DVD Shrink or TMPGEnc

[Craig Tucker]

OK How does DVD shrink actually work, for it to reduce a video in size surely it has to re-encode it. If this is the case how would it compare to re-encoding with TMPGEnc.

[MOVIEGEEK]

Are you serious Craig?

[Treebeard]

Are you feeling ok ??

[adam]

TMPGenc encodes, DVDShrink transcodes. That's why TMPGEnc takes much longer but provides much higher quality, while DVDShrink is very fast but produces a lower quality image.

Check out these threads for more info.

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=198761&highlight=

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=198436&highlight=

[Craig Tucker]

Thanks adam for the links.

Yes I was serious, I have never been interested in DVD ripping and have only ever ripped one DVD to VCD about 2 years ago just to see how it was done. Have never done a DVD-DVD rip.

I have read a lot of people raving about DVD shrink and was curious as to how it could do the job so quickly and still retain good picture quality. So to maintain the best possible quality you would still encode with tmpgenc, etc.

So what would be the maximum movie size that you guys would be happy to use DVDshrink on rather than re-encode with tmpgenc. At what point is the quality reduction not acceptable to you.

[MOVIEGEEK]

"At what point is the quality reduction not acceptable to you"

65% compression with DVDshrink for me,I guess the larger the tv you have the more noticable it is.

[johns0]

It also depends on the type of movie,a fast action movie would need at least 70% while slow moving talkies could get down to 55% compression.

[The-Witchking]

Personally, I've seen some movies go down to about 60%. These are movies such as Toy Story, and Finding Nemo, which are highly digital, animated movies. Still pretty damn good quality, viewed on a 52" flatscreen HDTV. Not bad at all.

Quality all depends on your personal preference. As I said, personally, I'm damned picky.

Oh, yeah, also, the quality only retains it's greatness when transcoded using "Deep Analysis", otherwise known as "Multipass VBR" in TMPGEnc. Deep Analysis, WITH encoding takes ABOUT an hour, and the quality is damn amazing. Try it out for yourself, Craig, see what it's all about.

[Jukka]

Craig,

don't take offence at these questions but:

1) you are a mod here, how have you never heard of transcoding?
2) if you have only ripped one DVD what do you use this site for?

I have seen you give good advice on lots of things here (I'm sure DVD encoding, etc. included) and you seem to be a good mod so keep up the good work.

Jukka

[macleod]

do a search You damn newbies

[adam]

Well I wouldn't equate deep analysis to 2-pass VBR, they are really doing two totally different things but I guess in function they are somewhat similar just in that they scan the whole source before doing any processing, so as to gather certain types of information. But the information gathered is fundamentally different, and used in fundamentally different ways

Anyway, as always there are LOTS of variables to consider. Encoding and Transcoding, when used to decreaes filesize, are both predicated on the same thing. We want to try to throw out information, but hopefully not notice that we have lost it. So really the most important factor is how much information we have in the first place. If we are talking about a 2.5 hr movie than we have a lot of content using a little bit of information to represent it. If we are talking about a 90 minute movie at a high bitrate, we are going to have alot more superfluous information that we can hopefully lose and not notice it.

So really, in my opinion, the ultimate factor is the source's bitrate. If it is very high, then we can lower it alot without noticing much. If it is low to begin with, then even a very small amount of added compression might be noticable. Basically your results are going to vary from one DVD to the next, but any amount of heavy compression is probably going to be very noticable with a transcoder, yet may not be noticable at all with an encoder.

[Craig Tucker]

Craig,

don't take offence at these questions but:

1) you are a mod here, how have you never heard of transcoding?
2) if you have only ripped one DVD what do you use this site for?

I have seen you give good advice on lots of things here (I'm sure DVD encoding, etc. included) and you seem to be a good mod so keep up the good work.

Jukka

There are 33 forums here and only 2 of them are to do with DVD ripping. Mod or not, I can not , nor will pretend to know everything there is about video. I also know nothing about macs, so I don't post in that forum much either.

A lot of people use this site for home movies and video capture, VCD, SVCD and DVD conversion and authoring (these are the areas where I can help most, as well as posting alot of crap in off topic). There is a lot more to this site than simply backing up DVD's
No offence taken

[aklendathu]

I prefer to use DVDShrink as it is much faster than TMPEGenc and it also has the advantage of allowing to keep the menus. I use deep scan if the amount of compression is substantial (to less than 80%, say) and also keep only the movie plus one audio and one or two subtitles (DVD a la carte ). DVDshrink does something similar to the older ReMPeg, but is much easier to use.

Nero Recode 2 has basically the same functionality as DVDshrink but allow keeping just the menus you want (you can suppress the others, replacing them by a blank image or an image of your choice). However, it's not free

TMPEGenc is great for encoding but 2-pass VBR takes quite a long time even on a fast CPU. If you have to compress a lot, quality will suffer.
However, I've had some problems with IFOEdit templates when the DVD has interlaced video, as the GOPs output then refer to fields, not frames. On top of that, the numbering gets screwed up.

I suppose the rule should be "If you can't see the difference, why worry about it? - use the faster and simpler method."

Just adding my €0.02,

Pedro

[SatStorm]

Back up a DVD is a total different thing than encoding.

When I back up one of my DVDs, I strip it from extra audios it might have (etc: French, spain, italian...) and all the extras I 'm not interest to keep (lot of extras exist only for the cover). Also, I apply different compression to different sections of the disc, so to manage the least possible compression to the main movie. For example, I don't keep animation menus, I set them to act as a slide show. Only this setting is about 200MB more in my disc, which may look little, but actually is lot! Doing it that way, the movie ends up at most 6.0GB, which with deep analysis with dvdshrink, looks pretty damn good on anything I watch it.

IMHO, all those who complain about those programs (Dvd2one like), complain 'cause they don't want really to backup something they own. They wish to copy a movie they rent. They need to keep anything from the source disc, 'cause they don't have the time to search and decide what they want to watch more often, so to back it up . This is the sad true.

Personally, I rarelly back up "as is" my DVDs. I prefer to rip them and do collections with them: 2 - 3 movies in one disc for example. So, I mostly re-encode them. For example, my babylon 5 collection, I imported from US and Germany: I ripped the discs of the box set, re-encode the episodes to 1/2 D1 and now I have all the episodes, without the extras, on 2 discs! Perfect quality that way, so to watch them frequently, without warring about the originals I keep safe to my selve.
Also, I riped all the cartoons from my Looney Toons Golden Edition (there are 56 of them, fully restored and uncencored), re-encode them to 1/2D1 after I converted them to PAL, and I have them now all in one DVD-R, in a chronogical order, so to watch them from there. I did the same with all the extras I wanted to have, in another DVD-R. The original Box Set, is now shield in a Bank safe shell. A treasure like this, must be safe from bad people like kids, wifes, parents, pets or the bad moment you may have

@Jukka: Seems like you misunderstoon this forum...
This forum, is not about backup and copy DVDs. This is only a small, minority subject. This forum focus to the video enthusiasts of a complicated hobbie: Video proccessing as a whole. Some, convert VHS to DVDRs. Others, convert home movies to DVD-Rs. Many users, convert various formats, to VCD, SVCD, CVD, DVD. Example: You buy a CD single which has the video to mov (quicktime). You convert it to mpeg 2 so to watch it to your DVD. You have the right to do it, why not to?
Just to think about it!