6+ Hours Of MPEG2?

[NiVZ]

Hi folks,

I've been messing around converting files to MPEG-1 and burning to DVD+R so that I can fit around 6hrs 30mins onto 1 DVD+R disc. This works fine on players that can play VCD.

Unfortunately some of my friends players refuse to play these (they can't play VCD either), so I'm about to start experimenting with MPEG-2, but I still want to put around 6 hours onto the disc.

My plan is to use TMPGENC to encode to MPEG-2 with the following settings:

MPEG-2 352x288 25fps
2-pass VBR (Max 8000 Avg 1150 Min 450) or CBR 1150
Audio MP2 48KHz 224kbps

In TMPGENC it says that it will use 10MB per minute, the same as I use for my MPEG-1 files.

I'll be trying this as soon as I get a chance - I know the quality will suck, but the videos are low quality anyway and I'm going for quantity over quality.

Just wondered if anyone has tried this or had any suggestions?
Cheers,

NiVZ.

[jmz28]

www.kvcd.net

check out the kdvd template...you wont lose quality but you will gain more recording time.

[Xtasy2002]

kvcd is rubbish stick with what you were originally going to do

[jmz28]

kvcd is rubbish stick with what you were originally going to do

um...nice retort...what exactly is the problem with the kdvd template?

You surely must be able to back up your comment with something useful...

These templates are great...I have used them on several occasions...

and with your very careful reading, you would notice that I said "KDVD" template, not kvcd....

kvcd has compatibility problems in some low end and high end players, it is not the best for "all-around compatibility", however, KDVD should work in any dvd player.

[SLK001]

352x288 is not a valid MPEG2 resolution for DVD. You'll have to use 352x576.

MPEG1 @ 352x288 is a valid DVD resolution. Your friends' players should have played them.

[steptoe]

I can verify that it is possible to fit over 6 hours of stuff onto a DVD-R, I use that exact method to squeeze some multiple MPEGs onto one DVD

I managed to quite easily fit series 1+2 and series 3+4 of Black Adder onto 2 DVD's, plus fitted the entire series of The Young Ones onto a single DVD, all 12 episodes

If each episode is about 30-35 minutes then its quite possible, just, to fit around 12 episodes per DVD, but you'll have to use MPEG1

If you use any decent MPEG encoder, and there is a video option, simply set this to VCD, and thats it



The best settings and methods I have found, it to make sure that the audio is extracted first, I use VirtualDub, save it as a WAV, then using dbPowerAmp convert them all to 48000, 224bit stereo, WAV. Just to make sure its all the same, as some DVD authoring software will try to recode the audio track to DVD compliant, if it isn't

Load up your MPEG encoder, and set it as VCD output, using the audio tracks that you extracted for each MPEG you intend to encode

Why ?? Becuase some encoders winge that there is no audio track, so having a separate one gurantees it will find it, plus I think it doesn't have to work as hard trying to extract the audio and the video stream from the source, before encoding it as a VCD stream, all on the fly

For creating the DVD's, I was using ULead DVD MovieFactory, but currently I'm using TMPGenc DVD Author, but it does mean you'll need another piece of software to burn the DVD, I use Nero, mainly as I got sick and fed up of MovieFactory 2 forcing a re-encode regardless of what settings I used and tried, so gave up. TMPGenc DVD Author is pretty simple, and I like using it now, if they improve the menus and chapters it will be even better

These are just MY persoanal preferences

[jmz28]

KDVD will allow you to still get dvd resolution, or half d1, and fit anywhere from 6-10 hours. You just load the template into TMPGenc, and it makes the necessary changes to encode a dvd compliant mpeg2 file. The quality is outstanding.

[kwag]

(1) 352x240(288) is a valid MPEG-2 DVD compliant resolution. Panasonic DMR-E20 DVD recorders (and others brands ) record at that resolution on their "long play" mode. The DVDs recorded in this mode play back on every standalone DVD player.
(2) ~6 hours Full D-1 + Full DVD compliant on a DVD is a piece of cake!. Use KDVD Full D-1 templates, which are set specifically for that. Sample MPEG-2 here: http://www.kvcd.net/kdvd-v2-sample.m2v
Templates here: www.kvcd.net/dvd-models

Edit: You can achieve ~18 hours on a DVD-R using KDVD templates, just by changing the resolution to 352x240(288) Just make sure you use file size prediction: http://www.kvcd.net/forum/viewforum.php?f=27

-kwag

[steptoe]

See my recent post about VCD authoring, this will explain how to set-up Canopus Procoder to use MPEG2 VCD, which will quite easily fit 6 hours onto a single DVD

I've just done another batch encode, ready to burn a DVD with the entire Fawlty Towers, series 1 and 2, onto a single DVD

[txpharoah]

I've got an AverMedia EZ DVD Maker card (yes, huge piece of crap, just my backup toy) and the NeoDVD4 software it came with can dump about 5 hours of 352x240 MPEG2 onto a DVD-R. It's a little better than VCD, but not by much.

Are you really that hard up for money or time that you cannot buy 2-3 discs instead of just 1? Quality WILL suffer.

[kwag]

Are you really that hard up for money or time that you cannot buy 2-3 discs instead of just 1? Quality WILL suffer.

Did you really take a look at the sample I posted
Because that's the way 6 hours look on a DVD-R
I wouldn't say that "Quality suffers", after seing that sample

-kwag

[txpharoah]

Did you really take a look at the sample I posted
Because that's the way 6 hours look on a DVD-R
I wouldn't say that "Quality suffers", after seing that sample
-kwag

Not at first no, but I just did. Your sample is VERY slow and VERY dark, and it's got jerky playback on my system. Not a true test.

I'll give it a try, but I have my doubts.

UPDATE! Your template settings are useless on non-DVD rips. I guess if you made them to rip several movies to one disc, then great. But not much good beyond that. Plus your matrix made my encode time triple.

[jmz28]

Did you really take a look at the sample I posted
Because that's the way 6 hours look on a DVD-R
I wouldn't say that "Quality suffers", after seing that sample
-kwag

Not at first no, but I just did. Your sample is VERY slow and VERY dark, and it's got jerky playback on my system. Not a true test.

I'll give it a try, but I have my doubts.

UPDATE! Your template settings are useless on non-DVD rips. I guess if you made them to rip several movies to one disc, then great. But not much good beyond that. Plus your matrix made my encode time triple.

...although there is no doubt that the template took longer to encode (uh...more compression techniques), playing slow on just your computer is not a very useful test. If it plays in a standalone, that is the desired endresult.

What makes the template not good for non-dvd rips? you didnt really elaborate...(I have read several of your posts, I know how you like to elaborate )

[NiVZ]

Thanks for all the replies.

Have downloaded the KDVD and KVCD templates to have a look at.

Noticed a couple of strange things with them though:

1. Why do none of the templates have sound? Do you do the video and audio seperate and then re-multiplex?

2. Why is the number of P pictures in GOP always 5823 in the templates? Isn't that awfully high?

Thanks,

NiVZ

[jmz28]

Thanks for all the replies.

Have downloaded the KDVD and KVCD templates to have a look at.

Noticed a couple of strange things with them though:

1. Why do none of the templates have sound? Do you do the video and audio seperate and then re-multiplex?

2. Why is the number of P pictures in GOP always 5823 in the templates? Isn't that awfully high?

Thanks,

NiVZ

kwag has his own forum available there, or you might try to "pm" him...he is very helpful.

[curryman]

yeh! i noticed kwags templates have no sound, don't know if it was a mistake on his part or not but it's easily overcome
load kwag template and then load "unlock" template which is found in the extra folder and select "system(video+audio) in the stream type

[Mordant]

The KVCD/DVD templates have no sound because their method involves doing the audio with headac3he and then muxing with BBmpeg.

You should go to www.kvcd.net and download moviestacker and Tok, with these two programs doing kvcd becomes very easy.

KVCD does really well with 1 disc movie encodes, not as good (I would say) as doing 2 discs, but it all depends on what you want.

KDVD works very well. I did a 1 DVD conversion of LotR extended (2DVDs) at full resolution and it came out very well. Looking very very closely at my TV screen I could see some flatness (loss of detail) but not something you would notice while watching the film. Lent it to a friend who noticed nothing...in fact he commented on how great the picture looked. And its very nice not to have to get up in the middle of that film and change discs.

[jmz28]

kvcd is rubbish stick with what you were originally going to do

sorry guys, but I still dont get this dude...

[vhelp]

hi guys..

@ Mordant,

KDVD works very well. I did a 1 DVD conversion of LotR extended (2DVDs) at full resolution and it came out very well. Looking very very closely at my TV screen I could see some flatness (loss of detail) but not something you would notice while watching the film. Lent it to a friend who noticed nothing...in fact he commented on how great the picture looked. And its very nice not to have to get up in the middle of that film and change discs.

..that's the ticket. You see, we have become SOOOO judgementtal in our
quality guideline, that we became TOOOOO judgemental. We've become
way too picky about every little thing that we see, that when someone
else shows a better way w/ equal comprimises, we gotta blow them away.
Rubbish, I say !!
Kwag seems to be the only one that as learned how to control his
judging. His latest sample clip (see above) proves it. In looking at that
sample, I could see no artifacts during play (from a newbie POV) BUT, if
I'm LOOKING for it, I'll find it (artifacts) no matter what. Heck, I can
spot plenty in my encodes too. But, I have to lay down my anal-retentive
judging, and relax !! bada-bing !! ..oh, and ENJOY the movie.

@ Mordant.. you are correct in your experience

What I wish for in todays' visits here on this fun FORUM, is to see where
others' share their templates and settings and configs, and NOT be scorned
because they are Jelious or something ? Well, anyways..

It's possible to fit 6+ hours of good quality video on a DVD-R disk. You just
gotta be willing to work and test on your own, for your given writer and
your given encoding abilities, techniques, skills and so on and so forth.

Everybody has different configs and setups and devices and what-nots.
That's why there will almost always be differences (success stores, or not)

And, remember.. NiVZ said that "he was messing around with.."
So, it's obvious, that he's trial-n-error'ing his endeavors.

@ NiVZ.. good luck.

Later guys.
-vhelp