Using Compressor 3.0 Pal to Ntsc???

[funkymix]

I am trying to use Compressor 3.0 and convert an avi I have in pal to ntsc and not having much luck?? Any help out there??

thanks..

I have also tried MovieConverter Studio but the resulting file is on like 75 megs... which is smaller than the avi..

thanks again with any input..

Mark

[funkymix]

I just got finished trying Mepg streamclip and it gave me some jerky video..

[guns1inger]

In a Windows environment this would be done by resizing the PAL video to NTSC resolution, encoding it at 25 fps (PAL framerate) then applying pulldown flags to tell the player to play it back as if it were a standard NTSC video at 29.970 fps.

Any good encoder that is not template driven should be able to encode NTSC resolution video at PAL framerates.

DGPulldown is the windows program for applying 25fps -> 29.970 fps pulldown patterns. I do not know of a Mac equivalent program to do this.

[Herve]

I have also tried MovieConverter Studio but the resulting file is on like 75 megs... which is smaller than the avi..

and the quality is? (good/bad/etc)
I'm interested of your answer (thanks to send me a private maessage or mail )

DGPulldown is the windows program for applying 25fps -> 29.970 fps pulldown patterns.

Bad idea if the PAL file is not interlaced: you will just duplicate fields/frames. The best way will be to change speed and to convert it to NTSC Film.
That's the commun way to transcode movies to PAL (so you can do it in the other direction )

PS to funkymix: use the freeware JESDeinterlacer, it will convert your PAL to NTSC
bye

[guns1inger]

Agreed. I was assuming true PAL source, not film or NTSC source converted to PAL.

[manono]

DGPulldown is the windows program for applying 25fps -> 29.970 fps pulldown patterns.

Bad idea if the PAL file is not interlaced: you will just duplicate fields/frames. The best way will be to change speed and to convert it to NTSC Film.

What do you think standard 3:2 pulldown does, but duplicate fields at playback? You can argue that PAL is better/smoother because it doesn't do any field or frame duplication, but I don't see how you can argue that 23.976->29.97fps pulldown is any better than is 25->29.97fps pulldown (except for possible audio high pitch issues with 25->29.97).

What's a bad idea is applying pulldown to an interlaced source, since the output will be a complete mess.

[Herve]

What do you think standard 3:2 pulldown does, but duplicate fields at playback? You can argue that PAL is better/smoother[...]

hello,
I don't argue anything
if the input file (PAL) is progressive, just change speed and let it progressive (and let the DVDPlayer separates and displays 60 fields on the fly).
I don't see any interest to "hardcode" pulldown (it's just a flag=a "how to display it on TV"). HD tv can display 24fps, so keep contents and add a flag.

but I don't see how you can argue that 23.976->29.97fps pulldown is any better than is 25->29.97fps pulldown

(always for progressive PAL):
NTSC FILM to NTSC video is just a flag, PAL to NTSC VIDEO is rarely a flag, it's a "hard" duplication
a flag preserve contents (see my answer above)

What's a bad idea is applying pulldown to an interlaced source, since the output will be a complete mess.

with interlaced file (PAL<->NTSC VIDEO), you just have 2 solutions:
- duplicate 10 fields (from PAL 25fps*2 to NTSC 30*2)
- or interpolate 50fields to 60 (JESdeinterlacer does it very well)
2 different processes depending of input contents.

In french Tv I saw sometimes conversion from NTSC video with duplication (it's not great during travelling)
Interpollation is far smoother, but if you freeze the frame, you will see some ghosts
no solution is perfect

bye

[jagabo]

DGPulldown is the windows program for applying 25fps -> 29.970 fps pulldown patterns.

Bad idea if the PAL file is not interlaced: you will just duplicate fields/frames.

DgPulldown with interlaced PAL would be a disaster. Fields would be displayed in the wrong order. DgPulldown must have progressive frames in order to work properly.

The best way will be to change speed and to convert it to NTSC Film.

And then the DVD player will just duplicate fields. 25 to 29.97 fps with pulldown isn't much different from 23.976 to 29.97 fps with pulldown. Just a slightly different judder. Although I'll grant that some HDTVs may not be able to IVTC the 3:2:3:2:2 pulldown properly.

[manono]

if the input file (PAL) is progressive, just change speed and let it progressive (and let the DVDPlayer separates and displays 60 fields on the fly).

That's one way, but it necessitates reencoding the audio as well. There's nothing really wrong with that, but by applying 25->29.97fps pulldown you don't have to reencode the audio, if it's AC3 already.

I don't see any interest to "hardcode" pulldown (it's just a flag=a "how to display it on TV"). HD tv can display 24fps, so keep contents and add a flag.

No one is hardcoding anything. DGPulldown for 25->29.97fps applies flags that tells the player how to output the required interlaced 29.97fps for NTSC. It's another kind of soft telecine. But I guess that's something else that can't be done in a MAC environment.

NTSC FILM to NTSC video is just a flag, PAL to NTSC VIDEO is rarely a flag, it's a "hard" duplication
a flag preserve contents (see my answer above)

Here it's also just a flag. Just because you don't see this in retail DVDs doesn't make it any less valid.

In french Tv I saw sometimes conversion from NTSC video with duplication (it's not great during travelling)
Interpollation is far smoother, but if you freeze the frame, you will see some ghosts
no solution is perfect

I agree that neither solution is perfect. What you call interpolation is called field blending in the AviSynth world. I hate it so much that I much prefer the field duplication when going from interlaced 25fps to interlaced 29.97fps. Either that or deinterlacing the 25fps source and then applying DGPulldown for 25->29.97fps. Anything to keep from purposely field or frame blending it. That's just a personal preference.

[Herve]

No one is hardcoding anything. DGPulldown for 25->29.97fps applies flags[...]

cool, I didn't know this flag, I will try it, thanks

Just because you don't see this in retail DVDs doesn't make it any less valid.

I don't mind about retail DVD, but I take care about home DVD player compatibility.
I have 4 dvd players at home, no one read 24fps mpeg2 stream (it's a compliant framerate), no one read 1:1 aspect (present in DVD-Video specifications too), etc

Interpollation is far smoother, but if you freeze the frame, you will see some ghosts
no solution is perfect

[...]What you call interpolation is called field blending in the AviSynth world.

No (I dislike field blending too ).
Play with JES for example, frame interpollation takes care of contents and "try" to understand how pixels moved, to determine what should be their place in the intermediate frame (=the interpollation).
The principle is great (it's something like a "neutral net" during analysis to identify the parts that moved).
The result is not perfect (to anlayse the pixels movements you must choose a search radius: but a search radius is good for some slow movements or for speed ones, cannot be perfect for all kind of movement speed )

bye