Deinterlace Images and Number Files

[Jay123210599]

How do I deinterlace images if they are Top or Bottom Field First?
What tool can number files (and not just only in alphabetical order) while also keeping their original names?

[Selur]

If you have an interlaced frame, it consists of two separate fields, each would be a separate image.
=> not sure what an interlaced image is. Do you mean a screenshot of playing interlaced content as if it was progressive?

[Jay123210599]

If you have an interlaced frame, it consists of two separate fields, each would be a separate image.
=> not sure what an interlaced image is. Do you mean a screenshot of playing interlaced content as if it was progressive?

I mean extracted frames from interlaced videos. And what about my other question?

[poisondeathray]

What tool can number files (and not just only in alphabetical order) while also keeping their original names?

What does that mean ? Rename files ? You can use Bulk Rename Utility to perform various manipulations and offsets

(You should "extract" image sequence from video with the correct numbers in the first place)

If you have an interlaced frame, it consists of two separate fields, each would be a separate image.
=> not sure what an interlaced image is. Do you mean a screenshot of playing interlaced content as if it was progressive?

I mean extracted frames from interlaced videos.

Be careful about "extracting frames from interlaced videos". Often it's done incorrectly - the conversion to and from RGB is done in progressive manner, instead of interlaced. This will cause chroma artifacts .YUV<=>RGB conversions must be done properly or you get additional artifacts

You can load image sequences if they are sequentially numbered in avisynth, or vdub, or vapoursynth, or ffmpeg etc... Almost all editors will handle them too . Once image sequence is loaded you can apply a deinterlacing filter and specify the field order

[Jay123210599]

What tool can number files (and not just only in alphabetical order) while also keeping their original names?

What does that mean ? Rename files ? You can use Bulk Rename Utility to perform various manipulations and offsets

(You should "extract" image sequence from video with the correct numbers in the first place)

If you have an interlaced frame, it consists of two separate fields, each would be a separate image.
=> not sure what an interlaced image is. Do you mean a screenshot of playing interlaced content as if it was progressive?

I mean extracted frames from interlaced videos.

Be careful about "extracting frames from interlaced videos". Often it's done incorrectly - the conversion to and from RGB is done in progressive manner, instead of interlaced. This will cause chroma artifacts .YUV<=>RGB conversions must be done properly or you get additional artifacts

You can load image sequences if they are sequentially numbered in avisynth, or vdub, or vapoursynth, or ffmpeg etc... Almost all editors will handle them too . Once image sequence is loaded you can apply a deinterlacing filter and specify the field order

Yeah, but here's the problem with Bulk Rename Utility. I want to number some videos, however, they list the video files that would be renamed in alphabetical order, and I don't want that. Or is there a solution to change the order of the list of files?

Also, do deinterlacers like QTGMC and yadif work with images?

[poisondeathray]

Yeah, but here's the problem with Bulk Rename Utility. I want to number some videos, however, they list the video files that would be renamed in alphabetical order, and I don't want that. Or is there a solution to change the order of the list of files?

It works like windows explorer display options . Left click to change ascending or descending order, right click the header to include more columns or sort by other parameters

Also, do deinterlacers like QTGMC and yadif work with images?

Yes if you load the images. See the post above. The standard in all programs is a sequentially numbered image sequence

Also most deinterlacers will only work with YUV (because interlace is really for video). So in most cases you will have to convert back to YUV.

Do you have a good reason to use images instead of video ? Recall images are usually converted to RGB . Recall that YUV<=>RGB is usually not a lossless transform unless you work in float (you lose a bit of quality each time, some rounding lossess, some clipping) . This is avoidable if you stay in YUV

[Jay123210599]

Yeah, but here's the problem with Bulk Rename Utility. I want to number some videos, however, they list the video files that would be renamed in alphabetical order, and I don't want that. Or is there a solution to change the order of the list of files?

It works like windows explorer display options . Left click to change ascending or descending order, right click the header to include more columns or sort by other parameters

Also, do deinterlacers like QTGMC and yadif work with images?

Yes if you load the images. See the post above. The standard in all programs is a sequentially numbered image sequence

Also most deinterlacers will only work with YUV (because interlace is really for video). So in most cases you will have to convert back to YUV.

Do you have a good reason to use images instead of video ? Recall images are usually converted to RGB . Recall that YUV<=>RGB is usually not a lossless transform unless you work in float (you lose a bit of quality each time, some rounding lossess, some clipping) . This is avoidable if you stay in YUV

Can you manually sort the files by moving them up and down on the list in the tool? As for your other question, I read on ChatGPT that deinterlacing images would have higher quality than deinterlacing videos.

https://chat.openai.com/share/a632d0bb-3cde-43e5-a5df-090f06ae66aa
https://chat.openai.com/share/7891ecf8-418d-4a2e-9d0f-38e8ba4599e7

[poisondeathray]

Can you manually sort the files by moving them up and down on the list in the tool?

I don't know, try it

Maybe one of the other functions move/copy parts section

As for your other question, I read on ChatGPT that deinterlacing images would have higher quality than deinterlacing videos.

https://chat.openai.com/share/a632d0bb-3cde-43e5-a5df-090f06ae66aa
https://chat.openai.com/share/7891ecf8-418d-4a2e-9d0f-38e8ba4599e7

It's wrong for the reasons mentioned earlier

Another reason ChatGPT reply is wrong, is a single image (2 fields) has no additional temporal data. A temporal deinterlacer can make use of several adjacent fields

[Jay123210599]

Can you manually sort the files by moving them up and down on the list in the tool?

I don't know, try it

Maybe one of the other functions move/copy parts section

As for your other question, I read on ChatGPT that deinterlacing images would have higher quality than deinterlacing videos.

https://chat.openai.com/share/a632d0bb-3cde-43e5-a5df-090f06ae66aa
https://chat.openai.com/share/7891ecf8-418d-4a2e-9d0f-38e8ba4599e7

It's wrong for the reasons mentioned earlier

Another reason ChatGPT reply is wrong, is a single image (2 fields) has no additional temporal data. A temporal deinterlacer can make use of several adjacent fields

So deinterlacing videos have higher quality? What about apngs vs gifs?

[poisondeathray]

So deinterlacing videos have higher quality?

Already answered

What about apngs vs gifs?

Already answered in previous thread

[Cornucopia]

ChatGPT is AS (artificial stupidity) in this and many other instances. It should never be a sole reference because it doesn't apply any weight to the things it parrots, using just statistical modes. No better than CW.

Why do you not want alphabetical order? What order do you feel you need your files to be in?

You talk of extracting frames and then interlacing in the same context - interlacing uses fields, not frames, so you cannot treat them the same way.
This was already told to you previously.


Scott

[Jay123210599]

ChatGPT is AS (artificial stupidity) in this and many other instances. It should never be a sole reference because it doesn't apply any weight to the things it parrots, using just statistical modes. No better than CW.

Why do you not want alphabetical order? What order do you feel you need your files to be in?

You talk of extracting frames and then interlacing in the same context - interlacing uses fields, not frames, so you cannot treat them the same way.
This was already told to you previously.


Scott

Because I extracted .bik files from a video game and converted them to .mkv. Now I want to number those files in the same order as the cutscenes went in the game, and the alphabetical order of the cutscenes is not the same as it went in the game.

And also, even if I extract a frame from an interlaced video, deinterlacing it will not possess greater results?

[Cornucopia]

Did you export them in cutscene order? Then use the timestamp as basis for ordering, prepending something.
If you didn't accurately follow the cutscene order, you will likely have to manually change the naming. Again, I ask: how many is your "bunch"?

Will reply to the deint later...


Scott

[Jay123210599]

Did you export them in cutscene order? Then use the timestamp as basis for ordering, prepending something.
If you didn't accurately follow the cutscene order, you will likely have to manually change the naming. Again, I ask: how many is your "bunch"?

Will reply to the deint later...


Scott

13 videos, and no they are not in cutscene order.

[poisondeathray]

No reason to use image sequences in your case, and the quality will be lower even with PNG since bik is YUV - and it will take more steps and conversion , more HDD space. Easier to reorder or rename 13 videos than 1000's of images. Usually there is more than one way to do things but what you are doing is clearly a bad approach - all negatives, no positives

[Jay123210599]

No reason to use image sequences in your case, and the quality will be lower even with PNG since bik is YUV - and it will take more steps and conversion , more HDD space. Easier to reorder or rename 13 videos than 1000's of images. Usually there is more than one way to do things but what you are doing is clearly a bad approach - all negatives, no positives

Wait, I think were getting confused. I am not deinterlacing the bik files, only numbering them in cutscene order. What I am deinterlacing are frames extracted from an interlaced H.264 videos (but not of all them, maybe about 100 of them at different points during the video).

[Cornucopia]

We?

13 videos to rename manually is nothing! In fact you would already be done by now.
Even a couple hundred videos wouldn't take that long.

Considering bik files would likely never originate from captured analog interlaced media, it should be inappropriate to deinterlace them.

While interlaced h264 is not unknown, it isn't the most common. Are you sure what you have is truly interlaced? What app are you using to extract the frames? Does that app support extracting fields?
If they ARE interlaced, and if your app is extracting whole, 2-field frames as images, pick the field order and your algorithm and deinterlace. If you get the field order wrong just pick the opposite field order and do it again.
Deinterlacing won't increase the objective resolution/quality, but subjectively you might find it preferable.


Scott

[Jay123210599]

We?

13 videos to rename manually is nothing! In fact you would already be done by now.
Even a couple hundred videos wouldn't take that long.

Considering bik files would likely never originate from captured analog interlaced media, it should be inappropriate to deinterlace them.

While interlaced h264 is not unknown, it isn't the most common. Are you sure what you have is truly interlaced? What app are you using to extract the frames? Does that app support extracting fields?
If they ARE interlaced, and if your app is extracting whole, 2-field frames as images, pick the field order and your algorithm and deinterlace. If you get the field order wrong just pick the opposite field order and do it again.
Deinterlacing won't increase the objective resolution/quality, but subjectively you might find it preferable.


Scott

Here the information of the video.

[Cornucopia]

Ok, so the video was a Blu-ray ripped with MakeMKV and it appears to be interlaced. What about the extracting app, the deinterlacing app?


Scott

[poisondeathray]

mediainfo does not tell you anything about the actual content. eg. It could be progressive content with hard telecine

The answer doesn't change - Don't convert interlaced h264 to images like png unless there is a good reason to . You require more hdd space, more processing time, and reduction in quality from colorspace conversions and up/down sampling chroma . You are prone to chroma sampling errors if do not perform the interlaced YUV420 <=> interlaced RGB conversion correctly - interlaced chroma errors. Some deinterlacers like QTGMC work in YUV only, so you would be doing a extra conversions (more loss and slower) - So it's all negatives , zero positives . Usually there is a consideration of pros/cons, but it's all "cons" in your case

[Jay123210599]

mediainfo does not tell you anything about the actual content. eg. It could be progressive content with hard telecine

The answer doesn't change - Don't convert interlaced h264 to images like png unless there is a good reason to . You require more hdd space, more processing time, and reduction in quality from colorspace conversions and up/down sampling chroma . You are prone to chroma sampling errors if do not perform the interlaced YUV420 <=> interlaced RGB conversion correctly - interlaced chroma errors. Some deinterlacers like QTGMC work in YUV only, so you would be doing a extra conversions (more loss and slower) - So it's all negatives , zero positives . Usually there is a consideration of pros/cons, but it's all "cons" in your case

So deinterlace videos and not images?

[Cornucopia]

Listen to what you are saying.
Still images (not including animated variants) have no time designation, so the idea of interlacing (a staggering in time of display of) still images is only applicable to slow web feeds (and then the term "progressive actually means the opposite). If you have an interlaced video (which as pdr mentioned has not been definitively determined yet), you should be using a proper tools to both deinterlace and extract.

<Edit> Let me put it another way - if, when you export interlaced videos to stills, you have not already applied deinterlacing prior to export, the exported still image will be one single progressive frame - in effect, it will apply its own basic deinterlacing. And you have no control over it, so if it isn't optimal, you are stuck. You could for example re-apply a filter that removes alternating lines, but would also then need to resize.


Scott

[poisondeathray]

mediainfo does not tell you anything about the actual content. eg. It could be progressive content with hard telecine

The answer doesn't change - Don't convert interlaced h264 to images like png unless there is a good reason to . You require more hdd space, more processing time, and reduction in quality from colorspace conversions and up/down sampling chroma . You are prone to chroma sampling errors if do not perform the interlaced YUV420 <=> interlaced RGB conversion correctly - interlaced chroma errors. Some deinterlacers like QTGMC work in YUV only, so you would be doing a extra conversions (more loss and slower) - So it's all negatives , zero positives . Usually there is a consideration of pros/cons, but it's all "cons" in your case

So deinterlace videos and not images?

Don't use image sequences at all - unless you have a good reason to (eg. maybe you're using them in other programs like photoshop) . All negatives, zero positives

You might deinterlace videos that have actual interlaced content, or you might leave them interlaced depending on what the scenario is.

If videos are encoded interlaced, but progressive content , then the general rule is don't deinterlace otherwise you degrade it . There are some BD's like this, especially anime and some animated content BD's. Mediainfo cannot tell you anything about the actual content with any accuracy. If it's 24000/1001 progressive or 24/1 progressive - those types of BD's mediainfo can mostly reliably identify. "Interlaced" ones mediainfo cannot - it only tells you how it was encoded, nothing about the actual content

[Jay123210599]

mediainfo does not tell you anything about the actual content. eg. It could be progressive content with hard telecine

The answer doesn't change - Don't convert interlaced h264 to images like png unless there is a good reason to . You require more hdd space, more processing time, and reduction in quality from colorspace conversions and up/down sampling chroma . You are prone to chroma sampling errors if do not perform the interlaced YUV420 <=> interlaced RGB conversion correctly - interlaced chroma errors. Some deinterlacers like QTGMC work in YUV only, so you would be doing a extra conversions (more loss and slower) - So it's all negatives , zero positives . Usually there is a consideration of pros/cons, but it's all "cons" in your case

So deinterlace videos and not images?

Don't use image sequences at all - unless you have a good reason to (eg. maybe you're using them in other programs like photoshop) . All negatives, zero positives

You might deinterlace videos that have actual interlaced content, or you might leave them interlaced depending on what the scenario is.

If videos are encoded interlaced, but progressive content , then the general rule is don't deinterlace otherwise you degrade it . There are some BD's like this, especially anime and some animated content BD's. Mediainfo cannot tell you anything about the actual content with any accuracy. If it's 24000/1001 progressive or 24/1 progressive - those types of BD's mediainfo can mostly reliably identify. "Interlaced" ones mediainfo cannot - it only tells you how it was encoded, nothing about the actual content

Wait, I can deinterlace images in photoshop? How? What other alternatives can do the job perfectly?

[poisondeathray]

Wait, I can deinterlace images in photoshop? How?

Nope

I mentioned photoshop as a valid reason to use images - eg. maybe you're painting or touching them up

What other alternatives can do the job perfectly?

There is no such thing as perfect deinterlacing . Everything is a compromise in some areas

[Jay123210599]

All right, I'll just deinterlace my video then. Now what are some alternatives for Bulk Rename Utility that can number files without renaming them in a specific, non-alphabetical order?

[Jay123210599]

Wait, I can deinterlace images in photoshop? How?

Nope

I mentioned photoshop as a valid reason to use images - eg. maybe you're painting or touching them up

What other alternatives can do the job perfectly?

There is no such thing as perfect deinterlacing . Everything is a compromise in some areas

Watch this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VT04oL-p5X8

[poisondeathray]

Wait, I can deinterlace images in photoshop? How?

Nope

I mentioned photoshop as a valid reason to use images - eg. maybe you're painting or touching them up

What other alternatives can do the job perfectly?

There is no such thing as perfect deinterlacing . Everything is a compromise in some areas

Watch this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VT04oL-p5X8

Did you actually try it ? Photoshop does a garbage job of deinterlacing and you lose 1/2 the information.

[Cornucopia]

All right, I'll just deinterlace my video then. Now what are some alternatives for Bulk Rename Utility that can number files without renaming them in a specific, non-alphabetical order?

I am partial to 1-4a Rename, although it hasn't been updated in a while (creator passed away, unfortunately).
However, there is nothing stopping you from using Bulk Rename Utility, as well as 1-4a, from sorting non-alphabetically using another file property column (such as timestamp which I already mentioned to you). And since you don't have that many, you can do it by hand, as I also mentioned.
Seriously, I have had a time or 2 where I had to uniquely custom rename ~10000 files. Takes a few hours, but then you're done.


Scott