VCR to DVD Recorder Problem.

[DB83]

The setup you describe is similar to mine. Sat Box connected to dvd-recorder by scart. Dvd-recorder connected to tv by hdmi. There is no other cable going in to the tv.

The only variation is that I have never attempted to make a connection through the from AV (Line2 in)

On my recorder there is no selection available between s-video in and video-in on Line 2. There is on Line 1. I think this is the same on your recorder as the models are quite similar and so is the manual.

That being said, I do wonder how a signal from the front AV can appear on the tv when there is only a hdmi connection and Line 1(the Sat Box) is already in use. It is totally illogical to select Line 2 since that really should be one of the scarts on the tv itself.

Yes, I know I have already said most of this but I do not think you understand what I am saying.

[Robert the Bruce]

Set-Up.
Back of DVD Recorder - Scart Cable from Line 1 (Decoder) to 'VCR Scart' connection (socket) at back of Sat Box.
Back of DVD Recorder - Line 3 Scart socket is free, not in use.
Back of Sat Box - Scart Cable from 'TV Scart' connection (socket) to AV-1 at back of TV.
Back of DVD Recorder - HDMI cable from HDMI-Out to HDMI-1 at back of TV.
Back of PS3 - HDMI cable to HDMI-2 at back of TV.
Back of DVD Recorder - cable from Digital Aerial-Out to Aerial-In at back of TV.
Back of DVD Recorder - cable from Digital Aerial-In to RF-Out 1 at back of Sat box (or vice-versa if you prefer)
Back of Sat box - cable from Aerial-In to Wall (or vice-versa)
Back of Sat box - Coaxial cable from 'Dish Input' to Wall (or vice versa)
Back of VCR - Scart cable from AV-1 In/Out to AV-2 at back of TV.
Back of VCR - S-Video cable and red & white audio cables 'hang loose' to be inserted into front of DVD recorder when needed for video tape recording purposes.
Now, as far as I'm aware I haven't made any mistakes here.
This set-up has worked perfectly well until recently.

[Robert the Bruce]

The setup you describe is similar to mine. Sat Box connected to dvd-recorder by scart. Dvd-recorder connected to tv by hdmi. There is no other cable going in to the tv.

The only variation is that I have never attempted to make a connection through the from AV (Line2 in)

On my recorder there is no selection available between s-video in and video-in on Line 2. There is on Line 1. I think this is the same on your recorder as the models are quite similar and so is the manual.

That being said, I do wonder how a signal from the front AV can appear on the tv when there is only a hdmi connection and Line 1(the Sat Box) is already in use. It is totally illogical to select Line 2 since that really should be one of the scarts on the tv itself.

Yes, I know I have already said most of this but I do not think you understand what I am saying.

According to my DVD recorder manual, 'recording from external equipment' - it says 'Press Input (on the DVD Recorder) to select an input source according to the connection you made'. There is a diagram showing programme position L1 and an arrow pointing to L2.
I have to use L2 to record from 'external equipment' because L1 is taken up by the Sat box. If I want to record normally (a TV show or whatever) I use L1, to record video tape I use L2. It's worked well enough until recently.
The problem occurs as soon as I connect the S-Video cable (coming from the back of the VCR) to the front of the DVD recorder (Line-2 In) and change from L1 to L2. At that moment (the change from L1 to L2) the b&w tv channel appears. If I then press play on my VCR the playback will be in b&w, only when I change (using my TV remote) to AV-2 will I see video as it should be but the problem is that the recorder will now only record the b&w video footage.

[DB83]

from post #32. You have now explained why you see the picture on your tv from the VCR. As I thought, that is AV2 on your tv.

That has nothing to do with Line 2 on the dvd-recorder. You simply confused the whole issue when you incorrectly answered my earlier question about the cable(s) going in to the tv when you implied that you only had a hdmi cable going in there.

One possibliity that has not been considered is that your s-video cable - the one that goes from the VCR - has become damaged or even the socket is damaged. There is no reason to unplug these as they should not affect anything else. Try another cable or even, since you assumedly only use the VCR occassionally just run a scart from that to Line 1 on the dvd-recorder - ensure the recorder is set for line 1 = video-in and record from the VCR in that way.

[Robert the Bruce]

from post #32. You have now explained why you see the picture on your tv from the VCR. As I thought, that is AV2 on your tv.

That has nothing to do with Line 2 on the dvd-recorder. You simply confused the whole issue when you incorrectly answered my earlier question about the cable(s) going in to the tv when you implied that you only had a hdmi cable going in there.

One possibliity that has not been considered is that your s-video cable - the one that goes from the VCR - has become damaged or even the socket is damaged. There is no reason to unplug these as they should not affect anything else. Try another cable or even, since you assumedly only use the VCR occassionally just run a scart from that to Line 1 on the dvd-recorder - ensure the recorder is set for line 1 = video-in and record from the VCR in that way.

OK, I'll try another S-Video cable but it's a long shot.

[orsetto]

As I said, as soon as I switch from L1 to L2 on the DVD recorder I see B&W tv when I should see a blank screen. Don't understand why a TV signal is there at all. The TV comes through L1 not L2. I'm convinced it's something simple...........I hope.
New information. If I press play on my VCR and then press Input/Line 2 on my DVD recorder I shouldn't see what I'm now seeing. The video playback is coming through L2 in black and white. I shouldn't see anything but a black screen at this stage. I then go to AV-2 using my TV remote and the video signal is there as it should be - in colour. So, the recorder, it seems, is recording the video signal not from the AV-2 channel but from the b&w signal which is somehow coming through the HDMI-1 channel. What gives ?

It is hard to know where to even begin quoting your questions, much less identify the problem. I think the biggest issue confounding potential advisors is that the procedure you've described as "always worked before" makes absolutely no sense in terms of traditional hookups and mfr instructions. The point you seem not to be grasping, and that others may not be communicating clearly, is that your habit of switching the TV input from "HDMI" to "AV2" in order to "see" what you're doing during a dub from VCR to DVD Recorder is "wrong." ALL operations that involve the DVD Recorder should ordinarily be viewed via the DVD Recorder HDMI connection to the TV: recording from the Satellite box, playing a DVD, or recording from the VCR. Under normal circumstances, switching the TV to AV2 would blind it completely to the DVD Recorder, allowing you to see only the direct output of the VCR (i.e. you should not be able to see any of the DVD Recorder indications). Direct output from VCR to TV input AV2 would normally be used only when you want to watch a VHS while the DVD Recorder is recording from the Satellite Box.

Beyond this one clarification of what seems odd about your process, I can't imagine the cause of this new problem you're experiencing. In USA we do not have SCART, so American VH members are not well versed in its vagaries. I have had friends in UK complain bitterly about unreliable SCART cables and and how much they loathe the SCART system, so theres a chance you may have had either a cable or connector go bad (causing a short and unusual behavior). SCART has also been reported as problematic when more than one output is active simultaneously (i.e. your setup of VCR SCART to TV and VCR Line to DVD Recorder). If I were suffering such a sudden change in functionality, I would disconnect EVERYTHING from the TV, then reconnect one system at a time until possibly isolating the problem cable or component. Start by connecting only the DVD Recorder HDMI output to the TV, and only the VCR Line Out to the front Line In of the DVD Recorder. With the TV set to HDMI, you should be able to clearly view the VHS being played thru the DVD Recorder front inputs. If you don't, there is an issue with the HDMI or internal input switching of the DVD recorder.

[Robert the Bruce]

The point you seem not to be grasping, and that others may not be communicating clearly, is that your habit of switching the TV input from "HDMI" to "AV2" in order to "see" what you're doing during a dub from VCR to DVD Recorder is "wrong."
And yet it worked.
OK, I'll try the other method you suggest.

[Robert the Bruce]

Had a close look at my S-Video cable. One of the tiny pins has broken off. Off to buy a new one.

[DB83]

Had a close look at my S-Video cable. One of the tiny pins has broken off. Off to buy a new one.

And the first rule of thumb before confusing both yourself and everyone who tried to help.......

"CHECK THE CABLE"

[Robert the Bruce]

Had a close look at my S-Video cable. One of the tiny pins has broken off. Off to buy a new one.

And the first rule of thumb before confusing both yourself and everyone who tried to help.......

"CHECK THE CABLE"

Well, whaddaya know ? Turns out the problem was a faulty S-Video cable. Everything working fine now with new S-Video cable even though I was told that my set-up was 'wrong'.
It's alright saying 'CHECK THE CABLE' with hindsight. Why wasn't that possibility suggested from the outset if it's 'first rule of thumb'. ?
Anyhow, thanks to all who helped and sorry about the brain-ache.

[DB83]

It was what YOU should have done BEFORE you started the topic.

And you even discounted it as a 'long shot' when I suggested it earlier today BEFORE you checked it.

Your setup is not wrong. It is confusing. You were, yourself, confused as you continued the topic. And it was your own insistance that the setup should work that the obvious was overlooked. But you would probably have discounted it at the start for the reasons already given.

But I am glad that all is sorted out now.

[jagabo]

It's alright saying 'CHECK THE CABLE' with hindsight. Why wasn't that possibility suggested from the outset if it's 'first rule of thumb'. ?

Because it's too obvious.

BTW, s-video carries luma (the grey scale picture) and sync on one wire, chroma (colors) on the other. If the chroma pin was broken you would get a grey scale video.

[orsetto]

Well, whaddaya know ? Turns out the problem was a faulty S-Video cable. Everything working fine now with new S-Video cable even though I was told that my set-up was 'wrong'.

No need to be defensive about your hookup: remember I put the word "wrong" in quotes to indicate my agreement it might work perfectly well for you, despite seeming total bizarro-world to just about anyone else here. To my dying day I will wonder how you can possibly monitor your VHS dubbing operations to the DVD Recorder when you have the TV switched away from the DVD HDMI output and are watching the direct VCR connection instead (any alerts or status indicators or pause/record confirmations from the DVD Recorder should be invisible when you switch the TV to the VCR input). Either you prefer not to see the DVD Recorder status while dubbing, or you have a magical television that overrides your input selection to show only what you need minute by minute.

Anyway, glad you discovered it was a simple case of a bad S-Video cable: replacing it will not disturb your preferred hookup. S-Video and SCART cables are notorious for pin damage if repeatedly plugged in temporary connections.

[Robert the Bruce]

Well, whaddaya know ? Turns out the problem was a faulty S-Video cable. Everything working fine now with new S-Video cable even though I was told that my set-up was 'wrong'.

No need to be defensive about your hookup: remember I put the word "wrong" in quotes to indicate my agreement it might work perfectly well for you, despite seeming total bizarro-world to just about anyone else here. To my dying day I will wonder how you can possibly monitor your VHS dubbing operations to the DVD Recorder when you have the TV switched away from the DVD HDMI output and are watching the direct VCR connection instead (any alerts or status indicators or pause/record confirmations from the DVD Recorder should be invisible when you switch the TV to the VCR input). Either you prefer not to see the DVD Recorder status while dubbing, or you have a magical television that overrides your input selection to show only what you need minute by minute.

Anyway, glad you discovered it was a simple case of a bad S-Video cable: replacing it will not disturb your preferred hookup. S-Video and SCART cables are notorious for pin damage if repeatedly plugged in temporary connections.

My TV and DVD Recorder are linked by an HDMI cable for DVD playback purposes only. My DVD Recorder is linked to my Sat Box (for recording TV shows, etc) by a Scart Cable. I use my TV remote to change to AV-2 to watch video tape, I also have the TV on AV-2 when recording video tape because I can SEE the video footage.

[DB83]

We know what you can see since you have mentioned it more than once.

What you can not see is what we are trying to tell you. I will try once more, although I expect this falls on deaf ears.

During recording ( on the dvd-recorder), the tv should act as a monitor. It should show all appropiate messages for example confimation that recording is actually taking place. Equally important, the picture that is shown on the tv is what is being recorded. What if you inadvertingly forgot to switch to the correct input of the recorder - we can all make that mistake. Result would be recording the WRONG signal. Also the tv picture would IMMEDIATELY have told you something was wrong as the picture would have been in black and white - you would not have had to play back the recording to find that out.

I stil think you are mistakingly thinking that by selecting AV2(or Line2) on the tv you believe that you are actually seeing what the dvd-recorder is seeing. The numbers are the same but the input is different.

I wish I could test this for you bit I have no equipment to plug in to the front AV on my recorder. But the probability is that the hdmi signal from the recorder will take the default incoming signal ie what is plugged in to Line 1. No recorder can display two pictures on one tv but if you phyically turned off the sat box so that no signal goes in to LIne 1 then the hdmi output would then show what is plugged in to Line 2.


The other method would be to use a switched scart adapter with both the sat box and the vcr going in to that with one input going in to Line 1 on the recorder. You then just switch to whichever one you need to use. Mon-swithable ones will not work since they also output the strongest signal or no signal at all if two or more pieces of equipment are turned on at the same time.

[Robert the Bruce]

We know what you can see since you have mentioned it more than once.

What you can not see is what we are trying to tell you. I will try once more, although I expect this falls on deaf ears.

During recording ( on the dvd-recorder), the tv should act as a monitor. It should show all appropiate messages for example confimation that recording is actually taking place. Equally important, the picture that is shown on the tv is what is being recorded. What if you inadvertingly forgot to switch to the correct input of the recorder - we can all make that mistake. Result would be recording the WRONG signal. Also the tv picture would IMMEDIATELY have told you something was wrong as the picture would have been in black and white - you would not have had to play back the recording to find that out.

I stil think you are mistakingly thinking that by selecting AV2(or Line2) on the tv you believe that you are actually seeing what the dvd-recorder is seeing. The numbers are the same but the input is different.

I wish I could test this for you bit I have no equipment to plug in to the front AV on my recorder. But the probability is that the hdmi signal from the recorder will take the default incoming signal ie what is plugged in to Line 1. No recorder can display two pictures on one tv but if you phyically turned off the sat box so that no signal goes in to LIne 1 then the hdmi output would then show what is plugged in to Line 2.


The other method would be to use a switched scart adapter with both the sat box and the vcr going in to that with one input going in to Line 1 on the recorder. You then just switch to whichever one you need to use. Mon-swithable ones will not work since they also output the strongest signal or no signal at all if two or more pieces of equipment are turned on at the same time.

I change the Input on the DVD Recorder from Line 1 to Line 2. Then I change from HDMI-1 to AV-2 using the TV remote. I press play on the VCR and record on the DVD Recorder. The DVD Recorder records the video footage. S-Video cable and red & white phono jacks run from back of VCR to front of DVD Recorder. It works. Sat Box can remain on, doesn't matter.

[DB83]

I.o.o.h

[Robert the Bruce]

[QUOTE=DB83;2198144]I.o.o.h[/QUOTE
What does 'I.o.o.h.' mean ?

[jagabo]

What does 'I.o.o.h.' mean ?

I'm out of here.

[jman98]

Robert the Bruce - I am going to explain your situation to you in a very unusual way because you are currently stuck in a line of thinking where you are completely unable to understand what you are being told. I'm done after this post. If you don't get it after reading what I say, then you are just going to reinforce every negative thought I've ever had about Scotsmen and their intelligence.

Sometimes we get people who post here about problems but what they really want is validation. They don't really want their problem to be solved, although their original post seems to indicate that they do. What happens is that we tell them that we would love to help them but we require more information. Then they post various completely unrelated things and they NEVER post the additional information that is asked for. These people just want someone to pat them on the head and tell them that EVERYTHING they have done is correct, but they have a problem that cannot be solved because the universe is conspiring against them personally to make it fail. You don't seem to be one of those people, but I'm not totally convinced you're not. If you are, then you might as well stop posting as you're not really interested in help.

Assuming you do want help, this is your situation. You are stuck in a forest desperately trying to find your car. The following conversation occurs.
You: I am completely lost and I really need to find my car. Can anyone help me?
Us: You are in luck. We have located you and your car. Your car is 1 kilometer due south of your current location. We verified that you have a working compass. Use your compass to go due south 1 kilometer and you will exit the forest and arrive at your car.
You: How do I find this forest you say I need to leave? All I see around here are trees.
Us: Again, use your compass and go due south. Look for the S on the compass. Walk in a direction so that the S points exactly straight at the top of your compass. Do not deviate from that path and you will leave the forest and find your car.
You: Where is this forest you keep telling me to leave?

I have a serious question for you - are you infallible? If yes, then we're done here. You don't need help.
If no, then why are you refusing to listen to what you are being told? Multiple people have told you that your setup is NOT showing you what you think it is, yet you refuse to listen and you go off about how the satellite hookup doesn't matter and yada yada yada. Do you really want help? If yes, then I would think that you might consider the idea that you could be wrong and you might listen to what you've been told and you might completely redo your connections so that you actually can see what the recorder is seeing. Or you can continue to insist that it doesn't matter at all what you have done and not get help. Believe me, all of us will sleep fine at night if this NEVER works for you because you are too stupid or stubborn to understand what you are being told.

This is your last chance for help here.

[Robert the Bruce]

Robert the Bruce - I am going to explain your situation to you in a very unusual way because you are currently stuck in a line of thinking where you are completely unable to understand what you are being told. I'm done after this post. If you don't get it after reading what I say, then you are just going to reinforce every negative thought I've ever had about Scotsmen and their intelligence.

Sometimes we get people who post here about problems but what they really want is validation. They don't really want their problem to be solved, although their original post seems to indicate that they do. What happens is that we tell them that we would love to help them but we require more information. Then they post various completely unrelated things and they NEVER post the additional information that is asked for. These people just want someone to pat them on the head and tell them that EVERYTHING they have done is correct, but they have a problem that cannot be solved because the universe is conspiring against them personally to make it fail. You don't seem to be one of those people, but I'm not totally convinced you're not. If you are, then you might as well stop posting as you're not really interested in help.

Assuming you do want help, this is your situation. You are stuck in a forest desperately trying to find your car. The following conversation occurs.
You: I am completely lost and I really need to find my car. Can anyone help me?
Us: You are in luck. We have located you and your car. Your car is 1 kilometer due south of your current location. We verified that you have a working compass. Use your compass to go due south 1 kilometer and you will exit the forest and arrive at your car.
You: How do I find this forest you say I need to leave? All I see around here are trees.
Us: Again, use your compass and go due south. Look for the S on the compass. Walk in a direction so that the S points exactly straight at the top of your compass. Do not deviate from that path and you will leave the forest and find your car.
You: Where is this forest you keep telling me to leave?

I have a serious question for you - are you infallible? If yes, then we're done here. You don't need help.
If no, then why are you refusing to listen to what you are being told? Multiple people have told you that your setup is NOT showing you what you think it is, yet you refuse to listen and you go off about how the satellite hookup doesn't matter and yada yada yada. Do you really want help? If yes, then I would think that you might consider the idea that you could be wrong and you might listen to what you've been told and you might completely redo your connections so that you actually can see what the recorder is seeing. Or you can continue to insist that it doesn't matter at all what you have done and not get help. Believe me, all of us will sleep fine at night if this NEVER works for you because you are too stupid or stubborn to understand what you are being told.

This is your last chance for help here.

Un-f***in'-believable. It's YOU who just can't take in what I'm saying. I no longer need your help because everything is now working fine. You just can't seem to understand that what I've described till I'm blue in the face is how my TV Set-Up works, and it does. It's obviously very different to the U.S. system. I've described my system and how it works without a single mistake so that even dumb Americans can (I hoped) understand. You know what ? Just forget it. As for 'Scotsman and their intelligence' obviously you haven't read much history or you would know that among other things it was a Scotsman who invented the Television, Telephone, Radar, Adhesive Postage Stamp, Vacuum Flask, Kerosene, 12 Bore Shotgun, Pneumatic Tyres and many more things. It was also a Scotsman who founded the U.S. Navy and discovered Penicillin. Do some research.
One more thing and for the last time. The very act of changing from Line 1 to Line 2 (on my DVD Recorder) is what enables the DVD Recorder to 'see' and record from the VCR (via a S-Video cable) and by changing from HDMI-1 to AV-2 (using my TV remote) enables ME to 'see' what's being played on the VCR. If I then press 'record' on the DVD Recorder the machine will record what's being played on the VCR. Understand yet ?