Broadcasting PC display via RF modulator/HDHomeRun

[itm2]

I am trying to make my mediacentre (Windows 10 PC) accessible to my portable Android devices.
I am using a HDHomeRun in conjunction with an RF modulator (in the UK), and using the HDHomeRun client app on Android.
Basically the HDMI output from the PC is plugged into the RF modulator, the RF modulator is connected to the HDHomeRun, and the HDHomeRun converts the RF signal into a DLNA stream.
The basic setup works, but I get extreme pixellation in the video stream (see attached photo). I've tried all of the refresh rate options in Windows display settings, but none of them help.
The RF modulator that I'm using is a Technomate TM-RF HD (https://tdigroup.co.uk/product/technomate-tm-rf-hd-hdmi-dvb-t-rf-modulator/).

Does anyone have any idea how I can fix this pixellation?

[Attachment 74326 - Click to enlarge]

[usually_quiet]

Did you test the RF modulator with HDMI output from a Blu-ray player or some other source that it is designed to accept? Did that work better?

Your attachment shows a refresh rate of 59.97 Hz. If 59.97 fps is atypical for DVB-T broadcasts, are you sure that the RF modulator is designed to convert HDMI signals with a non-standard framerate to match the DVB-T standard and provide a watchable picture? If it doesn't, how do you expect the HDHomerun DVB-T tuner to tune a non-standard signal?

I have an HDHomerun device too. However, I am using it with a digital cable TV source that conforms with the US standard for QAM after decryption by a type of smart card that is installed in the HDHomerun tuner.

[itm2]

Did you test the RF modulator with HDMI output from a Blu-ray player or some other source that it is designed to accept? Did that work better?

Your attachment shows a refresh rate of 59.97 Hz. If 59.97 fps is atypical for DVB-T broadcasts, are you sure that the RF modulator is designed to convert HDMI signals with a non-standard framerate to match the DVB-T standard and provide a watchable picture? If it doesn't, how do you expect the HDHomerun DVB-T tuner to tune a non-standard signal?

I have an HDHomerun device too. However, I am using it with a digital cable TV source that conforms with the US standard for QAM after decryption by a type of smart card that is installed in the HDHomerun tuner.

Ah OK so I don't have any idea what framerates are typical/atypical for DVB-T, but I've just tried the 50Hz setting and so far this look OK. I thought I had tried that before, but maybe I hadn't saved the changes. Fingers crossed the issue may now be resolved.

Many thanks for the pointer.

[usually_quiet]

Did you test the RF modulator with HDMI output from a Blu-ray player or some other source that it is designed to accept? Did that work better?

Your attachment shows a refresh rate of 59.97 Hz. If 59.97 fps is atypical for DVB-T broadcasts, are you sure that the RF modulator is designed to convert HDMI signals with a non-standard framerate to match the DVB-T standard and provide a watchable picture? If it doesn't, how do you expect the HDHomerun DVB-T tuner to tune a non-standard signal?

I have an HDHomerun device too. However, I am using it with a digital cable TV source that conforms with the US standard for QAM after decryption by a type of smart card that is installed in the HDHomerun tuner.

Ah OK so I don't have any idea what framerates are typical/atypical for DVB-T, but I've just tried the 50Hz setting and so far this look OK. I thought I had tried that before, but maybe I hadn't saved the changes. Fingers crossed the issue may now be resolved.

Many thanks for the pointer.

My understanding was that 25 fps or 50 fps are typical for UK TV broadcasts but then I don't regularly look for changes to TV broadcast standards other than those that apply to the USA.

[itm2]

Did you test the RF modulator with HDMI output from a Blu-ray player or some other source that it is designed to accept? Did that work better?

Your attachment shows a refresh rate of 59.97 Hz. If 59.97 fps is atypical for DVB-T broadcasts, are you sure that the RF modulator is designed to convert HDMI signals with a non-standard framerate to match the DVB-T standard and provide a watchable picture? If it doesn't, how do you expect the HDHomerun DVB-T tuner to tune a non-standard signal?

I have an HDHomerun device too. However, I am using it with a digital cable TV source that conforms with the US standard for QAM after decryption by a type of smart card that is installed in the HDHomerun tuner.

Ah OK so I don't have any idea what framerates are typical/atypical for DVB-T, but I've just tried the 50Hz setting and so far this look OK. I thought I had tried that before, but maybe I hadn't saved the changes. Fingers crossed the issue may now be resolved.

Many thanks for the pointer.

My understanding was that 25 fps or 50 fps are typical for UK TV broadcasts but then I don't regularly look for changes to TV broadcast standards other than those that apply to the USA.

Yes I believe that 25fps is the normal framerate for PAL TV systems in the UK. Are FPS and refresh rate the same thing?

[usually_quiet]

Are FPS and refresh rate the same thing?

Sometimes they are and sometimes not. Display devices such as monitors may support more than one refresh rate. Digital videos have frames per second, which is usually constant and fixed. Many software players can repeat frames when the display's refresh rate exceeds the video's frame rate in order to match the refresh rate.

[itm2]

Hmmm...looks like the problem isn't resolved after all. The pixellation is back, regardless of which refresh rate I choose.
???

[Cornucopia]

So, why dont you bypass the RF modulator and HDHomerun, and make your mediacenter PC be a DLNA server? Or directly feed a separate DLNA server? Less D <--> A Conversion = less loss of quality.


Scott

[itm2]

So, why dont you bypass the RF modulator and HDHomerun, and make your mediacenter PC be a DLNA server? Or directly feed a separate DLNA server? Less D <--> A Conversion = less loss of quality.


Scott

(How) would it be possible to stream the PC's desktop and audio via DLNA? I would probably know how to set up a DLNA server to stream files, but I don't know a way of streaming the desktop (or a browser window streaming a live video)?

[Cornucopia]

Besides the recommended Plex and other good 3rd party solutions, Win10 & 11 have DLNA media streaming capabilities built-in.

But, if you're streaming a live video from a browser window, are your end devices not able to receive those same streams themselves, directly, since they accept DLNA?

If your intended setup does require an intermediate computer, you could always output HDMI, and then use an HDMI capture solution in OBS and restream (using a 2nd computer) and you would at least then have fine control over most all parameters.


Scott

[jagabo]

Android devices can access Samba (aka SMB, Windows network) shares directly. I just share folders on my NAS (an old Windows 10 PC) and access them with Kodi or VLC running on the Android boxes (and other Windows computers in the house). Via wifi or ethernet.

[usually_quiet]

It sounds like itm2 needs to do more than just watch videos stored on the HTPC but I agree that SMB can work well for watching them remotely. I have done that on an my Chromecast with Google TV devices using VLC for Android as the player.

itm2 mentioned streaming. It is true that some streaming services are only available on Android boxes that are approved by the streaming service and have Google TV or Android TV as their OS.

If itm2 needs to monitor something running on his HTPC, there are remote desktop apps for Android available on Google's Play Store. I tried Chrome Remote Desktop on my Android phone. (It also needs to be installed on the PC, using the Chrome browser.) I could see and hear a video running on the PC, but the picture on the phone was not displayed at full screen and the audio was poor. I also installed Microsoft's Remote Desktop client for Android and tried that. I could see my video at full screen on the phone (but not at its full frame rate) and could hear the audio. However, the PC itself went to the lock screen when I logged into the Remote Desktop client. When I shut down the remote desktop and logged into the PC again, the video was still running.

[dellsam34]

As members pointed out it looks like using RF is an unnecessary process.

[itm2]

Just to confirm - I am indeed looking to cast live streams (usually sports streams) from my main mediacentre PC to Android devices around the house. The streaming services that I use normally have per-device pricing, which I don't want to get into.
The reasons I'm looking at RF are:
- it would also be useful to stream the output from my PVR around the same Android devices
- the only screen-mirroring solutions I have found for Windows are either extremely unreliable or do not send audio.

AFAIK DLNA by itself doesn't help, as it works on the back of the UPnP protocol, which doesn't support screen sharing.

[usually_quiet]

I looked at the Technomate RF modulator's manual. There are a lot of resolutions listed as well as many other settings related to the characteristics of the DVB-T signal output by the RF Modulator. It looks like 1080p50 is supported and 1080p resolution display is also recommended.

HDMI output from a PC allows the use of HDCP copy protection, and I am guessing that your streaming services require it. That could be the problem, although the manual never mentions HDCP. If you play a 1080p video file that is stored locally on the HTPC does the same problem occur?

[Edit]The product page seems to indicate that HDCP won't be a problem, but it wouldn't hurt to find out if there is a 1080p video source that does work.

[itm2]

Problem solved! I found an old attenuator lying around in a drawer, and fitted it between the RF modulator and the HDHomeRun. I now have perfect HD audio and video from the mediacentre PC on all of my Android devices.

[usually_quiet]

Well done. I never considered that an overly strong RF signal could be the source of the problem. I have only ever experienced problems from an RF signal that is not strong enough.