What's the Code for the Video in My/Your Brain?

[ProJiJi]

I just might add, if we could notice, our "brain software development enhancements" as a self enhancing mechanism, has a start and end. But AI might not. The implication of it, results of it, we might not even fully comprehend.

If you want to experience a emotional brain roller-coaster and a bit to this subject, I'd recommend reading short story "Flowers for Algernon" written by Daniel Keyes. I had a profound effect times ago when I read it.

I'm not so sure how to write this, as this is territory I haven't really been comfortable with discussing even with VFW comrades. But the truth is bad-bad-bad things happening around a person can cause some really weird brain things to happen. Those professional doc folks have all sorts of fancy language to explain that stuff, but there really is not any way to explain it.

Just one example I had about 4 or 5 years ago. Law enforcement contacted us one night and asked either my wife, my daughter, or me to go talk to them at one of our rental units, but didn't want to explain the situation over the phone. So I went.

Now a bit of background - - - I honestly thought so many years ago - - - meaning 40 plus years (maybe closer to 50) - - - I thought way back then I would never forget the smell of death when the body had been left out a bit; days or so. It is a smell that simply can't be described. Thank goodness many folks haven't had to experience that. But it is a smell - - - well, way back then, I thought I'd never forget the smell.

Well, that evening when I finally got to that unit, it was the second floor and as I was climbing the steps and got about halfway up the steps I smelled it. You talk about a shock. I knew immediately there was a body close by because of the smell - - - well, how long it had been in there (turned out it was the tenant in that room at the top of those stairs) isn't necessary to detail here. What happened was an unbelievable impact on my brain because it hit me so fast that I had forgotten the smell. Now that isn't even looking like I am writing it here in a way that can be understood. The very first thing in the brain before I even came close to worrying about the police folks up around the top of the stairs and that rental unit was a realization that something I thought I would never forget had actually been forgotten.

I don't think I'm getting this into words properly. Not sure how to explain that case. But I clearly remember I was - - - well, my brain wasn't working so great for the first few minutes while I sort of just froze about halfway up the steps. Haven't a clue what the professional docs would have called that, but it was super, super weird for me. And then memories from the distant past started getting stuck in my brain and that went on for a fair number of days, off-and-on. It was just so weird. It also kicked in some memories from way-way back that I would just as soon not be remembering. The brain is a weird piece of equipment sometimes. Sometimes in a really bad situation a person can do things you never dreamed you could do, until you do that thing. Then, later, when you have time, you sit and wonder just how in the heck you knew how to do that. And if somebody else saw you do it, some strange discussion might take place. I remember one situation at Ft. Sill, Oklahoma something happened that was just so weird, but it worked and probably saved not only my life, but at least one other person.

Actually, typing this is kicking in other memories that are super weird. Especially an incident at 121Evac Hospital and a young fella the staff asked me to try and help. We sure weren't ready for the result of that. We could state I did help do as asked, but the result was so super hard to believe. Human brains are some really weird equipment sometimes. Maybe all the time.

I once watched a guy in a unit either do one of the world's greatest acting jobs to get sent home, or he actually did go completely out of a normal mind thinking way right in a space of about two or three days. None of us knew what was coming until early one morning. And how he did what he did is still a mystery to me all these years later. When the ranking folks finally showed up some couple hours later they were very close to that speechless style, which isn't often something one can see. I mean, absolutely speechless. No words are possible. You just stare and maybe sit down for a bit.

I suppose that style of the brain getting a bad jolt is a lot less safer than if a journal, or book causes such a bad jolt.

Thing is, once in a while a human can do a seemingly impossible thing, so why not also be able to think up some sort of unbelievable idea for doing something, once in a while?

Another thing that causes a really weird feeling is when you have definitely saved a life. But that weird feeling doesn't kick in until sort of hours or more later. I guess those doctor gals and guys are able to handle that better than somebody who isn't doing that kind of work on a regular basis. Or something like that. Discussions about what brains can do can get really weird, can't they?

And some of you folks have shown some mighty interesting thinking in some of your posts in this thread. I think some of you might cause a doctor to learn a few things. Not sure if it is polite to ask if any of you are medical professionals in some way, but ...

[_Al_]

Weird stuff, shocking(within limits), but not lasting long, you push away. No reason for brain to keep it. Not important to survive. The way brain works, it forgets as a natural way of things. We remember only what we need to remember. And it is even processed after the fact. Could be brought back, where some barely holding neuron connections start to reconstruct a memory. But what you remember is already false, not what really happened. As you come back to your memories, the more you twist it, because the very time you think of it, it is rewritten at the same time. Copies of copies etc.

But what I meant by "brain software development enhancements" is that actual process of learning natural way. Like children while maturing. Later on, it is not that much. Later it is just forced learning, not effective at all, we look to everything with a reason, personal preference, prejudice, adorance (if that is a word, firefox says it is not). And that has such a bias, that it becomes a mess, God or Antichrist and we would not even know. That learning is forceful but still needed to handle things, lives, business, science, but it is just so ineffective. After we mature, learning is over. Later, we are basically learning to handle other things, to exist as operators of other things. We became a successful species (well regarding being a boss) because we are able learn while maturing many, many years, slooowly, while being protected, using that off chart learning capability and being taken care of by a group of others, already done learning. Imagine a dog having the same chance. Maturing 10 years. Would not be that a fun with them. They'd figure out what we are, and one by one would just left a note at house (Chewed up our favorite thing) and be gone, to the forest, something like Planet of the Apes series.
Though if I wrote that Planet of the Apes movie script (I would not), there'd be a virus or genetic mutation and chimps would simply be maturing much longer. They did not think about it much, well, no one does. Heck, the same thing that happened to us. That was a number one reason for a successful human evolution dodging other hominids, ..., by slowing down growing up, maturing, basically turning a sick individuals, with problem being young, by evolution and being at right time on right place into a hominid winner. Note that even time is relativistic here (brain vs. reality), it just takes longer to live those maturing 10 years as oppose living 10 years later, which moves faster. As humans we cannot even feel time right. Flowing time is not a constant while connecting a material world with our mind. What else we got wrong? Who is to say to us we are a disease (wink, wink,nudge,nudge).

And that scares me, because AI can "grow up" without a limit. We have basically zero chance to understand what is going to happen.
So next AI thing might be, for their own sake, to say, hey, folks I want to eventually play a chess with someone even,..., lets slow down a human mature process time. I need voluntaries ....

[ProJiJi]

This comes close to something that has been starting to bug me since y'all have been helping me study this:

Flowing time is not a constant while connecting a material world with our mind. What else we got wrong?

Now, I am not stating/thinking we got anything "wrong" within the science community, but maybe there is some, as yet unidentified, "something" in the workings of the human brain that has not yet been discovered? "Something" that is not electrical or chemical?

[thecoalman]

There is an infinite amount of things we don't know about the brain. In science when you answer one question you always create many new questions.

[ProJiJi]

Upon some reflection on the thoughts that started after my last post I realized one very important aspect of this brain stuff is the emotional factor.

Sadness, anger, jealousy, and so on. No way we are going to see present-day AI with any emotion kicking out of their artificial brain.

And I am wondering what causes that emotion stuff? It seems to me it would be mighty weird if that were caused by a chemical, because then some sort of expression about bottling up one's emotion would be true and some smart science mind way back a couple hundred years ago realized that and used that expression on a family member way back then and that got picked up in that community and now it is in our language these days.

Problem is, if it were some sort of chemical that caused emotions, it would then be fully controllable someday when another super smart science mind in the future figures out what kind of chemical causes it.

Moving on; how about emotion is caused by electric impulses?

Once again, that would then be controllable someday when the cousin of that super smart science mind made note of above found how to use an electric impulse to cause something like love. There must be a romantic possibility there because we have that expression; you turn me on. Flip a switch and you're in love.

You see the trouble I got myself into up there? I am thinking in terms of things I have seen posted in this thread; chemicals and electric something. I think that extra something we haven't hit on yet is some sort of something that is out there in the Universe (our planet included) but we haven't "discovered" it yet.

How about we discover it here? What causes emotion?

[ProJiJi]

This one, _AI_, might not be a luck or chance thing:

That was a number one reason for a successful human evolution dodging other hominids ...

Or a dodging by chance thing. This may be related to what I just asked about; emotion. No attraction, so no breeding stuff going on. No switch flipped.

Well, you were offering a sort of dodging due to the maturing rate of us human types is slow, I think?

What the heck, I'm still thinking over your last post, as I am with many of the others put up so far. And I will state again that I am purposely NOT going into Wiki University to find out what some smart science types have written about all this stuff because I want some thought processes that don't fit into that pattern that is taught at universities. That "pattern" that turns out super robots fitted inside human looking ... ?humans?

[_Al_]

It is chemical. And it is even happening in very "old" parts of our brain. Feeling good means, our old brain reacts, reacting with cells, and that makes brain to act, putting neurons to work. If something is pleasant to us, that means, some dopamine and forgot the other one, was released to our body. Animals feel too.

I would not swap cause and effect here, some other parts are here also, like good food and microflora could cause that, it is interconnected, but lets think outside things only..
If we feel good, we know, only AFTER we learn, that or that is positive.
If it can be hacked, ..., maybe, like music, that is frequency, something that can resonate just right for us or not at all. It is used in movies (different tones and harmonies or lack of it). But looking at a picture and having a good feeling, that is old school, primeval thing together with obtained experience. We would have to know what we are looking at, experience something about it, or our brain telling us what it could be.

That is not a bad news, we still know, that our brain can create a better Worlds. Coming up with shocking things, even for this Universe, like Tesla AC motor or feel for someone.

[ProJiJi]

I think your answer that emotion is caused by a chemical pushing a sort of button called a neuron is where I may have to start going into that Google search jungle and start looking for some science-smart union folks and their papers on this whole business. That sort of takes the fun out of this thread.

On the other hand, my immediate tendency is to not agree.

AND my next reaction is fear. If you are right and this is all just a known something called a chemical pushing neuron buttons, then that very same work flow could be programmed into an AI brain after them science-smart folks learn how to do it and the idea of a robot learning hate is a very scary thought.

Still, I suspect I'd better start thinking about fitting some homework into my schedule. That could be a bit tough. I've got a nasty battle just over the horizon with Amazon and their executive branch is in for a lesson of their own. Having to get back to homework - - - what a bummer - - - I hate homework. And I'll bet there are mountains of papers written by science-smart folks about our brains. And dog brains. Feline brains. Maybe even snail brains. I imagine even a snail has a brain, yes? I wonder if there is any "living" thing that doesn't have a brain?

Weird timing, too. I just had to send a communication to my wife that I am very seriously thinking about not renewing my driver's license because of that coma thing that happened to me a couple years ago and the doc's worry about it happening again. After over 50/60 years I don't think I'll have a driver's license anymore. And because of what we are discussing here; a brain. Mine that is all glitchy and stuff. Bummer.

[ProJiJi]

As I made note of earlier, it seems time to start reading the works of some professionals and I asked a colleague who is also a member of the Bezos Earth Fund because I'm sure a search engine result would take hours to sift through for good stuff. So my colleague offered that as I already was familiar with Ms. Zuckerman's work I should read something she wrote a bit back on this topic that my colleague stated was a good read. In fact, the link he sent me was a bit of a surprise:

Human Brain: Facts & Information _ National Geographic

The surprise was that combo of words; "facts and information" but the oddness continued as I am not sure if my colleague tweaked that title himself to play games with my head. He knows I am a nutcase and frequently attempts to mess with my poor old brain. I mean, her title when you look at that page isn't including that combo of vocabulary.

BUT right at the beginning of the piece is this interesting sentence:

The human brain is more complex than any other known structure in the universe.

So Ms. Zuckerman, or some editor, claims that piece is an 8-minute read, so that only means if you are properly studying (for a first read) what's written you'll get through it the first time in about thirty minutes, so it isn't too long.

I went through it twice last night but maybe needs more study. AND that "interesting sentence" seems to also be a link to another article, but I didn't really have time to study that last night.

Just thought/think it is polite to let anyone who has already posted here know how I am going down this new path with this thought process.

BUT I am still wanting that super-brain in our Community to work on turning my dreams into a video we can all watch, if it doesn't show bad stuff; or private stuff.

Maybe the program you come up with will be the second most complex "structure" in our known Universe. Us nuts live in a very complex Universe, so join us and solve this problem. "Us" because I am not the only nutcase around.