Why don't Manufactuers make Camcorers that can take Full size DVDs?

[peggypwr1]

Hello, how come manufactures don't make camcorders that can take full size DVDs?
Regular size DVDs are a lot cheaper than minidvds and would probably win over more consumers if they can use full size media that can take 2 hours in sp mode for less money.

[zoobie]

thought they just came out with these...or maybe the removable hd?

[BJ_M]

using dvd's of any size in a camcorder is the dumbest thing ive ever seen just about

[kschang]

Mainly because spinning media can't be made as shockproof as tape or solid state media. MiniDVD was the compromise they came up with.

[BJ_M]

solid state media is pretty shockproof - used high G military applications daily ...

tape is used in ENG for many years and can handle rough service

[BobK]

Probably the same reason they pretty much quit making camcorders that took full size VHS video tape when they came out with smaller video tape. Because most people don't want a big studio size camera to haul around on vacation.

[BSpielbauer]

Hello, how come manufactures don't make camcorders that can take full size DVDs?
Regular size DVDs are a lot cheaper than minidvds and would probably win over more consumers if they can use full size media that can take 2 hours in sp mode for less money.

Short answer -- because the manufacturers are convinced that the market wants their camcorders to be as tiny as possible. The general public seems willing to sacrifice storage space (the total amount that can be stored before a re-load is required) for size. They want the entire apparatus to fit into the palm of their hand. If possible, they would like to be able to work with units that are even smaller. The typical consumer in the store is not as worried about whether that disc will hold one hour, or two, or three, with a high quality image. The typical consumer is not as worried about the final image quality, even in this era of a transition to high definition TV. The typical consumer would like to be able to stuff the entire thing in a shirt pocket -- if such a device were available, and everything else be damned.

Sorry if I sound overly cynical. I am honestly just trying to answer the question, as asked.

By the way, I believe there are now a few camcorders on the market that record on a "standard size" DVD. The reviews I have read indicate that the quality is still one step below that of the clunky mini DV tape models, at least for most of the models available.

-Bruce

[FulciLives]

If you really want a camcorder that captures MPEG-2 DVD spec then you are probably better off with the models that have a built-in HDD since you don't have to worry about discs getting scratched or stability issues like the disc getting screwed up from rough handling of the camcorder etc.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[jagabo]

I want to know why they don't make camcorders with removable standard 2.5 inch laptop hard drives. A 120GB drive would hold 9 hours of full DV. Just pop the cartridge out and drop it in a firewire cradle on your PC. The disk cartridge wouldn't be much bigger than a DV tape and its drive.

[edDV]

Here are two glimpses at high end tech that may soon show up in consumer camcorders.

Panasonic P2 cards in PC Card package

https://eww.pavc.panasonic.co.jp/pro-av/sales_o/p2/p2cam_spc700/index.html
http://www.dvxuser.com/articles/HVX200/


Sony's XDCAM (Blu-Ray erasable optical)

http://www.engadget.com/2005/10/15/sonys-xdcam-hd-records-to-blu-ray/
http://xdcam.com.au/modules/news/

[kschang]

I want to know why they don't make camcorders with removable standard 2.5 inch laptop hard drives. A 120GB drive would hold 9 hours of full DV. Just pop the cartridge out and drop it in a firewire cradle on your PC. The disk cartridge wouldn't be much bigger than a DV tape and its drive.

Size and shock factor, I think. Though wasn't that "liquid-filled" HD supposed to solve that problem? Hmmm... Or was it more about power? HD must be spun constantly esp. in use, and the power requirements are kinda weird for a handheld device (I doubt those cells produce even 5 volts?)

On the other hand, with firewire and USB2 HD's, it should be possible to basically hookup an external HD with a minimal copy logic and battery power to download all the stuff you filmed in a DV camera, kinda like the HD'based "image vault" they have nowadays for digital cameras... Hmmm... Or perhaps there's no margin in this and they make multimedia viewers instead?

[edDV]

...

On the other hand, with firewire and USB2 HD's, it should be possible to basically hookup an external HD with a minimal copy logic and battery power to download all the stuff you filmed in a DV camera, kinda like the HD'based "image vault" they have nowadays for digital cameras... Hmmm... Or perhaps there's no margin in this and they make multimedia viewers instead?

Been done. See the Focus Firestore FS4

http://www.videoguys.com/FireStore.html

[lordsmurf]

using dvd's of any size in a camcorder is the dumbest thing ive ever seen just about

Same here.

DVD is a final product format, so pretty much anything made on this recorder will be inferior quality after editing. I guess it's good for somebody who never wants to edit.

[kschang]

I thought he's talking about the DATA format though, not the video format... But I could be just having some wishful thinking.

[edDV]

I agree DVD camcorders are a sham and a fraud

sham n.
1. Something false or empty that is purported to be genuine; a spurious imitation.
2. The quality of deceitfulness; empty pretense.

But I'm not sure optical technology should be overlooked.

The Blu-Ray XDCAM erasable optical disc records in DV (format or variations of Sony's IMX (MPeg2-Iframe editable) format. So long as it holds up to robust handling, I can't think of any other objection to it.

Currently the 23GB single layer erasable disc's handle 85 minutes of DVCAM or various bitrates of IMX MPeg2 including HD resolutions.

The blank 23GB Blu-Ray erasable discs currently sell for $29. Compare that to 8GB P2 parallel flash cards at $1400.

By the time this tech is ready for primetime prosumer, prices will converge.

Panasonic HVX-200 ($6,000) P2 Card or DV tape




Sony XDCAM PDW-530 ($27,000)

[handyguy]

" Just pop the cartridge out and drop it in a firewire cradle on your PC. The disk cartridge wouldn't be much bigger than a DV tape and its drive. "

They make them with dvdram diskdrives, these are pretty much small 4 gig hds.

[jagabo]

" Just pop the cartridge out and drop it in a firewire cradle on your PC. The disk cartridge wouldn't be much bigger than a DV tape and its drive. "

They make them with dvdram diskdrives, these are pretty much small 4 gig hds.

But that's only 20 minutes of SD DV. And the ones I've seen, like the mini DVD-R/w camcorders, record in MPEG format.