Help on how to convert HDTV to DVD Resolution for the best quality

[sjmaye]

If they are already in mpg form then you can load them directly into tmpgenc without converting.

The files I am working with are .mpg I extracted from my HD Directivo. These are OTA HD programs at 1280x720p.

I realize I will lose some quality. I just want to make the files a DVD compliant mpg. You mean I can load these file in to TMPGEnc and the output will be DVD compliant?

Just tried it... NOPE. TEMPGEnc stated it did not support this file type when I tried to load it. I had read elsewhere that the file specs are odd at :

Size- 1280x720
Aspect- 16:9
Frame Rate- 59.94 (720p)
Bitrate- 65000000

I just need to get this in to an .mpg that is DVD compliant. Any ideas?

[BJ_M]

those are not odd file specs ... tmpgenc should support them

[Alex_ander]

My recent experience was encoding HDTV to DVD in TMPGEncXpress3, I selected elementary stream (video only) for output. Demuxed audio from original file, then authored (this way you can save your original 5.1). One of source files was interlaced, I checked 'deinterlace' option for it before encoding. The results were OK. Maybe the only thing that is lost is the lack of color space conversion (heard, someone wrote a filter for this) but I didn't notice any input/output difference with my material.

[sjmaye]

those are not odd file specs ... tmpgenc should support them

Just tried it again. Here is the exact error I get as soon as I browse and select the file.

File "D:\My Documents\My Videos\Star Trek-Arena-CUT.mpg" can not open, or unsupported.

This file was muxed in Tytool.

[sjmaye]

I tried something last night from the TyTool forum. It was so easy it can not be right.

I took the OTA HD file previously mentioned and put it in Nerovision Express. Just added viedos like I was making a DVD, then said to burn folder to hard disk.

Worked like a charm. There was a slight loss in clarity, but I knew there would be since I was going from 1280x720p to 720x480.

Here is where someone here can help- I was actually trying to get to an mpg so I could do some editing. After the Nerovision Express work I have them in VOBs. I opened the VOBs in VideoRedo and saved as mpg.

Am I right in assuming that encoding from VOB to mpg would give me additional PQ loss? If so, is there an easier, higher PQ way to get from 1280x720p to a DVD compliant mpg file?

[TBoneit]

it isn't a mpeg already ? Did you try opening them in VRD before the conversion. I would expect that TMPGEnc Xpress should open them without needing them to be Muxed. Do you have the AC3 plug-in? I seem to recall that Xpress3 needs the plug-in whereas it is bundled into newer Xpress versions.

Or were you trying to open in TMPGEnc DVD Author? that needs DVD compliant video.

[sjmaye]

The file has ac3 audio, but I am only using the evaluation version of TEMPGEnc. I don't think it has the AC3 plugin. duh?!?!? Could be the reason it will not accept the file?

[nebbish_2112]

Manono

"You can tell if that 1080i source is telecined or not by commenting out (putting a "#" in front of) everything below the MPEG2Source line."

I assume you are talking about this 3 line script:

LoadPlugin("C:\Path\To\DGDecode.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\Path\To\LeakKernelDeint.dll")
MPEG2Source("C:\Path\To\Movie.d2v")

Secondly, I have a PAL 1080 .m2v at 25 FPS. Is there a different process for this conversion to DVD? It doesn't appear interlaced, and I'm not sure how to proceed.

[manono]

I assume you are talking about this 3 line script:

Yes.

I have a PAL 1080 .m2v at 25 FPS. Is there a different process for this conversion to DVD?

Well, assuming you're going to encode it for PAL DVD(?), you're not going to IVTC it or apply pulldown as we NTSC people often have to do. You'll just have to resize and encode. Since PAL stuff has usually been encoded as interlaced (run the Preview in DGIndex to confirm), at some point you'll want to add in a ConvertTowhatever colorspace() to make it progressive again before sending it to your encoder. Either that or leave it as interlaced, and set up your encoder to encode as interlaced (no progressive flag, alternate scanning).

[nebbish_2112]

Manono,

Thank you for your comments. Actually, I want to convert to NTSC DVD format. How does this now change things?

[manono]

It changes things a little bit. Say you're going to use CCE for the encoding, which accepts YUY2 colorspace. You'll add a ConvertToYUY2() at some point in the script. Go ahead and resize to 720x480 and encode for 25fps progressive. This isn't DVD compliant, so whatever encoder you use, you might have to disable something. In CCE you have to uncheck the "For DVD" box. Don't apply pulldown during the encode. When done, run the MPV through DGPulldown with the Custom box checked and 25->29.97fps filled in. When done you'll have a fully compliant 720x480 29.97fps NTSC M2V video stream, ready for authoring. You'll be able to use the original unchanged audio, and everything should wind up in synch.

This assumes that the source is 25fps progressive, like from a movie. If it's really interlaced, you'll have to do some fancy footwork in the script.

[nebbish_2112]

OK, G-Spot reports the video as 1920X1088. When I create .d2v in DGIndex it reports last 8 lines as garbage and creates .d2v file as 1920X1080. So far, so good. Now, my eyes tell me the source is progressive as I see no interlacing at all, even though G-spot and DGIndex report the source as interlaced (I know I shouldn't trust these sources as you stated). But, frame rate is reported as 50 fps, which is quite high for a 1080 progressive source, correct? I know your recommended scripts were for 1080i sources, but is there a script I should use for 1080 progressive source to determine if interlaced or not?

[manono]

Interesting, 50fps. OK, make a basic script:

LoadPlugin("C:\Path\To\DGDecode.dll")
MPEG2Source("C:\Path\To\Movie.d2v")

Open it in VDub(Mod), find a place with movement, and start stepping through it a frame at a time. If it's a progressive movie, then every other frame will be a duplicate frame. If it's going to wind up as an interlaced DVD, then every one of the frames is different and unique. Let's assume it's a PAL 50fps movie (every other frame a dupe frame) going to an NTSC DVD, then the script might go something like this:

LoadPlugin("C:\Path\To\DGDecode.dll")
MPEG2Source("C:\Path\To\Movie.d2v")
SelectEvery(2,0)#remove every other frame, making it 25fps
ConvertToYUY2()#or whatever your encoder prefers
LanczosResize(720,480)

And encode for 25fps following the earlier instructions.

[nebbish_2112]

How can I learn more about what, how and why the scripts are written and filters are used. Why the need to interlace, what leakkernelbob is, sepatate fields, etc... Is there some book "Scripting For Dummies" out there or something. I'm desperate to learn.

For exampled:

loadplugin("S:\Software\Ripping\dgmpgdec148\DGDeco de.dll")
LoadPlugin("S:\Software\Ripping\leakkerneldeint154 \LeakKernelDeint.dll")
MPEG2Source("E:\Video To Process.d2v)
LeakKernelBob(Order=1)#if TFF,Order=0 of BFF
LanczosResize(720,480)
SeparateFields()
SelectEvery(4,0,3)
Weave()
ConvertToYUY2(Interlaced=True)

I see LeakKernelDeint deinterlaces the video (but don't know why the need), I did a search on LeakKernelBob with no success, and am totally lost after that. Is there some reference out there I can use to learn more about this?

[manono]

Hi-

I did a search on LeakKernelBob with no success, and am totally lost after that. Is there some reference out there I can use to learn more about this?

You could always try reading the included documentation. From the LeakKernelDeintHelp.html:

Additionally, this version contains a function named LeakKernelBob()...that does full framerate deinterlacing, i.e. it turn 50 fields per second into 50 frames per second.

If you separate the fields of a 1920x1080 interlaced source, you get 1080x540 at double the framerate. A "SmartBobber" such as LeakkKernelBob converts those half-height fields to full-height frames with better quality than does the included Bob command. So, with your source, you get 1080p at 59.94fps. Doing that allows you to then do any kind of filtering, since at that point it's progressive, without messing up the field structure. In that script you gave, you're resizing from the original 1080i to 720x480 (also interlaced). The rest of the script reinterlaces it. You can't just blindly resize an interlaced source without completely messing it up. You have to at least separate the fields first, filter, and then weave the fields back together again. Better is to Bob it first, resize, and then reinterlace it.

How can I learn more about what, how and why the scripts are written and filters are used.

http://avisynth.org/mediawiki/Main_Page

[nebbish_2112]

OK, I'm starting to learn here. So everything in my script after resize is responsible for interlacing the video once again. But in it's progressive state, the video is at 59.94 fps.

So say I had an this interlaced video with intention of compressing to DivX using VirtualDub. I would want to use a script such as this:

loadplugin("S:\Software\Ripping\dgmpgdec148\DGDeco de.dll")
LoadPlugin("S:\Software\Ripping\leakkerneldeint154 \LeakKernelDeint.dll")
MPEG2Source("S:\Rihanna-SOS.04.29.06.(CDUSA)\[HDTV].Rihanna-SOS.04.29.06.(CDUSA).d2v")
LeakKernelBob(Order=1)
FadeIn(15)
FadeOut(15)
LanczosResize(480,272)
SelectEvery(4,0,3)

I am assuming the SelectEvery(4.0.3) is necessary to get back to 29.97fps required for DivX compressor?

[manono]

DivX? I thought this was for DVD. If it's really interlaced, just run a pure deinterlacer to make it progressive (LeakKernelDeint), and then resize.

Yes, the original script was to keep it interlaced. This was assuming a true interlaced source (as opposed to a film source). XviD/DivX AVIs are almost (but not quite) by definition progressive. So, if the source is interlaced, you deinterlace it if for AVI. The script might go something like this:

LeakKernelDeint(Order=1) #if TFF
LanczosResize(480,272)
FadeIn(15)
FadeOut(15)

am assuming the SelectEvery(4.0.3) is necessary to get back to 29.97fps required for DivX compressor?

DivX doesn't require any particular framerate. And weren't you originally talking about PAL sources?

[nebbish_2112]

Yes, I was originally talking about PAL sources, but in my study of filters and scripting I was just experimenting with some scripts for some other common video tasks I do (thank you for the link to http://avisynth.org/mediawiki/Main_Page by the way , it is helping me immensly).

So when going to DivX, I will utilize standard LeakKernelDeint as I have no need to worry about messing up field structure.

Now back to my original situation, if going back to interlace after filtering and sizing, the
Select(4,0,3) is to produce 29.97 fps? (On a side note, I did attempt to feed in the 59.94 fps video into DivX compressor and received an error. I than used Select (4,0,3) and framerate was than 29.97fps and DivX reported no error. I think DivX standards has 30fps as maximum).

[manono]

Hi-

I was just experimenting with some scripts for some other common video tasks I do

Always test out your scripts in VDub(Mod) before sending them off to an encoder. If there's something wrong with the script, it'll throw out an error message. I don't know anything about this DivX Compressor you mentioned (Dr. DivX, maybe?), but if you were to set up the DivX encode in VDub, I don't think you'll have any problems encoding for 50fps or 59.94fps or whatever. He says, not having DivX installed so he can test out those assertions. Maybe it depends on the Profile you choose.

Now back to my original situation, if going back to interlace after filtering and sizing, the Select(4,0,3) is to produce 29.97 fps?

Your original situation was with a PAL source, so that script produced resized and reinterlaced 25fps. But yes, if you have a Hi-Def NTSC 29.97fps 1080i interlaced source, that script will produce interlaced 29.97fps 720x480 for NTSC DVD.

And reading back on my first reply to you, I see I made a big mistake. You can't run an interlaced MPV through DGPulldown without messing it up. It requires progressive input. So, you either have to deinterlace it before converting to NTSC, or you have to do something else in the script to keep it interlaced when converting to NTSC 29.97fps. Xesdeeni is the master of interlaced standards conversions. So, if converting from PAL 25i to NTSC 29.97i:

http://www.geocities.com/xesdeeni2001/StandardsConversion/#PALVideoDVD2NTSCDVD

It's a bit old, that page, and you might do it now like this:

LoadPlugin("DGDecode.dll")
LoadPlugin("LeakKernelDeint.dll")
MPEG2Source("DRIVE:\PATH\VTS_xx_x.d2v")
LeakKernelBob(Order=1) #if TFF
LanczosResize(720,480)
ChangeFPS(59.94)
SeparateFields()
SelectEvery(4,1,2)#if TFF
Weave()
ConvertToRGB24()#for TMPGEnc, ConvertToYUY2() for CCE

That'll give you back interlaced 29.97fps for an interlaced NTSC DVD. He's got a ton of scripts on that page. His scripts should keep you busy for awhile.

[Soopafresh]

"Always test out your scripts in VDub(Mod) before sending them off to an encoder."


Perhaps one of the best bits of advice ever written on these boards.

[nebbish_2112]

Man, this is incredible, I'm learning so much.

OK. back to DivX for a moment. Maybe i should move this one to a different forum.

I have NTSC 16:9 720X480 .d2v from DGIndex at 23.976 fps via ForceFilm. I am assuming ForceFilm can be thought of as an IVTC method used to recover original Film content. Doing so produces progressive source, so no deinterlace will be required in script, so I can just load video and whatever filters into VirtualDub and go, such as:

loadplugin("S:\Software\Ripping\dgmpgdec148\DGDeco de.dll")
loadplugin("S:\Software\Ripping\VirtualDubMod_1_5_ 10_2_\plugins\decomb.dll")
MPEG2Source("S:\House\movie.d2v")
AssumeTFF()
Telecide()
Decimate(cycle=5)
LanczosResize(480,270)


In the case of true NTSC Interlace source destined for DivX, use standard de-interlace filter as suggested above.

In the case of true NTSC source destined for NTSC DVD, use leakkerneldeint and LeakKernelBob, whatever else filtering, resize , and lastly re-interlace.

Sound about right?

[manono]

Sound about right?

If you used Force Film in DGIndex, then the D2V is already 23.976fps. By performing an IVTC on top of that, you've made it 19.98fps. Open the .avs in VDubMod and File->File Information to confirm (or disprove). Force Film might be thought of a weak form of IVTC, yes. But you do one or the other, not both. The script might then go:

loadplugin("S:\Software\Ripping\dgmpgdec148\DGDeco de.dll")
MPEG2Source("S:\House\movie.d2v")
LanczosResize(480,270)

Also, 270 is only Mod2 (only divisible by 2). I'm a firm believer in using Mod16 resolutions. Therefore, it might better become:

LanczosResize(480,272)

I do my cropping and resizing in Gordian Knot. Open the D2V, and go to the Resolution Tab, where you can Crop and Resize, keeping the Aspect Error low and seeing what you're doing. Doing it properly might sometimes mean cutting into the active video. And that resolution is quite low, but maybe you have your reasons for using that particular resolution.

[nebbish_2112]

1280x720 script:

LoadPlugin("C:\Path\To\DGDecode.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\Path\To\Decomb.dll")
MPEG2Source("C:\Path\To\Movie.d2v")
SelectEven()
#Decimate(5)
LanczosResize(720,480)

Open that in VDub(Mod) (adjusted for your paths and names), scroll to a place with movement, and start advancing a frame at a time. If you see duplicate frames every 5 frames (i. e., shot on film), then remove the "#" from the Decimate line, Save it, reopen it in VDubMod, and do the same thing again. Check to make sure there are no dupe frames or skipped or missing frames. If it looks OK, send to your encoder. Encode for progressive 23.976fps with pulldown during or after.

If you didn't see any dupe frames, then keep the "#" and encode for 29.97fps with no pulldown.

OK, my original content is 1280x720p. I did this test and did not notice any duplicate frames. Hence you recommend encoding to 29.97 fps. Should this be encoded as interlaced? The original content is progressive but I am encoding for interlace?

[manono]

Hi-

In that case, you might also remove the SelectEven line:

#SelectEven()
#Decimate(5)

Do the same thing, looking for duplicate frames in a now 59.94fps video. If every other frame is a dupe, put the SelectEven line back in. If every frame is different, you might consider reinterlacing it to keep the playback as smooth as possible.

With the SelectEven line in there, you have a progressive 29.97fps video. Ordinarily, progressive 29.97fps sources are encoded as interlaced for DVD. I've done it both ways, and they both play fine in my players, but to be strictly compliant, it might be better to encode as interlaced.

[nebbish_2112]

To let you know my desired end result is NTSC DVD format.

OK, every frame proved different. You now recommend reinterlacing. How would my script now look?

As an alternate, could I also use instead:

Decimate(cycle=2)
Decimate(cycle=5)

to get it to 23.976 fps? And if so do I encode as progressive?

[manono]

Hi-

Your 1280x720 59.94fps progressive video has every frame different? If so, then the original source was interlaced and they bobbed it to make it progressive for broadcast. You might consider reinterlacing it. Maybe make a sample of both a reinterlaced 59.94fps and a 29.97fps where SelectEven() was used and see which looks better on your TV set. Not the computer, but the TV. Anyway, if you want to try reinterlacing it:

LanczosResize(720,480)
AssumeTFF()#if TFF
SeparateFields()
SelectEvery(4,0,3)
Weave()
ConvertToYUY2(Interlaced=True)#for CCE

And encode for TFF. You have to be very sure of the field order. You might temporarily add as the last line:

AssumeTFF().SeparateFields()

Open the complete script in VDubMod and play it. If it plays smoothly, it's really TFF. If it plays very jerky, it's really BFF. If BFF, either change the script or encode for BFF. Be sure and remove that last line before sending to your encoder. The idea behind recreating an interlaced 29.97fps video is to retain the full fluid movement, part of which is lost if you encode with that SelectEven() line in there. You'll have to be the judge of which you prefer.

And if every frame is different, the last thing you want to do is to reduce it to 23.976fps. It'll play very jerky.

[halsboss]

Another ffmpeg method here https://forum.videohelp.com/topic337231.html also in it a link to various avisynth options too. A copy of the post here for completeness in this one thread :-

PAL 1080i HD doesn't go directly onto an ordinary DVD to, say, play in an ordinary DVD player in another room with a telly if I want to watch it later... SD does as it can be authored almost directly onto DVD... so, this may be of some use to people looking to ask the conversion question -

convert a 16:9 HD 1080i clip into 576i DVD format, ready for authoring ... at least here's a starting point for gaining some AVIsynth and HC and FFMPEG knowledge http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1046975#post1046975

In summary, after editing the capture say with VideoRedo to remove "uninteresting bits" and outputting elementary streams (the output audio stream can be used when DVD authoring) - an example FFMPEG interlaced conversion (this version http://ffdshow.faireal.net/mirror/ffmpeg/ffmpeg.rev10464.7z) using this .BAT command file

set fINPUT=D:\HDTV\1080i-to-576i.mpv
set fOUTPUT=D:\HDTV\1080i-to-576i-OUTPUT-ffmpeg.mpv
set fSIZE=720x576
set fASPECT=16:9
set fMAXBITRATE=9200k
"C:\SOFTWARE\ffmpeg\ffmpeg.exe" -y -i "%fINPUT%" -target pal-dvd -ilme -ildct -flags +ildct+ilme -top 1 -sameq -maxrate %fMAXBITRATE% -dc 10 -s %fSIZE% -aspect %fASPECT% -an "%fOUTPUT%"
PAUSE

following which poke the resulting .mpv, and your audio stream out of say VideoReDo, into your favourite DVD authoring program.

More knowledgeable people may boohoo it, feel free :P Be good to see someone post "higher quality" ffmpeg settings, too.

Got interested following an [australian TV channel] announcement of HD only content (ie no SD to record directly), upon which I bought a DigitalNow TinyTwin USB for use with Webscheduler.

[eas4uk]

Hi

I have been using the scripts in this thread for a few months now

However, have just done a freash reinstall and am now trying to re-encode a 1080i source using the following script

LoadPlugin("C:\Path\To\DGDecode.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\Path\To\Decomb.dll")
MPEG2Source("C:\Path\To\Movie.d2v")
AssumeTFF() #if TFF, AssumeBFF() if BFF
Telecide()
Decimate()
LanczosResize(720,480)

Im getting an error message saying:

Telecide: you must specify the order parameter (0=bff, 1=tff).

What I find strange is I was using the exact same script only a fortnight ago with no problems!

Can anyone help please

Thanks in advance for any replies

[manono]

What I find strange is I was using the exact same script only a fortnight ago with no problems!

You must have used the most recent Decomb until a fortnight ago. You've installed an older version of Decomb. So, either go find the most recent version:

http://neuron2.net/decomb/decombnew.html

or keep the one you have and adjust the script:

LoadPlugin("C:\Path\To\DGDecode.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\Path\To\Decomb.dll")
MPEG2Source("C:\Path\To\Movie.d2v")
Telecide(Order=1)
Decimate()
LanczosResize(720,480)

[eas4uk]

Thanks Manono - the new decomb dll has done the trick

It was typical that my DGindex installation was the only one I forgot to back up!

Appreciate your reply and thanks for the model scripts at the start of the thread