could, because of the same reason as in 1, above.

3) Your personal financial needs and consideration of financial self-worth are different to other people.

4) Number 3 also ties in with how you compare to the opposition in terms of quality and speed of delivery of the end product.

5) What market are you aiming for? The people who don't mind a basic job at a low price, or an organisation which are expecting a work of art and don't mind paying for it? Or somewhere in between? Just look at how many different types of DVD+/-R there are - there's quality that you pay for, and there's cheap stuff where you expect the odd bad disc.


A better approach is to define a model - there's two main ones, and you can have one, the other or both. These are:

A) "Time and materials" - This is where you say to the client that they'll pay for your time and any materials that are used. Your time is normally calculated on either an hourly or daily rate.

If it's a complex job and takes longer, you'll end up charging more. If it's quick and easy, the client doesn't pay over the odds.

The downside is that the client does not know how much, exactly, they're going to be paying until they get the bill.

B) "Fixed Cost" - This is where you agree a figure with the client up front and, no matter what, this is what they pay when the end product is delivered. You need to be very comfortable with your estimation skills as to how long it's going to take and the cost of materials that you're going to use.

The advantage is that, if you do it quicker then you're effectively getting more per hour and you can also start on something else sooner.

I hope that gives you something to think about... Good luck!

[Nelson37]

If you go with item B, make absolutely certain you and the client are EXTREMELY CLEAR on what the project will consist of, and that NO CHANGES from this original spec will be made without significant cost penalties. Otherwise you wil be held hostage to their whim of the moment, and you will be constantly re-creating the project.

If you will be marketing to a broader market, you must regularly re-evaluate your market and competition, and also constantly remind yourself how much actual money you have in hand, right now. Chasing the rainbow can become very seductive.

[InXess]

You are neither the only nor the first one to offer such services. Why reinvent the wheel? Call local business like yours and ask them for a quote. You're not in a vacuum, these are the businesses you'll be competing against so it doesn't matter what guys from outside your area think. Different prices will apply to the same work in Manhattan and rural Dakota unless you're marketing to the whole country (internet(?)).

[thecoalman]

Trouble with setting a price is as mentioned above what the market will bear and is it worth it to you and the consumer... Unfortunatley many shop by price alone. Many times I've seen where people are offering Weddings for $1000 but then show up with there HandiCam they purchased at Wal-Mart. Personally I won't even put my name anywhere near a product like that even if it means I'm not making any money.

Just for example I get frequent requests for VHS>DVD tansfers and the first thing I ask them is what kind of shape the tapes are in. If the answer is superb then I tell them to go buy a DVD recorder as it's not worth it for me or them. I can't charge enough for the time. On the other hand if the tapes are in poor quality or they want extensive editing and authoring work then it is worth it because i can charge what I want.