29,97 -> 25 fps convertion everytime went wrong

[Sonny001]

Hello Guys!

I'm living in a PAL region and also have a PAL dvd system. Now I have a 29,97 avi and wanted to convert it into 25fps. The problem is that every method I used went wrong. Always the audio is out of sync

When I change the video into 25 fps with vdmod and the audio into 25fps with besweet/ac3machine (I tried MP2/MP3/AC3 audio), and merge it with vdmod or nandub, everytime the audio is out of sync..

Also when I try to convert the the 29,97 avi into DVD PAL with Mainconcept Mpeg Encoder or diko, the audio is out of sync

Does somebody has got the succesfull method how to change a 29,97 file into 25fps without syncproblems??

Thnx for the help!!

[e404pnf]

Hi Sonny

Most DVD players in Europe will play both PAL and NTSC DVDs. Try just converting from AVI -> DVD without the fps conversion, I'd be suprised if it didn't work.

- e440pnf

[Cunhambebe]

As far as I know, if you convert your AVI to a regular 29.97 MPEG2 file and then author a DVD, watching this DVD on a computer won't make any difference since PC DVD drivers play both NTSC and PAL or even PAL-M and PAL-N systems. I guess the same thing would happen to your player. I've read a lot of posts around here that the players have regions but nor systems. That means, in thesis, your player would be able to play an NTSC DVD - so it will all depend on your TV set. On the other hand, as e404pnf has just said, most DVD players in Europe are able to play both PAL and NTSC systems - and I guess the same thing happens with regular TV sets in Europe.
Now, if you really want to make this conversion, think about this: if your AVI is at 29,97 and if it was rendered with something called pulldown (NTSC Film) you can IVTC (inverse telecine) from 29,97 to 23,96 fps. This way, you'll be so much closer to PAL's 25 fps and then it will be easier to fix sync problems. If you want, please search all of my posts since about 4 months ago we've had many discussions on this subject here at VideoHelp.
Cheers!

[Abond]

The pulldown doesn't apply to avi. It is mpeg2 feature.
That means that you will have hard time trying to convert 29.97 to 25. I would try to find another solution.

[Sonny001]

Most DVD players in Europe will play both PAL and NTSC DVDs. Try just converting from AVI -> DVD without the fps conversion, I'd be suprised if it didn't work.

I just convert the source 29,97 avi into 29,97 NTSC dvd with Mainconcept Mpeg Encoder. But again after about 20 minutes I had syncproblems . Approx. 1 sec (first audio and 1 sec later video appears). Exactly the same as when I choose PAL as output format in mainconcept. How is this possible? I selected the same framerate... .

The syncproblem appears in every situation. It doesn't matter if I convert the source 29,97 avi into 23,97 , 25 or 29,97 fps, every time I get the same syncproblem . Do I maybe have to convert the 29,97 avi into DVD with another encoderprog??

Now, if you really want to make this conversion, think about this: if your AVI is at 29,97 and if it was rendered with something called pulldown (NTSC Film) you can IVTC (inverse telecine) from 29,97 to 23,96 fps.

I've also tried this method. I choose 'Reconstruct from fields' - adaptive' in vdmod and created a 23,97 avi. This avi didn't had syncproblems. So I thought it would be easy now to convert this file into DVD file without syncprobs, but also after conversion (with mainconcept) into output 23,97 or 25 fps DVD, the outputfile had syncproblems!!

What do I have to do now? ? I just want to get a DVD file without syncproblems. It doesn't matter if the outputfile is NTSC or PAL....

thnx again!

[e404pnf]

Have you tried playing the film as an avi without any conversion on your computer? Do you still get the sync problem? If so its not the conversion that is causing the problem.

Also, just out of curiosity try using VSO DivX to DVD? This is a one click solution and pre- v.0.6 is free. Most folk that are more experienced at format conversions don't like these one click solutions preferring to having more control of the whole process. (But I'm neither that experienced or in favour of making life more complicated than necessary )
Then use ImgTools Classic to create an ISO of your files and burn with DVD Decryptor.

- e404pnf

[Sonny001]

Have you tried playing the film as an avi without any conversion on your computer? Do you still get the sync problem? If so its not the conversion that is causing the problem.

Yes, the avi plays perfect on my pc. No sync problems. I also have converted the 29,97 avi into a 23,97 avi by means of selecting 'Reconstruct from fields' - adaptive' in vdmod, and this created 23,97 file didn't had syncproblems...But also when I convert this file into a 23,97 dvd or 25 fps dvd file, suddenly the syncproblems are back

Maybe interesting to tell: Everytime I extract the audio out of the avi file with vdmod, the extracted wav file is 2 sec shorter than the avi...

So summaring: How can I convert the 29,97 avi into 29,97 or 25 fps DVD file(s)?? Using the tool VSO DivX to DVD should not help the syncproblem I think, this bacause I used many all in one progs like this without good results

[GreyDeath]

Are you sure the AVI is actually 29.97? Most that I come across on the web are actually 23.96. Use GSpot to see what frame rate it actually is.

If you have a 23.97fps m2v file, you can try using DGPulldown to make it 25fps. It seems to be a really handy tool that just changes the fps flags on the file so it plays without any jitter or stuttering in the video.

If you use this solution, the audio has to be encoded at the original framerate of the file your pulling down. I know it works for going from 25 to 29.97. In DGPulldown, there is a custom setting, I wonder if you can just take a 29.97fps m2v file and pull it down to 25fps... hmmm....

[Cunhambebe]

The pulldown doesn't apply to avi. It is mpeg2 feature.
That means that you will have hard time trying to convert 29.97 to 25. I would try to find another solution.

OK, trial and error, trial and error.....Let me suggest you do something...will you?! What about rendering this AVI to MPEG2 and then re-rendering again as IVTC to 23,97? - OK, sorry I'mjust guessing here, but maybe it works...
You can also try this: you can burn a data CD or a data DVD (assuming that this AVI is a container with an MPEG4) and find a player that is compatible with this kind of file. If you have Sony Vegas Video Editor, you can drop the AVI in the timeline and then try to find out a solution to fix this problem.

[Sonny001]

Thanxx for the reactions guys! I think I know what's the cause (encountered accidentally )

I noticed a bad part in the (source) movie when I saw the first 20 minutes. After about 17 minutes the video deformed in all kinds of colors , and the audio cracked and moaned . Duration of this all was only a few seconds. Striking to this is that before the error there were no syncproblems in the converted dvd file, and immediately after the bad part the audio was out of sync!! In the source file there were NO syncproblems after the error. Here a shot:



So, can I conclude that the avi file is corrupt and that there is no other way then throwing away this file?? Or could it be something else, because the source file didn't have syncproblems after the bad part? I hope somebody confirms the first

[GreyDeath]

Maybe you can just edit out the bad part. You might be losing some material there, but if it's corrupted, there's nothing there to encode anyways... Just make sure your audio is edited in the same way.

[Sonny001]

Ok, is there an easy way to edit out the bad part? I didn't do this before . How can I do this?

Thnx!

[Cunhambebe]

I'm not sure if this is really causing this problem. If I were you I would burn a data CD or a data DVD (RW) with your AVI file and find a DVD player that is compatible with this kind of file to find out if the problem is really this one.
Cheers!

[GreyDeath]

For Editing, I thought Virtual dub could edit stuff out. If not, you can try to use TMPGEnc.

And I must amend my praise of DGPulldown. I just created an Anime DVD with files made with TMPGEnc at 23.976fps, then used DGPulldown to make it 29.97. It came out with the same stuttering during pans like TMPGEnc's own 2-3 Pulldown. Sigh, Back to Vegas for smooth pulldowns.

But for PAL to NTSC conversion DGPulldown works beautifully.

[Sonny001]

Ok guys, thnx for the help!! I will use vdmod to edit stuff out...

See you!
Grtz!!