Automate chapters?

[Neisse]

I'm curious about something, and I hope someone can enlighten me.

Most authoring progs have an "auto chapters" feature (even most set-top DVD recorders do, too), which can be set at say, 5 minutes, 10 minutes, whatever.

Fine if you don't care much about WHERE the chapter points go, just when - I suppose.

I'm finicky - I like my chapters to begin at the BEGINNING of a scene, or after an edited out commercial break.

Currently, I make my chapters by going through the ENTIRE video (after or during editing), deciding where I want the chapters, and then physically writing down the timecode on paper, which is then typed into a text file that gets imported into DLP Pro 1.53 after it's done frame indexing. This process is VERY time consuming and frankly, boring as hell.

Is there a how-to guide or software out there that can detect such irregular chapter points automatically, yet accurately?

Doing the chapters is a major choke point on my projects. If it's possible to automate this process it would speed things up considerably, and might even help making DVD's fun again for me.

Thanks a bunch

[Pinstripes23]

I'm finicky - I like my chapters to begin at the BEGINNING of a scene, or after an edited out commercial break.

Currently, I make my chapters by going through the ENTIRE video (after or during editing), deciding where I want the chapters, and then physically writing down the timecode on paper, which is then typed into a text file that gets imported into DLP Pro 1.53 after it's done frame indexing. This process is VERY time consuming and frankly, boring as hell.

First off why not get current with dvdlab pro - 1.53 is an old version. Second why not create your chapter points on DLP's timeline after importing? I'd say "your" process is time consuming also and could be done faster if just done on the timeline, then frame-index from there.

[guns1inger]

If you go into DLPs chaptering screen you will see that there is a threshold you can set for auto-chaptering. The idea behind it is that it will scan for appropriate breaks for you, rather than just use time intervals. The problem with this, and any automated process, is that all it can really do is try to determine scene changes through major shifts in the image. Sometimes this works - if a scene ends out doors at night and the next starts indoors with the lights on, for example. But if the two scenes are visually similar it won't work.

The timeline is the easiest and fastest way to set your chapter stops. I usually place them pretty close before indexing, let it index, then adjust afterwards.

[Smells_Like_Feet]

I thought that I would go ahead and throw in my 2 cents on this also. I can HIGHLY recommend using VideoReDo to do an automatic scan using it's Ad Detective. I bought this software 2 years ago but just recently had an occasion to try this built-in feature. I was shocked at how easy and accurate it proved to be.

The function basically scans the video input for commercial breaks (looking for black frames that typically mark the ads). After 30 seconds of scanning, it had found and marked all of the commercial breaks for deletion. I quickly checked the file to confirm proper detection, then saved it. If you have VideoReDo set to do so it will also produce a separate chapters file based on each removed commercial. This file can be imported straight into Dvd Lab Pro. It works very well together. This setup would at least cover the instances of chapters at edited commercial breaks.

I can also confirm guns1inger's suggestion regarding the auto-chaptering in DLP, but I am never really confident on where to set the threshold. I usually end up placing the chapters myself using VideoReDo's scene markers.

Good luck

- Smells_Like_Feet

[Neisse]

Yes, I'm aware of placing the chapters via scene markers in DLP. That's how I originally did chapters when I started. However, DLP's not very accurate in playing back a video - it goes by "I" frames, whereas other editing software can advance by actual video frames (such as MPEG-VCR, which is what I use). When editing out commercials, it's much more accurate, as as I'm already scanning through the video manually anyway, I just write down the cut point which becomes the chapter point.

The problem comes with video that doesn't have commercials, or video that has long periods between commercials (such as a movie, etc.). One basically has to watch the whole video to determine where chapter points are appropriate, and possible (not during a fade-in/out, for example - even though it is technically a scene change).

As for why I'm still using DLP V. 1.53 - I've already paid for it, it works fine, makes 100% compatible DVD's with every player I've tried them on so far, and I know the software fairly well. Could it be better? Sure. Is upgrading worth the expense and hassle? I don't know... It seems that whenever an "upgrade" or new version comes out lately for software (and especially drivers, for some reason) it's a LOT larger on the hard drive and yet doesn't work as well as the previous version - lock-ups, immediate shut-downs, or something. I'm not wild about paying a couple of hundred bucks for something that may or may not work right. But, that's just me...

[Pinstripes23]

Yes, I'm aware of placing the chapters via scene markers in DLP. That's how I originally did chapters when I started. However, DLP's not very accurate in playing back a video - it goes by "I" frames, whereas other editing software can advance by actual video frames (such as MPEG-VCR, which is what I use). When editing out commercials, it's much more accurate, as as I'm already scanning through the video manually anyway, I just write down the cut point which becomes the chapter point.

DVD spec only allows chapter points on I frames anyway. It don't matter if you write down the frame number, DLP will just place it to the closest I frame and not on the exact frame number you import through the celltimes.

edit: Ok I see what you are doing. The reason it is very accurate is cuz when you save out after using mpeg-vcr(which re-encodes only the cut-point if I recall), it creates the I frame at that point.....which you could then import into DLP and create the chapter at that frame(after editing). But if no I frame is present at the exact frame on the original mpeg , then DLP will place it to the closest I frame.

[daamon]

However, DLP's not very accurate in playing back a video - it goes by "I" frames

Get The Pro Extensions for DVDLab Pro - you can skip ahead frame by frame. Double click on the "movie" where you want to put chapters in and click on the Pro-Ex button and this amazing little utility pops up. You can quickly scan through the video by dragging the timeline marker, add (and delete) chapter points and then with a single click get these imported into DVDLab Pro.

I do wedding videos where the chapter points have to be specific. It takes me about 10 minutes to knock up around 12 chapter points. The beauty of this app for me (I have DVDLab Pro v2.x) is that it allows you to hear the audio too.

[GeorgeW]

Get The Pro Extensions for DVDLab Pro - you can skip ahead frame by frame.

ProEx also lets you hit a button to find the next "Black" frame (you can set the "black" sensitivity in the preferences).

Regards,
George